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Counselor Statistics Poll  

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  1. 1. What do you think the most important counselor statistic is?

    • Composure
      2
    • Luck
      0
    • Repair
      8
    • Speed
      4
    • Stamina
      19
    • Stealth
      5
    • Strength
      1

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  • Poll closed on 05/12/2021 at 04:00 PM

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Hello everybody.  I thought of another poll.  I don't think anybody has done a poll on counselor statistics so I'll do one.  What do you think the most important counselor statistic is?

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Speed and stamina are probably the most overpowered.

Strength only has very situational usefulness and can actually backfire when used incorrectly due to Rage.

Luck is still helpful but not to the same extent it was before Rage was buffed.

Stealth is irrelevant for most counselors but it can make AJ very strong when used correctly, especially with the right perks. It's also effective on Deb (speaking from experience playing as Jason) but less so on Tiffany due to her low composure. The rest of the counselors are 8 stealth or lower and it's not really an asset for any of them. Only play as Vanessa (1) or Buggzy (2) if you want to fight/kite Jason because he'll hear you from a mile away.

Repair's a tricky one. I only play with medium to high repair counselors because it's essential if you prefer to avoid Jason while still being productive. But almost any counselor can repair depending on the player's skill with QTE, especially when they have Speed Demon, and many play styles don't need to worry about avoiding Jason when doing repairs.

Composure's importance is the toughest for me to quantify. I throw a -9% fear Preparedness on all my counselors in large part for the map and the lowest composure counselor I use, Deb (5), doesn't scare much more quickly than my highest composure counselor, AJ (7). LaChappa (4) always seems to get hysterical quickly in lobbies whereas Deb doesn't so the drop-off from 5 to 4 seems to be when lack of composure becomes noticeable. That said, several counselors get by just fine with 4 or lower composure. On the other end of the spectrum there's the No Fear Jenny (10) build that some people swear by. I honestly have no idea how to rate composure. :unsure:

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Strength and Luck are by far the least important.  

I agree that Composure is the most complicated stat and the hardest to quantify.  I can tell if I am fast.  I can tell if Im quiet.  But I have no idea how often I glow red for Jason.  So its impossible for me to say how much better a composure stat of 7 is than a stat of 4. 

Repair is a little bit tricky to.  I find the worst repair stat is 3.  Its about same difficulty as 2 but it moves faster so its actually harder (i find victoria to be just as bad as Tiff and Bugzy's 1 and worse than Vanessa's 2).  Basically if you have a stat of 5 or higher you should be able to skill check without error.  If its less than 5 you will probably make 1 mistake.  So whether its 1,2,3 or 4, it doesnt make a big diff.  Jason is probably coming.

For Speed, all that matters is can you jog faster than Jason?   All counselors can out jog zombie jasons.  But only Chad and Vanessa can out jog human jasons.  So if you arent Chad or Vanessa, speed isnt all that important.

So it comes down to Stamina and Stealth.  Stamina can be affected by fear so that hurts its importance.  Stealth is affected by other counselors so that also hurts its importance. 

In the end I had to vote Stamina as that has saved my ass more than stealth (or any other stat) has.

 

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I voted repair mostly because I main Deb and I'm used to fixing the car,  boat, or fuse, sometimes with Jason bearing down on me. I know I've irritated more than a few Jasons by putting gas or the battery in while he's hurrying to get there and kill me,  only to have me finish and run off before he gets there. Granted that I've died a lot in the inevitable chase, but I did my part. Cheers and game on, my friends

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1 hour ago, Laotian Lam said:

and Luck are by far the least important.  

Definitely not, luck is a very good stat. You know how many times you can save counselors from Jason’s spam grab in rage? You can fight Jason more effectively. You can block more attacks from a single weapon, therefore you take a lot less damage. You can start the car faster, very important when Jason is nearby and this can make an escape happen when there’s a battle for the car. And etc

composure, stealth, and strength are the worst stats in the game

Stamina, speed, luck, and repair are the best stats in the game. 

I voted stamina because with a high stamina stat you are less likely to run out and we all know if you run out of stamina on a chase with Jason you’re probably dead. 

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Pre-rage update Luck was the most important stat.  Any of us who played before the rage change can tell you about how much "fun" it was trying to deal with a lobby of 3 or more Chads.  Luck isn't useless  because like Dont mentioned car start speed is good, if ya know Jason isn't throwing knives at it, however if he is than luck is basically useless now. 

Now, it's stamina.  Speed is a close second. 

