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Strigoi

Killing Jason was Never Meant To Be Difficult .

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I think the difference here is obvious: people rolling in Kill Squads vs people in QP.  

Also, when it was UNKNOWN it was hard to kill Jason. When locations of the shack were unknown, when balancing perks, calling Tommy, and numerous other mechanics were new and mysterious, of course it was. People are using Kickstarted interviews and prior as evidence. Fact is goons and kids do it with ease because its formulaic. 

Rage mode helps newer Jasons, however the problem has always been in combat and facing multiple counselors. The objectives are based on cat and mouse, not man vs gang. We were always supposed to run and try to escape. Any group of counselors that work together will always defeat any Jason. 

Jason can use combat improvements is my point. Or learn how to beat groups. People have put several strategies how to avoid it. I havent been killed legitly yet. Came close 2-3 times, but no official kills. Only ones where I taught people how to do it.

Side note, Tommy generator used to be able to be smashed onced called for those that remember. 

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There are probably lots of ways to make it a little more difficult without crossing the "new content" lines. Just off the top of my head, you could have more Jason cabin spawn locations (instead of 2 per map or whatever) to make Jason's cabin a bit harder to find, could make it a bit harder to knock his mask off, could give Jason better stun cool down in case he's getting ganged up on, ect. Be these good ideas or not, my point is I'm sure there's ways. 

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38 minutes ago, NightmareFuel said:

There are probably lots of ways to make it a little more difficult without crossing the "new content" lines. Just off the top of my head, you could have more Jason cabin spawn locations (instead of 2 per map or whatever) to make Jason's cabin a bit harder to find, could make it a bit harder to knock his mask off, could give Jason better stun cool down in case he's getting ganged up on, ect. Be these good ideas or not, my point is I'm sure there's ways. 

I think creating more than 2 per map now would fall under new content. Though it is a recycled asset, the location and therefore altering the map is different.

However taking block out of combat stance, increasing HP or descreasing HP taken when in block, and improving Jason combat mechanics can all help. Even changing the demasking cannot happen until after Rage mode has been hit will alter a lot. Even after Rage mode, its still easy to do, though

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Idk why OP thinks killing Jason is hard. It is too easy.. The HARD part should be getting his mask off and it is too easy to do. The most simple solution would be to give more hit points. Whatever they can do to help keep the mask a bit easier and not losing the mask too quickly. This would mean while fighting Jason counselors’ weapons would break, run out of pocket knives, med spray, etc.... not a high strength character hitting Jason a couple times and boom he’s dead..... there needs to at least be a couple rounds of a full on battle with weapons breaking in the middle of the fight. If they give more hit points this would create a lot of suspense while trying to de mask Jason. 

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Jason cannot die, but he can be put down. And for that, you are gonna need a good team and meet the requirements.

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12 hours ago, Strigoi said:

Killing Jason was Never Meant To Be difficult .

If it was supposed to be Harder to kill Jason then why did The Devs Create tThe Cabin,sweater killing mechanics in the game.

Its all ready balanced enough you have a small chance with one counselor Tommy Jarvis  and one chance with the sweater.

Changing it to make it harder would mean adding new content or removing the game design mechanics that the game was originally designed with like the sweater and mask removal.

It takes alot to kill Jason ,Jason's Mask must be removed, The sweater Girl has to stay alive,Tommy Jarvis must be called and stay alive .

The Game was originally designed to be able to kill Jason .

Do you play as Jason? 

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20 hours ago, F134Ever86 said:

@Fair Play @JasonLives86CB radio can be busted like generators?? Tommy has to be in possession of Jason's mask?? Jason can put his mask back on??

Good suggestions I like the idea if Jason kills the person holding his mask he could put it back on to get back half his hit points of something to that nature.

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I Hope The Devs can see that everyone here is Exagerating that its too easy to kill Jason .

I cant wait till it gets Announced That Ther will be No More Updates.

 

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6 hours ago, Alien_Number_Six said:

Do you play as Jason? 

Yes i do play as Jason and i hate playing As Jason because the Fear i feel during the game  as Jason .

Hearing People taunt me and Try to Stun and Kill me is Nerve Wracking.

Playing As Jason makes me feel Fear.

I love playing As a Counselor .

Its fun fixing things.

Most Matches that ive played other players are So Obsessed with Fixing The Cars.

In Fact ive been Tommy Jarvis and cant get the other players away from The Cars.

Most People find it super fun to fix the Cars.

Its Hard Enough to Kill Jason .I Rarely see People trying to Kill Jason .

 

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31 minutes ago, Strigoi said:

Yes i do play as Jason and i hate playing As Jason because the Fear i feel during the game  as Jason .

Hearing People taunt me and Try to Stun and Kill me is Nerve Wracking.

