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HodderFodder

Getting really sick of being stunlocked

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A ton of great advice in this thread.  Also, I recommend locating Kodiak's guide that's posted just a little ways down on this forum.  It has a TON of excellent tips and tricks for effective playing.  You'll have that machete dripping in counselor blood in no time!

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I did absolutely everything everyone said to do, and I still was kept on the ground. I did nothing but swing, I used combat stance/block, knives, I shifted and came at them from different angles, nothing worked.

One while only two engaged, staying on opposite sides of me so that if I turned to attack one, the other hit me in the back. Combat stance did nothing to that. When one got injured, they'd back out, medspray, while one of the waiting ones came in. The rest scattered to fix the phone I was defending/get more supplies. And did you know you can get stunned by a flare to the back?

It's also rather hard to practice when I've played 12-15 games today alone and was Jason only once.

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Sorry you are having such a frustrating time!

I think best way to practice is to find one or two buddies and start a private match. This way the victims can try different weapons on Jason, you can all try combat stance and melee attacks and blocking, Jason can practice using throwing knives, victims can heal up with med sprays so that you can practice more, you can practice the shift/grab, you can learn how to best smash open doors, and so on.

I have only had a chance to do this once but was mostly introducing a pal to the game. I need to improve all around as Jason (and my combat dodges as counsellors) so I will be asking a few friends into a couple private matches to do just this. 

Beats having to wait until the game randomly selects me to be Jason. It's difficult to practice under pressure. 

A way to fix the stun spamming by a large group would be for the devs to implement a fix so that Jason can only be stunned like three consecutive times and then he can take a few stun hits with no effect. Don't know if that's really fair though.

I think mostly it's about playing Jason as a fear inducing monster. Cut the power everywhere, smash the windows, trap the means of escape, make them panic. Don't let them arm themselves while you just run around and chase them. Use the environment against them.

I've got a long way to go to be great as Jason, but reading these forums has taught me a lot.

 

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I haven't been killed yet as Jason, but I've made a thread about this too.

I've been on both ends of the gang bang assault of counselors at times. I've wiped them, gotten the last couple so mad they suicided to avoid me killing them. I've been gang assaulted so some people could escape with a car. I've had people try to kill me, all you have to do is kill Tommy or sweater girl and they ain't got shit.

I think the main problem is certain perks allows the counselors way too much tanking ability when Jason IS THE FUCKING MURDERER.

Think of it this way. Jason should be stunnable yes, but when he's the hulking murderer, when he swings his weapon, he should be making counselors limp immediately. Yes counselors should have the option to fight Jason, but right now there is no downside if you have the right perks and work together. As it is now, if the counselors have the right perks, Jason can be stunned MUCH EASIER than counselors can be made to limp or die. Its that simple.

Also the combat stance mentioned in this thread is a valid form of countering the gang assaults. The only problem is Jason is much slower using his weapon in combat than out, but the trade off is better resistance.

That's why when people want nerfs to shift or grab, I kinda have to laugh really. Undead Jasons would become unplayable all together for one. Two, when the counselors have every way in the world to stun Jason and for some reason, have superior stunning ability in groups versus Jason's ability to effectively weaken the counselors. It would be a huge mistake.

I do think a one time or two time only multiple kill option for Jason should be something the devs should consider down the line. It would make fighting Jason a lot more risk/reward than it already is. If he can kill two or three or four counselors with a one or two shot stroke. The gang assaults would cool down a lot I believe. Sure pubstars will still try it, but whatever.

That might be too strong. Other options include making windows, knives and Jason's weapon strength all make counselors limp any time you go through a broken window, are hit with a knife or slashed by a weapon. As more and more counselors get the best perks, in particular tanking perks, upping the damage they take is one of the simpliest ways to curve the gang stun approach.

Two first aid uses per spray, increased healing,  25 percent chance or more to stun Jason every time, longer radius fire works,...yeah...there are options ahead.

 

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On 6.6.2017 at 0:16 AM, HodderFodder said:

The last three games of Jason I've played, I get stuck where a pack of 3-4 players just surround me and keep me down. As soon as I unlock, I start swinging, I ht one person--and then someone else gets me down. Someone drops a med spray and heals the person I injured. Grabbing is not going to work either. I make space, try to use throwing knives, and either I miss or I eat a flare gun. The last game had inordinately long stuns, so they must've been armed wtih serious perks.

How the hell do you fight a group of counselors who are coordinated, well equipped and know what they're doing?

One game, players had dropped all their unused items at the police exit before leaving, so there was a pile of flare guns, med sprays and weapons, and the group just kept me down and taunted me. This game I tried using Jason 3, because of his high weapon damage and ability to run, but J3 also has weak stun resistance, so I was really taking it the entire session.