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It's telling that some people dismiss stealth and composure out of hand. Both are helpful, and one is critical, for certain play styles. OTOH, I could care less about speed, stamina and luck when I play as AJ or Deb. Heck, Deb's 3 luck feels like having a rabbit's foot after maining with AJ. :P

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1 hour ago, Eva Watanabe said:

It's telling that some people dismiss stealth and composure out of hand. Both are helpful, and one is critical, for certain play styles. OTOH, I could care less about speed, stamina and luck when I play as AJ or Deb. Heck, Deb's 3 luck feels like having a rabbit's foot after maining with AJ. :P

It's because stealth and composure are completely worthless once Jason gets rage.  Pre-rage they are strong perks to be sure but once Jason gets rage they mean nothing.  if Jason's sense ability was ever reworked, get rid of the sense spam, they would been more beneficial as well. 

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I don't think one stat is more important than the others and to think so will likely get you killed without doing anything relevant to you and your friends survival.

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2 hours ago, SirMang said:

It's because stealth and composure are completely worthless once Jason gets rage.  Pre-rage they are strong perks to be sure but once Jason gets rage they mean nothing.  if Jason's sense ability was ever reworked, get rid of the sense spam, they would been more beneficial as well. 

Unlike how the Rage buff renders high luck Wack-A-Jason tactics completely ineffective as a means of survival, there’s still plenty of time to use stealth and repair to set up an escape before rage. And with proper map management you can easily avoid Jason during Rage so long as louder and/or more fearful counselors are still alive.

Anyway, I generally find kiting to be rather boring. I’m happy to give myself up after a minute or two of pursuit and move on to the next round if the lobby was shit and I was unable to secure an exit for myself.

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The most important stat depends on your role, and your team's intentions.

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14 hours ago, SirMang said:

It's because stealth and composure are completely worthless once Jason gets rage.  Pre-rage they are strong perks to be sure but once Jason gets rage they mean nothing.  if Jason's sense ability was ever reworked, get rid of the sense spam, they would been more beneficial as well. 

I dont think Stealth is affected by Rage.  The only difference when Jason is in Rage is his improved Sense can help him find stealthy counselors....UNLESS they are both in the same cabin/house.

  My favorite part of using AJ and Tiff is driving Jason crazy when he cant find me in a large cabin or house.  I can literally spend the whole match with Jason in a cabin with me but he has no idea where I am because he cant see my pings.    Jason goes from room to room looking for me while I stay just out of sight, following him.  And every now and then sneak up on him to play a game of tag.  :)

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1 hour ago, Laotian Lam said:

I dont think Stealth is affected by Rage.  The only difference when Jason is in Rage is his improved Sense can help him find stealthy counselors....UNLESS they are both in the same cabin/house.

  

The fact Jason can spam sense while in rage literally every 3 seconds makes stealth and composure useless at that point in the match. 

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13 minutes ago, SirMang said:

The fact Jason can spam sense while in rage literally every 3 seconds makes stealth and composure useless at that point in the i 

 

- sense doesnt help Jason when he is in a cabin/house with you.  Only pings will alert him to where you are.

-sense doesnt help if another counselor is in a cabin that is between you and Jason.  (He can only see the glowing red cabin, not the counselor running around behind the cabin).  

-the extra few seconds you gain when Jason has to rely on sense to find you can make a big difference.  Even in Rage.

So no, stealth is not useless when Jason has rage.  Sure, it isnt as helpful when Jason is in Rage but that holds true for every single stat.  

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5 minutes ago, Laotian Lam said:

 

- sense doesnt help Jason when he is in a cabin/house with you.  Only pings will alert him to where you are.

-sense doesnt help if another counselor is in a cabin that is between you and Jason.  (He can only see the glowing red cabin, not the counselor running around behind the cabin).  

-the extra few seconds you gain when Jason has to rely on sense to find you can make a big difference.  Even in Rage.

So no, stealth is not useless when Jason has rage.  Sure, it isnt as helpful when Jason is in Rage but that holds true for every single stat.  

if you can't find a counselor in a cabin, you're either new to the game or not perceptive of the hiding in "plain sight" options many cabins have.  Even if you are, just tap combat stance a few times and you'll zero in on where someone is...including actual hiding spots. 

If another person is in that cabin tipping off Jason's sense at any point in the match, your stealth and composure are again, useless because he's coming to the cabin you're trying to hide in because sense told him someone was in it.   You can make the argument that he goes in to go after that loud Vanessa...well it doesn't matter who's here there for, he's there.  You could be another loud Vanessa at that point and it wouldn't matter. 

The extra few seconds are meaningless, because once he does find you, he's going to be all over you.  Especially if you're the last one alive. 

Stealth and composure are 100% useless when Jason hits rage.  

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18 minutes ago, SirMang said:

Stealth and COMPOSURE are 100% useless when Jason hits rage.  


