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SnakeSound222

Traps not going off at all

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On multiple occasions, I have trapped the phone box and 4 seater, only to have the cops called on me or the car fixed. I check the minimap, and my traps haven't went off. Are counselors able to do the combat stance through traps exploit or were my traps disarmed and the map just doesn't show it?

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I've gone to repair the phone or battery a couple of times with a trap present and was sure I'd get trapped but it didn't happen.  I wasn't doing anything in particular, it seemed like I may have just narrowly avoided stepping on it.  I'm not aware of any exploit to avoid them though.

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Sometimes when you hit the prompt to open a door or repair something, you will move right past the trap.  From what I've seen myself, it depends on the trap placement.  

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6 hours ago, Maddogg_8121 said:

Sometimes when you hit the prompt to open a door or repair something, you will move right past the trap.  From what I've seen myself, it depends on the trap placement.  

But wouldn't the trap trigger when they are done repairing? 

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Pretty sure map doesn't show disarmed traps...Don't think it makes any sort of sound for Jason, either.

I've disarmed a lot and never had Jason show up. So that tells me he doesn't know in any way - map or sound.

That's how it should be anyways. Jason has more than enough powers to get the job done.

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18 minutes ago, AldermachXI said:

Pretty sure map doesn't show disarmed traps...Don't think it makes any sort of sound for Jason, either.

I've disarmed a lot and never had Jason show up. So that tells me he doesn't know in any way - map or sound.

That's how it should be anyways. Jason has more than enough powers to get the job done.

So basically the map will still show the trap as armed even if it isn't?

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27 minutes ago, AldermachXI said:

Pretty sure map doesn't show disarmed traps...Don't think it makes any sort of sound for Jason, either.

I've disarmed a lot and never had Jason show up. So that tells me he doesn't know in any way - map or sound.

That's how it should be anyways. Jason has more than enough powers to get the job done.

Not true. I've had Jason's teleport to me from disarming, and I've heard and seen the trap go off after someone has disarmed it as Jason.

Add me on PS4 or PC and we can test it, but I'm 100% positive disarming a trap alerts Jason.

For OP, there is a silly exploit perpetuated by @Pappus where you can use a teammate standing next to the trap, and it'll block you from moving to what you're repairing, allowing you to do it from like 3 feet away.

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On 7/5/2017 at 8:14 PM, SnakeSound222 said:

So basically the map will still show the trap as armed even if it isn't?

Nah, triggered and disarmed traps both have the same icon: the diamond filled in red. You just won't hear traps being disarmed anymore, that was fixed a patch or 2 ago.

For the car battery place it on the right side of the hood and slightly in front of the car.

For the car gas place it slightly in front of the tank.

For the phone place it slightly in front. If double trapping place them both slightly in front and in a row. If it is too far left or right they can ignore the traps.

For the boat on crystal lake that doesn't spawn on the dock place it slightly in front of the propeller.

Never trap a car door, the animation to get in the car completely ignores the trap.

And yes to answer your original post, there are 2 different exploits right now that allow counselors to get past perfectly placed traps. For obvious reasons I won't explain how to do either on this forum..

Edit: Forgot to add that if you place a trap too close to any of the objectives they will not trigger either so be wary of where you are putting them.

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4 minutes ago, Psychosocial23 said:

Nah, triggered and disarmed traps both have the same icon: the diamond filled in red. You just won't hear traps being disarmed anymore, that was fixed a patch or 2 ago.

For the car battery place it on the right side of the hood and slightly in front of the car.

For the car gas place in slightly in front of the tank.

For the phone place it slightly in front. If double trapping place them both slightly in front and in a row. If it is too far left or right they can ignore the traps.

For the boat on crystal lake that doesn't spawn on the dock place it slightly in front of the propeller.

Never trap a car door, the animation to get in the car completely ignored the trap.

And yes to answer your original post, there are 2 different exploits right now that allow counselors to get past perfectly placed traps. For obvious reasons I won't explain how to do either on this forum..

Hmm you sure you don't hear a sound? Was playing Jason last night and still heard a trap being disarmed. Never saw that on any patch notes.

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25 minutes ago, weirdkid5 said:

Hmm you sure you don't hear a sound? Was playing Jason last night and still heard a trap being disarmed. Never saw that on any patch notes.

Yeah i'm sure, I tested it about a week ago it no longer makes a sound when disarmed. I didn't see it in any patch notes either but they definitely fixed it (at least on pc). The only way Jason can hear them being disarmed now is if he is within the vicinity when it happens. 

It used to be that if a trap was disarmed you would only hear the snap rather than a snap and a scream but now you will only hear the snap if you are really far away or will hear the snap and scream if you are within a 1/4-1/2 map distance or so if they step in it.

