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bocchiere

Change to make the grab less of an instant kill.

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3 hours ago, JPops said:

Here is my 2 cents on this discussion. I personally believe it's balanced and not a problem. I think people just want to run wild without consequences. There are consequences for your actions make wise decisions. If you are going to run in a straight line and be out in the wilderness well that is kind of dangerous. Limit your outside time as best you can. Have I been installed grabbed sure, it happens, made an error and was dead out in the open. Try ducking Into some cabins, do not run in one direction, make Jason work for it. 

This game comes at a learning curve but I am pretty confident as time passes players will be better and you will stand a better chance at surviving the night.

If he's grabs you and you aren't prepared well you kind of have it coming.

Then why even have a break free system?

If we have it coming, then why not give Jason all the time in the world to get an environment kill.
Only escaping if we have a pocket knife or a friend that is on the correct side of Jason with good timing.

 

 

I really like the idea of a different QTE, because any QTE that relies on bashing a button is bad design in my opinion.
Not everyone can bash that button at the same speed, and that has nothing to do with skill.

I don't want to make it too easy for the counsellors though and the proposed new QTE seems a bit too easy.

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1 minute ago, Ryve said:

Then why even have a break free system?

If we have it coming, then why not give Jason all the time in the world to get an environment kill.
Only escaping if we have a pocket knife or a friend that is on the correct side of Jason with good timing.

 

 

I really like the idea of a different QTE, because any QTE that relies on bashing a button is bad design in my opinion.
Not everyone can bash that button at the same speed, and that has nothing to do with skill.

I don't want to make it too easy for the counsellors though and the proposed new QTE seems a bit too easy.

I'm also concerned about people getting turbo controllers and becoming impossible to kill via grab. 

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1 minute ago, bocchiere said:

I'm also concerned about people getting turbo controllers and becoming impossible to kill via grab. 

This, very much this.

Just get all characters that have high composure with break free perk and then this.
I don't even need a turbo controller, I can program that on my keyboard.

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58 minutes ago, bocchiere said:

Well balance is still important. It was marketed as a multiplayer video game not a movie simulator. I totally agree Jason should be strong and I've seen the entire series of films. I guess my point is we should not just dismiss all concerns regarding balance out of hand. 

Trust me I'm not trying to be a dick to you or anyone with a different opinion, I just strongly feel that nerfing Jason would cause the momentum of the game to slow down way too much. And bro it's a Friday the 13th game....which basically makes it a movie simulator. That's what I wanted, a game close to the films as possible and if you read the developers and game creators they say just that...they wanted to put us in the films through this game. 

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12 minutes ago, ConGamePro said:

Trust me I'm not trying to be a dick to you or anyone with a different opinion, I just strongly feel that nerfing Jason would cause the momentum of the game to slow down way too much. And bro it's a Friday the 13th game....which basically makes it a movie simulator. That's what I wanted, a game close to the films as possible and if you read the developers and game creators they say just that...they wanted to put us in the films through this game. 

That means creating the same feeling and environment. That's not what this discussion is about.

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3 hours ago, JPops said:

Here is my 2 cents on this discussion. I personally believe it's balanced and not a problem. I think people just want to run wild without consequences. There are consequences for your actions make wise decisions. If you are going to run in a straight line and be out in the wilderness well that is kind of dangerous. Limit your outside time as best you can. Have I been installed grabbed sure, it happens, made an error and was dead out in the open. Try ducking Into some cabins, do not run in one direction, make Jason work for it. 

This game comes at a learning curve but I am pretty confident as time passes players will be better and you will stand a better chance at surviving the night.

If he's grabs you and you aren't prepared well you kind of have it coming.

I agree with all of this.

It's also not as easy to shift-grab as people as it may seem at first. Turn your camera so you are facing Jason, and use your minimap. When you see him disappear from the shift, start juking around. This will work almost every time until you run out of stamina.

I feel that if I could get out of Jason's grabs right now without an item that he would very rarely be able to kill me. As it is now, I can string a Jason out for a good few minutes until he can finally finish me. A lot of times they will get frustrated and switch to someone else to save me for later :)

 

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11 minutes ago, SolidusPrime said:

I agree with all of this.

It's also not as easy to shift-grab as people as it may seem at first. Turn your camera so you are facing Jason, and use your minimap. When you see him disappear from the shift, start juking around. This will work almost every time until you run out of stamina.

I feel that if I could get out of Jason's grabs right now without an item that he would very rarely be able to kill me. As it is now, I can string a Jason out for a good few minutes until he can finally finish me. A lot of times they will get frustrated and switch to someone else to save me for later :)

 

I agree that we should not make it easier to just get out of Jason's grab. It would make the game too easy for counsellors and we would indeed be able to kite him for too long.