No fear Jenny disagrees. 

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@SirMang im not sure why you insist on composure and stealth being "useless".  Nerfed, yes. Useless, no.  But almost every single stat is nerfed when Jason is in Rage. 

Speed and Stamina - are not nearly as helpful when Jason can refresh his shift much faster

Luck - cant stun Jason anymore

Strength... well, other than demasking Jason it wasnt useful anyhow.

Repair - literally the only stat not affected by Rage. 

Even composure still has a use post Rage.  You will still be able to refresh stamina faster as well as stumble and scream less often.  (Tiff's biggest issue is screaming when Jason shows up.  Thats not-so-stealthy lol)

And btw, in my example of the glowing red cabin, i didnt mean i was in the cabin.  I was saying as long as there is a glowing red cabin between me and Jason, he wont see me glowing red even if i am outside.  Its a helpful trick to hide in plain site.  

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1 hour ago, SirMang said:

Stealth and composure are 100% useless when Jason hits rage.  

This hasn't been my experience maining as a high stealth/composure character, particularly when an objective or two is fixed or near completion once Jason hits Rage. I'm often able to slip past Jason to a car or the exit while he's preoccupied with louder counselors. I also rarely see my stamina recharge rate drop to critical levels and almost never lose my mini-map. The key, as always with a stealth character, is Jason avoidance. It gets harder during Rage but it's certainly not impossible.

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15 hours ago, Eva Watanabe said:

This hasn't been my experience maining as a high stealth/composure character, particularly when an objective or two is fixed or near completion once Jason hits Rage. I'm often able to slip past Jason to a car or the exit while he's preoccupied with louder counselors. I also rarely see my stamina recharge rate drop to critical levels and almost never lose my mini-map. The key, as always with a stealth character, is Jason avoidance. It gets harder during Rage but it's certainly not impossible.

Noise pings or not you're going to glow bright red, even from the other side of the map, after rage kicks in. If it doesn't work on the first try, a little sense spam will quickly find you. And then you'll wish AJ had some speed and stam.

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2 hours ago, Somethin Cool said:

Noise pings or not you're going to glow bright red, even from the other side of the map, after rage kicks in. If it doesn't work on the first try, a little sense spam will quickly find you. And then you'll wish AJ had some speed and stam.

Thank you, apparently there are some people who somehow still don't understand this. 

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2 hours ago, SirMang said:

Thank you, apparently there are some people who somehow still don't understand this. 

You honestly think I don't understand how sense works during Rage? I made it to 150 playing almost exclusively as AJ so I am most certainly familiar with the buffed Rage mechanics' impact on a high stealth/composure counselor. Sense spamming is not a death sentence until you are the final counselor and even then I've occasionally been able to wait things out in an isolated part of the map until the cops arrive. And as I said previously it has no impact on a high composure counselor's stamina recharge rate and mini-map retention, both of which can be critical when attempting to escape during Rage.

5 hours ago, Somethin Cool said:

Noise pings or not you're going to glow bright red, even from the other side of the map, after rage kicks in. If it doesn't work on the first try, a little sense spam will quickly find you. And then you'll wish AJ had some speed and stam.

Which is why I always keep as much distance between myself and Jason during Rage as possible, preferably with several loud counselors in between us. I'm almost never the counselor to put Jason into Rage since he rarely sees me during the first half of a match and I'm not looking for a fight when he does. Usually he's put into rage by a bunch of loud characters who drag him around the map for several minutes (good thing they've got all that speed and stamina!) while my perfectly calm high composure character continues to go about her business as if nothing has changed. Well, I suppose there is one difference: It's this point in a match when I'll finally see missing repair items pop up on the map and end up looting the corpses of supposedly superior counselors.

The only time I wish AJ had more speed and stamina is when I'm going to the shack with Tommy late in a game. Otherwise I much prefer being able to sprint non-stop without ever having to worry about Jason hearing me.

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1 hour ago, Eva Watanabe said:

 It's this point in a match when I'll finally see missing repair items pop up on the map and end up looting the corpses of supposedly superior counselors.

Haha.  Well said!

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1 hour ago, Eva Watanabe said:

You honestly think I don't understand how sense works during Rage? I made it to 150 playing almost exclusively as AJ so I am most certainly familiar with the buffed Rage mechanics' impact on a high stealth/composure counselor. Sense spamming is not a death sentence until you are the final counselor and even then I've occasionally been able to wait things out in an isolated part of the map until the cops arrive. And as I said previously it has no impact on a high composure counselor's stamina recharge rate and mini-map retention, both of which can be critical when attempting to escape during Rage.