It's goddamn humiliating and I have no idea how to deal with this.

I have no words for this

wheeze.jpg

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21 minutes ago, tyrant666 said:

I haven't been killed yet as Jason, but I've made a thread about this too.

I've been on both ends of the gang bang assault of counselors at times. I've wiped them, gotten the last couple so mad they suicided to avoid me killing them. I've been gang assaulted so some people could escape with a car. I've had people try to kill me, all you have to do is kill Tommy or sweater girl and they ain't got shit.

I think the main problem is certain perks allows the counselors way too much tanking ability when Jason IS THE FUCKING MURDERER.

Think of it this way. Jason should be stunnable yes, but when he's the hulking murderer, when he swings his weapon, he should be making counselors limp immediately. Yes counselors should have the option to fight Jason, but right now there is no downside if you have the right perks and work together. As it is now, if the counselors have the right perks, Jason can be stunned MUCH EASIER than counselors can be made to limp or die. Its that simple.

Also the combat stance mentioned in this thread is a valid form of countering the gang assaults. The only problem is Jason is much slower using his weapon in combat than out, but the trade off is better resistance.

That's why when people want nerfs to shift or grab, I kinda have to laugh really. Undead Jasons would become unplayable all together for one. Two, when the counselors have every way in the world to stun Jason and for some reason, have superior stunning ability in groups versus Jason's ability to effectively weaken the counselors. It would be a huge mistake.

I do think a one time or two time only multiple kill option for Jason should be something the devs should consider down the line. It would make fighting Jason a lot more risk/reward than it already is. If he can kill two or three or four counselors with a one or two shot stroke. The gang assaults would cool down a lot I believe. Sure pubstars will still try it, but whatever.

That might be too strong. Other options include making windows, knives and Jason's weapon strength all make counselors limp any time you go through a broken window, are hit with a knife or slashed by a weapon. As more and more counselors get the best perks, in particular tanking perks, upping the damage they take is one of the simpliest ways to curve the gang stun approach.

Two first aid uses per spray, increased healing,  25 percent chance or more to stun Jason every time, longer radius fire works,...yeah...there are options ahead.

Yes. I agree that counsellors should limp after ONE hit by a slash attack or a throwing knife. Dead after two. And I play counsellors mostly. The last thing I wanna see is Jason being beaten like a little bitch by a group of teens who are SUPPOSED to be afraid of him. I have no interest in being a part of that. Getting lucky to stun him is one thing, but if people wanna group together to do him serious damage it should be by having to follow all the steps it takes to "kill" him. 

I also agree that the broken windows should do more damage. Some of the offensive perks really are OP. The victims should have far more defensive perks.

In the second film Ginny has a chainsaw at one point and Jason shits a kitten and backs off...that would be a neat weapon to incorporate, but have only one per level and make it have very limited use. That way if a group wanted to escape together and one of them had the chainsaw then Jason would have to be careful as that person would be a real danger. Maybe only a counsellor with the chainsaw perk could use it? I don't know...  

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12 hours ago, HodderFodder said:

I did absolutely everything everyone said to do, and I still was kept on the ground. I did nothing but swing, I used combat stance/block, knives, I shifted and came at them from different angles, nothing worked.

One while only two engaged, staying on opposite sides of me so that if I turned to attack one, the other hit me in the back. Combat stance did nothing to that. When one got injured, they'd back out, medspray, while one of the waiting ones came in. The rest scattered to fix the phone I was defending/get more supplies. And did you know you can get stunned by a flare to the back?

It's also rather hard to practice when I've played 12-15 games today alone and was Jason only once.

Let me guess.  You did all of this while the counselors were already aware of your presence and basically "fought" them?

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14 hours ago, HodderFodder said:

I did absolutely everything everyone said to do, and I still was kept on the ground. I did nothing but swing, I used combat stance/block, knives, I shifted and came at them from different angles, nothing worked.

One while only two engaged, staying on opposite sides of me so that if I turned to attack one, the other hit me in the back. Combat stance did nothing to that. When one got injured, they'd back out, medspray, while one of the waiting ones came in. The rest scattered to fix the phone I was defending/get more supplies. And did you know you can get stunned by a flare to the back?

It's also rather hard to practice when I've played 12-15 games today alone and was Jason only once.

Try to act fast.... before they find sprays, for example. The problem is that you seems to be caught by players already prepared. Take them before this.
Morph at the very beginning, trying to kill a counselour at start... Morph to houses next to the cars.... Break electrical boxes to inflict fear.
After that, take any knife you can.... but first, concentrate your efforts to take down one or 2 counselors at the beginning.

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When you get an organized group of players doing this it is really hard to deal with. 

Teamwork should help their odds, but the stun lock attacking is frustrating.