But you have claimed you never have been killed as Jason. What’s there to fear?

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Off an on, Ive played the game about a year. (Level 88)   And only seen Jason killed maybe 4 times in that entire span. 

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48 minutes ago, Dragonfire82877 said:

But you have claimed you never have been killed as Jason. What’s there to fear?

I never said i haven't been killed as Jason .

I've been killed as Jason twice in all the dozens of times ive played as Jason .

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43 minutes ago, Strigoi said:

I never said i haven't been killed as Jason .

 

18 hours ago, Strigoi said:

When i play as Jason i never get killed.

?

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1 hour ago, Dragonfire82877 said:

 

?

Well i have been killed as Jason but its been a long time.

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13 hours ago, TheHansonGoons said:

I think creating more than 2 per map now would fall under new content. Though it is a recycled asset, the location and therefore altering the map is different.

However taking block out of combat stance, increasing HP or descreasing HP taken when in block, and improving Jason combat mechanics can all help. Even changing the demasking cannot happen until after Rage mode has been hit will alter a lot. Even after Rage mode, its still easy to do, though

Demasking after Rage mode is even easier than prior to Rage. 

No weapons do stun while Jason is in rage and all just do straight damage.  And the mere fact Jason won't stun til his mask comes off a group of 2 or 3 will demask him in mere seconds. 

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22 hours ago, Strigoi said:

Killing Jason was Never Meant To Be difficult .

Yes, it was. The developers made this point clear from the get-go.

Quote

If it was supposed to be Harder to kill Jason then why did The Devs Create tThe Cabin,sweater killing mechanics in the game.

By this logic, speed limits were never meant to be obeyed because if they were then cars wouldn't have the ability to exceed them.

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Its all ready balanced enough you have a small chance with one counselor Tommy Jarvis  and one chance with the sweater.

So it's only unbalanced if more than one counselor can kill Jason or the sweater has more than one use? 

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Changing it to make it harder would mean adding new content or removing the game design mechanics that the game was originally designed with like the sweater and mask removal.

....I'm going to pretend that's sarcasm. 

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It takes alot to kill Jason

Bullshit.

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Jason's Mask must be removed

With the right counselor build, this can be done in 2-3 hits. Even a little Asian girl in glasses can grab a machete and easily de-mask Jason.

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The sweater Girl has to stay alive,Tommy Jarvis must be called and stay alive .

This is easy to accomplish as long as they're not continuously running all over the map like a jackass, and doubly so if other counselors are with them.

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The Game was originally designed to be able to kill Jason 

Correct, but being able to kill Jason and being able to kill Jason easily are two very different things, aren't they?

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21 hours ago, Vanessaismymain said:

I feel some players are meeting the counselors head-on and that is the wrong move... Especially when a group is trying to kill you and your mask is off.

Tips: Keep a quick kill handy a throat slit with J-4's weapon or J-8's Head punch. Hide behind a cabin watch their moves using sense, then use stalk, watch for the counselor furthest away from the pack shift in grab, quick kill, morph away, repeat, until you've thin the herd. Trying to slice and dice is the wrong approach slow and methodical is how you should play and see if your results change.  Hopefully this helps!

Good advice. Not to flood the thread with my own videos but I suck at trying to explain things so it's best if I just show you guys instead of spending 30 minutes trying to find the right way to word it. I don't really have a way to edit these, so just skip to the time posted below the video.

( Skip to 12;00 )

What went wrong: For some reason, this guy largely ignored me and kept going for sweater-girl. He gets de-masked, me and SG run into the shack, and literally as soon as I grab the axe she uses the sweater. If Tommy and SG are in your shack and you've lost your mask, running in right behind them is a death trap waiting to happen, so don't do it. If you for whatever reason decide you must go in after them, at least Stalk-Shift inside instead of waltzing through the door.

( Skip to 2:30 )

What went wrong: SG keeps baiting Jason into grabbing her and thus leaving himself open to attack from nearby counselors  (though honestly at first I thought she was just fuckin' stupid). Don't grab in enclosed spaces with multiple counselors, especially if you know a Jason-kill is in the works. Eventually, you're going to lose your mask and when you do that's... well, probably going to be the end. Go into Combat Stance and block, then counter-attack. Tommy86 has an excellent video about CS blocking + counter-attacking, go watch it, you'll be glad you did.

( Skip to 5:45 )

What went wrong: This Jason died because he tried to fight the counselors head-on after his mask was off. This is another example of a death-trap waiting to happen. Unless you are 100% certain that 1) Tommy or SG has no pocket-knife, 2) Your Shift-Grab skill is high enough that you can guarantee a grab, 3) Other counselors won't be able to intervene in time to stop you, don't try the direct approach. If you grab someone and get PK'ed or stunned, you're probably fucked. 