Shift-grabbing on the other hand is something that I am against and feel should be removed. It's still pretty easy. And it's still pretty easy for Jason to kill most players without using this.

I propose 2 changes to his grab:
-A different QTE then bashing a button(or just remove it completely) like I posted above, but still something that you rarely should get out of.
-A little longer time before Jason can instakill someone with one of his own kills after he grabs you.(Adjusting the QTE so that getting out of his grab isn't any easier as before)
This makes it a little more forgiving for allies to try and free you by stunning Jason. As it is now, players can do it, but they have to be on the right side and have to time their attack really well.

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I don't understand why you're suggesting a QTE to make it more "fair". This should be the most un-fair game that's ever been made. Jason is a superhuman killer. If anything, Jason isn't powerful enough. Surviving a direct grab from Jason should be difficult. The pocket knife should have at least a 25 percent fail rate just to make counselors more apprehensive about its use. If you're careless enough to get grabbed by Jason (which I have been many times), escape should be rare at best. 

Fair? I just don't get that. If you were looking for fair I think you misunderstood what this game is trying to do. The whole idea for this game is based in lop-sided odds. That's Friday the 13th. 

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7 minutes ago, rickyount02 said:

I don't understand why you're suggesting a QTE to make it more "fair". This should be the most un-fair game that's ever been made. Jason is a superhuman killer. If anything, Jason isn't powerful enough. Surviving a direct grab from Jason should be difficult. The pocket knife should have at least a 25 percent fail rate just to make counselors more apprehensive about its use. If you're careless enough to get grabbed by Jason (which I have been many times), escape should be rare at best. 

Fair? I just don't get that. If you were looking for fair I think you misunderstood what this game is trying to do. The whole idea for this game is based in lop-sided odds. That's Friday the 13th. 

Which is why the odds are still in Jason's favor in my suggestion. 2/3 results is Jason damaging or killing you. If we want to say on the tie the QTE just plays again and yours is slower this time because you just got damaged the odds are still in Jason's favor since now not only are 2/3 of the options going to kill or maim you, it's going to be harder to get any positive outcome. The odds are still lop-sided in Jason's favor since the only way the councilor can escape without a pocket knife is if Jason makes a mistake and you finish the QTE first.

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1 hour ago, ConGamePro said:

Trust me I'm not trying to be a dick to you or anyone with a different opinion, I just strongly feel that nerfing Jason would cause the momentum of the game to slow down way too much. And bro it's a Friday the 13th game....which basically makes it a movie simulator. That's what I wanted, a game close to the films as possible and if you read the developers and game creators they say just that...they wanted to put us in the films through this game. 

The momentum seems like it should slow down a lot right now.  People shouldn't be dying minutes into the match, that isn't fun for anyone.

Movies are not a legitimate argument to justify game decisions.

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1 minute ago, ResolutionBlaze said:

The momentum seems like it should slow down a lot right now.  People shouldn't be dying minutes into the match, that isn't fun for anyone.

Movies are not a legitimate argument to justify game decisions.

Even minutes is ok. I've died in under 60 seconds though. 

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1 minute ago, bocchiere said:

Which is why the odds are still in Jason's favor in my suggestion. 2/3 results is Jason damaging or killing you. If we want to say on the tie the QTE just plays again and yours is slower this time because you just got damaged the odds are still in Jason's favor since now not only are 2/3 of the options going to kill or maim you, it's going to be harder to get any positive outcome. The odds are still lop-sided in Jason's favor since the only way the councilor can escape without a pocket knife is if Jason makes a mistake and you finish the QTE first.

I understand what you're saying and I get it. 2/3 isn't even close to lop-sided enough. 8/10 maybe. Should be 9/10. Early on, maybe, it should be easier to break free because no one wants to be in a 20 minute match for 75 seconds. But after 2 minutes all the "fairness" goes by the wayside. Jason gets stronger, counselors become more afraid, people die.

 

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5 hours ago, JPops said:

Here is my 2 cents on this discussion. I personally believe it's balanced and not a problem. I think people just want to run wild without consequences. There are consequences for your actions make wise decisions. If you are going to run in a straight line and be out in the wilderness well that is kind of dangerous. Limit your outside time as best you can. Have I been installed grabbed sure, it happens, made an error and was dead out in the open. Try ducking Into some cabins, do not run in one direction, make Jason work for it. 

This game comes at a learning curve but I am pretty confident as time passes players will be better and you will stand a better chance at surviving the night.

If he's grabs you and you aren't prepared well you kind of have it coming.