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6 hours ago, munkt0r said:

Let me guess.  You did all of this while the counselors were already aware of your presence and basically "fought" them?

When you're surrounded by counselors they usually do know you're there.

I went to check on the phone and morphed about a dozen yards in front of a crowd of 3-4 who were running to the phone. I attempted to throw a knife and ate a flare.

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5 hours ago, bobmussini said:

Try to act fast.... before they find sprays, for example. The problem is that you seems to be caught by players already prepared. Take them before this.
Morph at the very beginning, trying to kill a counselour at start... Morph to houses next to the cars.... Break electrical boxes to inflict fear.
After that, take any knife you can.... but first, concentrate your efforts to take down one or 2 counselors at the beginning.

Do you think I don't know this? Do you think I am not trying my hardest to kill every one of them as fast as I can?

I am not a good Jason, period. Even when I don't get ganged up on, I do not manage to kill a lot of people. I need to accept that my level of ability just is not high enough to deal with a crowd, and the next time it happens, I get out of there and look for single targets. Just write the losses off. 

 

.

 

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5 minutes ago, HodderFodder said:

When you're surrounded by counselors they usually do know you're there.

I went to check on the phone and morphed about a dozen yards in front of a crowd of 3-4 who were running to the phone. I attempted to throw a knife and ate a flare.

To be honest, fair enough.  If you think it's a broken mechanic and needs fixing, I won't argue further.  I'm pretty sure the devs have seen enough posts from people who don't struggle with this to recognize the reality of the issue.

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Could anyone tell me if, as Jason, you get some bonus on attack after a successful block, Like maybe quicker attack?

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9 hours ago, JohnnyKapow said:

Yes. I agree that counsellors should limp after ONE hit by a slash attack or a throwing knife. Dead after two. And I play counsellors mostly. The last thing I wanna see is Jason being beaten like a little bitch by a group of teens who are SUPPOSED to be afraid of him. I have no interest in being a part of that. Getting lucky to stun him is one thing, but if people wanna group together to do him serious damage it should be by having to follow all the steps it takes to "kill" him. 

I also agree that the broken windows should do more damage. Some of the offensive perks really are OP. The victims should have far more defensive perks.

In the second film Ginny has a chainsaw at one point and Jason shits a kitten and backs off...that would be a neat weapon to incorporate, but have only one per level and make it have very limited use. That way if a group wanted to escape together and one of them had the chainsaw then Jason would have to be careful as that person would be a real danger. Maybe only a counsellor with the chainsaw perk could use it? I don't know...  

As well as limited use, maybe have the chainsaw require gas, so you have the choice between the chainsaw or car/boat.

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16 minutes ago, Willie said:

Could anyone tell me if, as Jason, you get some bonus on attack after a successful block, Like maybe quicker attack?

Not that I know of, but when in combat mode your attacks are different than when you're not.

For example, with spear Jason he normally slashes with his spear and it's quite slow.  If you change to combat mode, he "stabs/pokes" with his spear and it's a much quicker animation with longer range.

In testing with it, no counselor can get in a retaliation attack or get inside my range without taking a poke to the belly.

To clarify, when I say testing I mean that I have 2 ps4's and 2 tv's and I run a private match with just 2 people to test various mechanics.

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55 minutes ago, rustypouch said:

As well as limited use, maybe have the chainsaw require gas, so you have the choice between the chainsaw or car/boat.

Great idea. 

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Thing thread was perfect for my daily lulz...Thanks, you guys. :P

If you think this is actually a problem, just don't play as Jason. You're clearly out of your depth.

I had a group try this last night. They stunned me 3 times in a row...they all died soon after. Shift, Isolate, Swing - Don't grab. You'll be fine.

Jason isn't gonna get any buffs. You can bet on that.

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On 6/5/2017 at 5:58 PM, Nomadder said:

(maybe less flares/fireworks/pocketknives)).

You're throwing the baby out with the bath water here. Pocket knives have already been reduced since beta days, and they still haven't fixed up the grab / combat system so it actually works properly.  We do not need to be balancing item rates until the various combat subsystems have been completed, otherwise we will face even larger issues later.

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17 minutes ago, nax said:

You're throwing the baby out with the bath water here. Pocket knives have already been reduced since beta days, and they still haven't fixed up the grab / combat system so it actually works properly.  We do not need to be balancing item rates until the various combat subsystems have been completed, otherwise we will face even larger issues later.

I'm definitely not campaigning for any of the changes I mentioned there. Just, in my early observations so far, I think the post-beta flare guns and fireworks have added possibly too many chances to stun and disrupt Jason. However, yeah, I'm not in favor of any quick knee-jerk reactions. I offered that all up more in counter to all the cries I keep seeing about reducing this and that for Jason to help people survive more.