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1 minute ago, Psychosocial23 said:

Yeah i'm sure, I tested it about a week ago it no longer makes a sound when disarmed. I didn't see it in any patch notes either but they definitely fixed it (at least on pc). The only way Jason can hear them being disarmed now is if he is within the vicinity when it happens. 

It used to be that if a trap was disarmed you would only hear the snap rather than a snap and a scream but now you will only hear the snap if you are really far away or will hear the snap and scream if you are within a 1/4-1/2 map distance or so if they step in it.

I think we ought to go into a match and test this, it definitely sounds like a good balance change but I wanna confirm this is the case. Would you mind adding me so we can test this?

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14 minutes ago, weirdkid5 said:

I think we ought to go into a match and test this, it definitely sounds like a good balance change but I wanna confirm this is the case. Would you mind adding me so we can test this?

Sure thing, I sent you a pm with my contact info. You can post the results here when we are finished.

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31 minutes ago, Psychosocial23 said:

Sure thing, I sent you a pm with my contact info. You can post the results here when we are finished.

Sounds good. I'll be home from work soon enough. This is definitely worth finding out.

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Two things.

1. If you place traps too close to the object, counselors can fix the thing without stepping in it, as their feet don't touch it when they kneel down. Place traps say one Jason's foot distance away from the thing to ensure that they have to step in it.

2. There is this thing called "body blocking" where if a counselor stands in front of a trap, and the other puts the item in the thing, the first counselor that is in between the other counselor and the trap will "block" that counselor from stepping in the trap. What it looks like is the person is putting the item into thin air next to it. That's an exploit that needs to be fixed.

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10 minutes ago, VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow said:

Two things.

1. If you place traps too close to the object, counselors can fix the thing without stepping in it, as their feet don't touch it when they kneel down. Place traps say one Jason's foot distance away from the thing to ensure that they have to step in it.

2. There is this thing called "body blocking" where if a counselor stands in front of a trap, and the other puts the item in the thing, the first counselor that is in between the other counselor and the trap will "block" that counselor from stepping in the trap. What it looks like is the person is putting the item into thin air next to it. That's an exploit that needs to be fixed.

Nah according to @Pappus #2 legit tech that should be freely used by skilled Counselors ;)

/sarcasm

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12 minutes ago, VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow said:

There is this thing called "body blocking" where if a counselor stands in front of a trap, and the other puts the item in the thing, the first counselor that is in between the other counselor and the trap will "block" that counselor from stepping in the trap. What it looks like is the person is putting the item into thin air next to it. That's an exploit that needs to be fixed.

Yep. Had a match where another counselor asked me to help him do this. I didn't even know this was possible. I was wondering too how counselors were not triggering or disarming the phone traps but still making the call. I put 3 down in a triangle shape around it. Was a little pissed when I found out this exploit and I agree needs to be fixed.

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2 hours ago, weirdkid5 said:

Nah according to @Pappus #2 legit tech that should be freely used by skilled Counselors ;)

/sarcasm

If at some point you reach my level of understanding about games your perception of what is an exploit and what not will change.

 

Tech has counter-play. You can protect yourself against bodyblocking traps in more than one way.

 

Labeling everything inconvenient as an exploit is only for weak players. Strong players find the solution to the new problem.

 

With your line of thinking you can brand everything an exploit: Cancelling stand-up animation as jason? Exploit since clearly you are supposed to stand up. Cancelling actions? Exploit. Exploit here, exploit there. When people like you are done with any given game you have two ppl hitting each other with a stick. Fun times.

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There is a world of difference between degenerative map exploits (getting onto the Packanack Lodge roof or going out-of-bounds behind the boat exit) and things like using positioning to evade traps or blocking flares.

The former requires a willful malice on the part of players to operate outside of the game's basic logic and geography, so that the game cannot proceed toward a legitimate win condition for either side.

The latter makes it incumbent upon the player to basically act in a way that is counter to their own best interests. For example: If I'm playing Jason and I'm walking forward in combat stance and blocking (which is just common sense at this point), what should I do when I see someone drop a firecracker? Should I drop my block and take the hit? Why on earth would I do that? And if I'm blocking and someone shoots me with a flare, am I exploiting? No, I am simply blocking. I am taking a normal action that is available to me, that another piece of the game is not interacting with as-intended. Although they are slightly more "gray," I believe that stuff like trap bypassing, animation cancels, etc. fall much closer to this side of the fence than the other. I also rightly expect it to be patched, but it is borderline malicious to punish players in the interim, since it does not bring the flow of the game to an outright halt, and still prompts healthy counterplay. I'll remind you that Street Fighter II's combo system was also a programming glitch, originally. :P

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1 hour ago, Pappus said:

If at some point you reach my level of understanding about games your perception of what is an exploit and what not will change.

 

Tech has counter-play. You can protect yourself against bodyblocking traps in more than one way.