I already posted a topic on this issue actually Jpops. But in response to what you said I agree on all stuff you posted here but my topic talks about the issue for counselors playing it safe and still being instant grabbed. I want Jason to be overpowered and love it but it seems more of a game mechanic issue then Jason being Jason. Because as it stands right now Jason can just charge into a group of armed counselors in a cabin and grab one and perform his kill animation in less then a second before all the counselors 2 feet away can even swing once or fire at him to knock the person out of his grasp. I use this example because its a common tactic used since they know theres no consequence to it because they can perform the grab kill before anyone can attack if they spam the key/button.

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18 minutes ago, bocchiere said:

Even minutes is ok. I've died in under 60 seconds though. 

That will happen to everyone at some point. It doesn't make it unfair. People making it seem like they are being killed 30 seconds into the match while they are on the outskirts of the map and I doubt that. My guess is early on people are near the vehicles or cabins, making themselves early targets for Jason. I always die faster if I don't camp at the start. 

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28 minutes ago, ResolutionBlaze said:

The momentum seems like it should slow down a lot right now.  People shouldn't be dying minutes into the match, that isn't fun for anyone.

Movies are not a legitimate argument to justify game decisions.

The game is based on the film which is based on a supernatural killer....that can't be killed. 

What part of this don't you accept? Not everyone is dying right away. Just the aggressive players, you know who you are.

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Jason's grab should not be nerfed. I find it balanced as is, and it makes games more tense as a counselor for me and my friends, as well as rewarding when we managed to escape. Surviving a match should feel like it took a lot of wits and a lot of luck to accomplish, and nerfing Jason's grab (as well as his shift) would endanger that.

I've played enough matches to know how to do relatively well in almost every match as a counselor unless I was against a skilled Jason, encountering situations where a Jason would find me within the first 15 seconds of a match and still outmatch him using my wits and taking advantage of his lack-of-shift. And on top of that, I'm still improving thanks to all the new perks I'm slowly getting to increase my chances at survival.   

I'm with Jpop's train of thought: people just need to adjust to the learning curve of utilizing a counselor before they'll see just how balanced the system is as of now. Please do not nerf Jason's grab.

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2 hours ago, ConGamePro said:

That will happen to everyone at some point. It doesn't make it unfair. People making it seem like they are being killed 30 seconds into the match while they are on the outskirts of the map and I doubt that. My guess is early on people are near the vehicles or cabins, making themselves early targets for Jason. I always die faster if I don't camp at the start. 

Funny; those are where most people spawn.  Which is another problem in itself.  The spawns are predictable.  Jason can get on your tail easily.

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Yeah I think everyone agrees that the grab instant kill is a problem and something needs to be changed and the guy that said something about interacting with Jason to break Jasons grab is a good idea instead of blindly swinging and hoping it will register the attack

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25 minutes ago, ResolutionBlaze said:

Funny; those are where most people spawn.  Which is another problem in itself.  The spawns are predictable.  Jason can get on your tail easily.

I don't get killed in the woods early on, it is usually around the objectives where i find my demise. Also remember that children will go out of their way to memorize the spawn spots because children have to try-hard so they can move on to the next hyped game. 

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3 minutes ago, Terminator52 said:

Yeah I think everyone agrees that the grab instant kill is a problem and something needs to be changed and the guy that said something about interacting with Jason to break Jasons grab is a good idea instead of blindly swinging and hoping it will register the attack

No. Not everyone agrees. Now if it was happening even when people have the pocket-knife then I would agree that the grab is OP. So let me ask you something, I take it you are a Terminator film fan, if they released a game, you would want the Terminator to be easier to beat or get away from? And again, you better players aren't considering the less skilled players that would have to spectate twice as long if Jason's abilities were to be nerfed. 

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1 hour ago, ConGamePro said:

No. Not everyone agrees. Now if it was happening even when people have the pocket-knife then I would agree that the grab is OP. So let me ask you something, I take it you are a Terminator film fan, if they released a game, you would want the Terminator to be easier to beat or get away from? And again, you better players aren't considering the less skilled players that would have to spectate twice as long if Jason's abilities were to be nerfed. 

We can talk about the movies and we can talk about video games not both at the same time. If you want the game to be just like the movies then Jason would know where people are at all times and can see them at all times and kill them instantly with any attack at all. Movies and video games are two completely different things and need to treated as such.

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Just now, VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow said:

Make grab blockable and have a slight delay before grab executions can be used, but environmental stuff is immediate.

There you go problem solved.

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29 minutes ago, Terminator52 said:

We can talk about the movies and we can talk about video games not both at the same time. If you want the game to be just like the movies then Jason would know where people are at all times and can see them at all times and kill them instantly with any attack at all. Movies and video games are two completely different things and need to treated as such.

Good job avoiding the question. I never realized the movie themed video games aren't relatable. Interesting shit i'm learning here. 

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