I feel as though the balance must be pretty damn good though, since we're seeing the expected cries about Jason being OP and a little bit of commentary on maybe adjusting it so Jason is more powerful (or the counselors a little less). :D 

Although, I'm not sure what you're referring to by saying that the grab combat system is not working properly.

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12 hours ago, tyrant666 said:

I've been on both ends of the gang bang assault of counselors at times.

*snicker*

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I wreck counselors pretty consistently.  They cannot handle my killyness.

The key to beng Jason is eliminate methods of escape and be patient.

If a group wants to fight you, find a different way to move forward.  Flank them, stalk and hide if you have to, but don't let them fight you.  If they're the only ones left, and you've eliminated their means of escape, let them break their weapons and use their pocket knives on you...they'll run out of those options soon enough.

BE PATIENT.

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On 6/5/2017 at 6:20 PM, HodderFodder said:

I addressed this in the OP: I ht one person--and then someone else gets me down. Someone drops a med spray and heals the person I injured. I idid nothing but swing for 3 "rounds" fo stuns and it got me nowhere.

Be patient. They can die; for the most part you can't. They only have so many health sprays. Morph or shift to get out of there, or simply wait until they've exhausted their options. You'll eventually get the upper hand on them. 

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Yeah rope a dope like Muhammad Ali. Did this tactic just a few minutes ago I only spawned to two locations on crystal lake map, the phone to trap it, coincidentally found my first victim there a Vanessa who either started with the shotgun, or somehow managed to grab one in the first 20 seconds of the match, but no worries... She turned to aim but didn't have time for much else except getting her head punched off.

Then off to trap the car. Morph there and boom the rest of the piggies gathered en masse. They were in the vicinity gathering supplies ect, I target an AJ, she fire crackers me. I recover, she knifes me when I grab her. I recover. Knock her block off. Guy triggers trap I placed on car. He manages to get in a cabin before I get there via shift. I destroy all windows and leave one hit apiece on the main doors, kill the power so I can track him by light coming from his flashlight. Then 4 more come to his rescue/half sneakily try to put the gas and battery in the car. I abandon the cabin and shift to the car when I hear my trap trigger. The next bit was spent chasing a troll and then another around the car playing footsie till the backup all arrived. One other disappeared from the area. As only 4 were left trying to stunlock me and get the car rolling. In all I was stunned 5 times in a row ate 2 flares and got tea bagged once. I focused on the tea bagger till I heard another trap spring. Whap got the Adam trying to gas it up off with his head as I needed my fastest kill so he didn't get knocked free. I got stunned again, chased down buggsy and punched his heart out. They got the car repaired I get in front and Kenny stuns me. They put in reverse but its near the water so they don't go far. Kenny gets in the three try to leave. I stop them. Pull the driver, head punch. Dead, kill the tea bagging Vanessa. Heart rip. Ugh Kenny tried running away then coming back, I crush his head. Then the last one tries to hoof it back to the car I spent my last traps on (I love part 2 Jason for organized groups) but the trap caught her and well that was it never even activated the stalk ability until right as I killed the last counselor. I love a good challenge and I certainly had my work cut out on that group. The only problem is Ive dealt with crowd control before they hit each other a few times and dealt damage to each other in the fray. They had health spray but I would chase, shift and swing, swing chase shift and swing more when they surrounded me. They all got lucky spawning near each other near the car and had all the parts right to begin with but the part 2 Jason had enough traps to keep them tied up long enough to ensure my win. I highly doubt it would have gone in my favor that time had I chosen my usual go to of Savini Jason, or part 3 Jason.

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Jason has currently no reliable way of handling multiple good opponents without losing his mask.

Your best bet against a coordinated group is to kill 2 newbies first so jarvis lands on that and single out the female characters. The shit posted in here is meaningless low lvl stuff.

I mean I don't know how good you are talking about, but if we are talking 3 really good councellors then you are in mortal danger and should do ranged combat and force the healing sprays out slowly but certainly, but even that they will rush you down to trade for hits. 2 of them will be absolutely fine with dieing to fuel the Jarvis spawn after all. Most likely the bugzys that will claim your mask in 2 machette hits.

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29 minutes ago, HaHaTrumpWon said:

So instead of giving constructive criticism to an obviously inexperienced player, you guys decided to [Omitted by mods - Insults]

It’s not smart to underestimate Jason anyway.

I’m a notorious slow starter as Jason myself. I don’t go after anyone for several minutes. In fact, if there’s something I want to do, I let those I see live, especially if they spawn at the phone box cabin. It’s just... not fair.

Difference here is that I DO set my traps and knock out the power. It’s actually easier for me to go 7/7 if I do this work first. 

Assuming that Jason doesn’t know what he’s doing is a bad call. My situation was different, but had I not known an effective way to play Jason, the same would’ve happened to me. People are lame.

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