 

That's great if all these objective items pop up on the map for you, super, swell, wonderful.  You still have to pick them up and take them to the actual objective.  An objective that is still likely trapped.  You take out the trap, either tanking or PKing it, congrats you've just told Jason where you are completely ruining the point of your stealth composure build.  Thus, if you're playing to be stealthy, you're not taking out the trap.  Now you have to take said repair item, say it's the gas, to the other car or the boat if it needs it, taking the slow trek across the map to do so and still having to stop and recharge stamina.  So A. you need to hope Jason doesn't find you doing this while he's spamming sense B. hope you don't just wander into Jason C. Hope that's not trapped as well or D. if you can repair something, that you don't screw up.  D is one thing that's gonna trip up the magical No Fear Jenny build that some people think is awesome for the entire match.

Say you find the fuse, get to the fuse box and its not trapped.  Once you make that call you might as well have just rang the dinner bell.  Even if you have Legendary/Epic My Dad's a Cop you'll have to outrun Jason for at least 3 and a half minutes and still get to the cops...and good luck with that with a character that has no stamina. 

So where is the benefit of your build once Jason gets rage?  And how do those sense avoidance/fear reduction perks do anything to help you survive at that point? 

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1 hour ago, SirMang said:

That's great if all these objective items pop up on the map for you, super, swell, wonderful.  You still have to pick them up and take them to the actual objective.  An objective that is still likely trapped.  You take out the trap, either tanking or PKing it, congrats you've just told Jason where you are completely ruining the point of your stealth composure build.  Thus, if you're playing to be stealthy, you're not taking out the trap.  Now you have to take said repair item, say it's the gas, to the other car or the boat if it needs it, taking the slow trek across the map to do so and still having to stop and recharge stamina.  So A. you need to hope Jason doesn't find you doing this while he's spamming sense B. hope you don't just wander into Jason C. Hope that's not trapped as well or D. if you can repair something, that you don't screw up.  D is one thing that's gonna trip up the magical No Fear Jenny build that some people think is awesome for the entire match.

Say you find the fuse, get to the fuse box and its not trapped.  Once you make that call you might as well have just rang the dinner bell.  Even if you have Legendary/Epic My Dad's a Cop you'll have to outrun Jason for at least 3 and a half minutes and still get to the cops...and good luck with that with a character that has no stamina. 

So where is the benefit of your build once Jason gets rage?  And how do those sense avoidance/fear reduction perks do anything to help you survive at that point? 

First, objectives are often already finished when Jason gets Rage in part because of stealthy repair counselors like me; that's the beauty of the build. Second, shepherding items during Rage generally isn't too difficult when there are still other counselors around to distract Jason. It's only really tricky in the following situations: the item is in or near a location where counselors are kiting Jason, an idiot/troll dropped the item halfway across the map or you're playing on Pinehurst (but then Pinehurst is tough for any play-style). But like I said, fixing objectives often isn't even necessary during Rage. Finally, I rarely encounter trapped objectives late in a game as most will have already been tanked if they were ever placed at all. Even Part 2 Jasons will see their traps quickly evaporate against a decent lobby.

I do agree regarding your point about No Fear Jenny's poor repair being a massive weakness. It's one of the main reasons I didn't enjoy using her as much as AJ. I have about a 75% success rate with AJ doing mistake-free repairs after rolling for 3 skill checks (I'm not great at QTE) and it was close to 100% when I used Speed Demon as my third perk. I switched it to Medic because it's more fun risking death after getting discovered due to a failed check than it is being the last counselor alive with nothing to do because I wasn't able to fix trapped objectives (and AJ will most likely be the last counselor alive with the right build & play-style).

It's obvious nothing's going to convince you but all I can say is that I have significant experience not only avoiding Jason's radar once he's in Rage but also doing repairs & escaping thanks to my build. Stealth and composure are most definitely not '100% useless' when Jason gets Rage if you know how to use them.

Edit: Also, I don't use sense avoidance perks and never claimed to. All you need to make AJ a ninja is 15% Lightfoot and a strong fear reduction perk; I use Preparedness. NOS seems to be more popular but I rarely lose the mini-map thanks to my composure & play-style. Having a map right off the bat is also very helpful for this build since it allows you avoid louder counselors.

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12 hours ago, Eva Watanabe said:

Stealth and composure are most definitely not '100% useless' when Jason gets Rage if you know how to use them.

Unless your definition of completely useless means that Jason can toggle sense on at Mulholland at Pinehurst and can see you crouching behind a tree at Stoneside. Because that's what happens when rage kicks in. But here's the real kicker, once his sense gets super charged like that, he loses his ability to see almost any noise ping. So now Vanessa has about the same advantage as you do.

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