 

Labeling everything inconvenient as an exploit is only for weak players. Strong players find the solution to the new problem.

 

With your line of thinking you can brand everything an exploit: Cancelling stand-up animation as jason? Exploit since clearly you are supposed to stand up. Cancelling actions? Exploit. Exploit here, exploit there. When people like you are done with any given game you have two ppl hitting each other with a stick. Fun times.

Yes, they are all technically exploits that I'm sure will get patched in time. Sorry that you need to do things that give you a slight advantage in order to win that aren't intended and clearly bypassing intended aspects. And don't throw out a subtle insult like your understanding of games is higher than mine. Trust me, I'm a fighting game player. Your tech in For Honor was great, remember from the DbD forums? I will say you are a great Raider with great tech and helped me out with many things. However, this is where I respectfully disagree. I understand the need to utilize things that are questionable in things like fighting game tourneys. Example, Melee and things like Wavedashing. These things are need to win in high level, but I still see them as cheap because it isn't intended, as was seen in later Smash games. I can't deny Melee is awesome for being high paced. 

This is not a super competitive game however. So these things are unessecary. Giving Jason crutch exploits isn't needed since he's already strong.

1 hour ago, Rydog said:

There is a world of difference between degenerative map exploits (getting onto the Packanack Lodge roof or going out-of-bounds behind the boat exit) and things like using positioning to evade traps or blocking flares.

The former requires a willful malice on the part of players to operate outside of the game's basic logic and geography, so that the game cannot proceed toward a legitimate win condition for either side.

The latter makes it incumbent upon the player to basically act in a way that is counter to their own best interests. For example: If I'm playing Jason and I'm walking forward in combat stance and blocking (which is just common sense at this point), what should I do when I see someone drop a firecracker? Should I drop my block and take the hit? Why on earth would I do that? And if I'm blocking and someone shoots me with a flare, am I exploiting? No, I am simply blocking. I am taking a normal action that is available to me, that another piece of the game is not interacting with as-intended. Although they are slightly more "gray," I believe that stuff like trap bypassing, animation cancels, etc. fall much closer to this side of the fence than the other. I also rightly expect it to be patched, but it is borderline malicious to punish players in the interim, since it does not bring the flow of the game to an outright halt, and still prompts healthy counterplay. I'll remind you that Street Fighter II's combo system was also a programming glitch, originally. :P

Blocking firecrackers and things like bear traps are exploits and, in my honest opinion, are signs of a weak player, because you need to utilize exploits to your advantage to win. I never said anyone who uses these things should be punished, that's kinda not at all what I said. I just said it's weak to do.

Combos in SF were eventually taken as part of the game, because it promoted better flow and the devs agreed with it. Things like blocking firecrackers and the like bypass things and make certain items completely useless, may as well remove them from the game altogether. It's broken, it doesn't promote a mindful gameplay, and all it really does is give Jason bigger advantages he doesn't really need. Mind you, I'm looking at this stuff from a Jason point of view, not a Counselor PoV. I don't need to use these tactics to get 8/8s and it just makes me giggle that "good" players are the ones that bypass how the game is intended to play in order to win, no matter what fashion it is in.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this. I'm not too sure what the devs stance on blocking things you shouldn't be able to block is, but the only thing I think makes sense is Flares. Either way, until they officially say what these things are, I'm gonna continue to see them as exploits used by players that need an extra boost to win.

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On 7/6/2017 at 4:07 AM, Pappus said:

I fail to see how anyone with a fighting game background would be unable the harsh truth: Jason is a big joke.

So let us spin this further: Devs remove the cancelling of the standup animation with morph/shift what do you think will happen here:

Is that now an exploit too? Taking advantage of an animation? You are a fighting game player so hitbox manipulation is the bread and butter of high level play. Crouch punching stuff to get your hitbox in a different spot to dodge shouldn't be news to you.

Are traps at objectives exploits per se? Because obviously their design intend is not to lock down all objectives. It does not matter if this game is designed casual or not. That has no bearing on how people play it. People play a game how they want to play and the less tech a game offers the more boring it becomes.

This Jason is so weak that he will not be patched into balance even a year from now. These devs also refuse to be assisted by people that single handedly have more knowledge of games t han their entire studio.

Even if you come from the raider guide you could questoin. Doublehit combo on exhausted opponent? Clearly not intended, still works. Probably still works today. Some things are as they are and you either embrace them or you play pong.

You wanted to bring up game knowledge, so I'm just letting you know I also look at things from a technical point of view. And yes, I agree, ganging up on Jason makes him laughable. There are certain areas he needs to be adjusted perhaps.

And yes, I think that bear trap nonsense you shared is silly and should also be removed. This is not a fighting game, and I'm pretty sure I tried to make that clear in my last post. Things like hitbox manipulation, animation bypassing, animation cancelling, etc are unneeded in this game. It is not a fighting game, thus, these things are exploiting the intended mechanics of the game. They could fix the bear trap nonsense by having them destroyed in 2 uses. This is just trolling and grieving.

And traps on objectives are fine, because the devs talked about that prior to the game coming out. They said it was ok, so I'm ok with it as well. I can find you the post if need be.

Jason can be overwhelmed in certain situations, but he shouldn't ever be able to be infinitely chained in some fashion. That defeats the entire purpose of the game, and I agree, the devs should definitely fix these aspects about him.

And For Honor is a fighting game for sure, so this kind of high level tech knowledge is needed in order to win. It shouldn't be in Friday. I'm not sure if double hit on exhausted opponents is still possible, but I never saw it as an exploit per se. These things are embraced by the FGC. As you said, fighting games are all about utilizing animations, combos, and cancelling to win. But this isn't that, so they shouldn't be compared and things like these exploits should be changed.

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7 minutes ago, weirdkid5 said:

.

And yet F13 is a fighting game too. It might be crude, but that doesnt matter especially when you look at party games that became fighting games after ;)

So what else do you want to take away from F13 combat then? Spacing is part of it, timing, invul frames. You want to forego everything you know about that and just run into Jasons face, because this isnt "a fighting game"? Hitbox manipulation is utilized aswell.

Maybe this will open your eyes on what shakey grounds your argument stands. People engage in combat in f13 and wether it was designed as last resort or a full fledge fighting game has no bearing on it. If they want to remove the fighting aspect all they need to do is remove councellor weapons and even then it is still fighting, just without weapons. Fighting for survival with whatever techniques you feel fit.

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1 hour ago, Pappus said:

And yet F13 is a fighting game too. It might be crude, but that doesnt matter especially when you look at party games that became fighting games after ;)

So what else do you want to take away from F13 combat then? Spacing is part of it, timing, invul frames. You want to forego everything you know about that and just run into Jasons face, because this isnt "a fighting game"? Hitbox manipulation is utilized aswell.

Maybe this will open your eyes on what shakey grounds your argument stands. People engage in combat in f13 and wether it was designed as last resort or a full fledge fighting game has no bearing on it. If they want to remove the fighting aspect all they need to do is remove councellor weapons and even then it is still fighting, just without weapons. Fighting for survival with whatever techniques you feel fit.

Fighting in the game is just fine, but the fact that you see exploits as a part of that basic gameplay is where we disagree. You are construing my argument into something way more than it is. Cancelling animations, or keeping Jason stun locked in ways that aren't counselors timing well aimed hits, ala that Bear trap silliness you shared, or manipulating hitboxes in order to avoid things like bear traps on objectives are all I'm speaking about. These are things that need adjusting, and as far as Jason having a struggle in a group fight, I never said to take away options Counselors have. I simply think Jason shouldn't be stunned locked because that shit never happened in the movies, this game is supposed to emulate them. So, in order to fit that vision, things like the things we are talking about should be adjusted.

Clearly we just disagree on this, but as with all the games you stream, I'm sure you'll move on to the next big game once this one has lost popularity and you won't have to worry about these issues. These things are bad for the overall health and casual mood this game is supposed to perpetuate. You can play however you want, just like I'll be free to perform just as well as I normally do without needing little shenanigans to give me that extra edge to win, on either Counselor or Jason.

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19 hours ago, SnakeSound222 said:

On multiple occasions, I have trapped the phone box and 4 seater, only to have the cops called on me or the car fixed. I check the minimap, and my traps haven't went off. Are counselors able to do the combat stance through traps exploit or were my traps disarmed and the map just doesn't show it?

There is a trick to it. If you have 2 counselors at the objective, you can have one stand next to the trap. The other one who will actually complete the objective can stand next to the first counselor and hit the button prompt. Now instead of being slid over on to the trap, you fix the objective from that location, because the first counselor stops you from sliding into the trap. Now you can do every objective without setting off any traps.

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if you want to post exploits in a manner consistent with reporting that is fine but do not just post off the sake of posting exploits. Yes they exist, we do not need to advertise the exploit. 

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Here are the results of mine and @Psychosocial23 test on the Bear Trap disarm noise! Turns out, indeed, if Jason is far enough away and you disarm the trap, there will be NO noise for Jason to hear. If they step in it, then you can hear it. Being too far away means not hearing the disarm noise. You can see one of the traps gets activated but no noise plays until the second one goes off. Very good knowledge. Disarming traps is extremely viable. I'm not sure if this is the case on PS4, haven't tested it there. This is strictly PC. @Rydog not sure if this is in your guide, but it should be. @Pappus not sure if you knew about this either.

Here's the clip: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/158001186

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