By the way, if you do end up getting killed, don't Rage quit. There's no shame in getting killed as Jason, but there IS shame in DC'ing mid-death or hiding in the lake. If they got you, they got you... no big deal, save the footage so you can review it later to figure out what you did wrong, then don't make the same mistake next time.

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6 hours ago, Strigoi said:

I Hope The Devs can see that everyone here is Exagerating that its too easy to kill Jason .

I cant wait till it gets Announced That Ther will be No More Updates.

What leads you to believe that people are "exaggerating" about the challenge of killing Jason?

I have faith that you'll be waiting a while on the "no more updates" train.

6 hours ago, Strigoi said:

Yes i do play as Jason and i hate playing As Jason because the Fear i feel during the game  as Jason .

Counselors are supposed to fear Jason, not the other way around.

Hearing People taunt me and Try to Stun and Kill me is Nerve Wracking. Don't play as Jason if you feel like it is stressful.

Playing As Jason makes me feel Fear. Shouldn't you be fearless, rather than fearful as Jason?

I love playing As a Counselor . Love it or hate it, everyone here is gonna play counselor for quite a bit of their time in this game. The only exception is those who only play the offline bots or single player challenges.

Its fun fixing things. It's helpful, as well as fun.

Most Matches that ive played other players are So Obsessed with Fixing The Cars.

Those players are probably focused on EXP/CP or they want to escape. You can't fault them for either one.

In Fact ive been Tommy Jarvis and cant get the other players away from The Cars.

They are not obligated to do what you want. Ask nicely, and if they don't want to kill Jason, just escape and try another lobby.

Most People find it super fun to fix the Cars. Let the people that enjoy repair, enjoy repair.

Its Hard Enough to Kill Jason .I Rarely see People trying to Kill Jason .

Some people find killing Jason easier then others do. Your experience is different than the experience of others.

 

5 hours ago, DorianRo said:

Off an on, Ive played the game about a year. (Level 88)   And only seen Jason killed maybe 4 times in that entire span. 

Many of us have seen Jason killed four times in the same day. It happens.

@HaHaTrumpWon, perhaps you should start a Youtube channel and offer commentary on some of these videos. I think many would enjoy that.

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33 minutes ago, Fair Play said:

@HaHaTrumpWon, perhaps you should start a Youtube channel and offer commentary on some of these videos. I think many would enjoy that.

Actually, I already have a YT channel. Again, not trying to hijack the thread, but it was much easier to show you a couple of minutes of a video than to try and explain what I mean through words... which would almost definitely get re-written at least 10 times because I didn't like how it came out.

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1 minute ago, HaHaTrumpWon said:

Actually, I already have a YT channel. Again, not trying to hijack the thread, but it was much easier to show you a couple of minutes of a video than to try and explain what I mean through words... which would almost definitely get re-written at least 10 times because I didn't like how it came out.

I rewrite stuff often before hitting the submit button. You're trying to pass along insight into classic Jason mistakes. Keep it up.

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3 hours ago, SirMang said:

Demasking after Rage mode is even easier than prior to Rage. 

No weapons do stun while Jason is in rage and all just do straight damage.  And the mere fact Jason won't stun til his mask comes off a group of 2 or 3 will demask him in mere seconds. 

Yeah, they are doing damage. Before Rage its doing damage as well. Hitting him with a bat does damage, thats why damage is a stat for each weapon. People adapted to the update and realized what weapons are pointless after stun is all. Its harder to demaks him now because you dont have cheap stun tactics from hiding behind doors for easy hits.

 You aren't making any point that blocking out of combat stance or using throwing knives from a distance wont avoid. Again, he can use a combat improvement to deal with these groups.

The reason its easy during rage is how much damage he has already taken to get to that point. I played a match earlier as Fox when Part 2 was in rage mode, he took two shotguns, one flare gun, a bat and two pocket knives. He still had a mask. Why? No one else had really hit him and he wiped the lobby.

If you can show me the algorithm of how after Rage mode damage is increased damage and its not when status = rage, stun = null if using (blunt weapons), then I will concede this statement.  I have no idea where the conclusion the same weapon is doing more damage came from, but it doesnt make sense. The stun damage is not converted to health damage. A simple HP increase would benefit a lot. It will make weapons break more often, leaving less on the map and making it harder to find them. 

Demasking has been easy since the beginning when people said how OP Jason was in 2017(literally the name of a thread from June 2017). Problem was knowing locations of items and working together to do it. People are bored with other objectives and play low level Jasons more often,  so they choose to do the more challenging objective. What is wrong with that?

Another counterpoint: hypothetical situation, they do make an update to be able to smash the Tommy radio, are new players going to know or do this? I bet not at least 3/4 of the time. Its just hurting the people that know what they are doing in lobbies and already not getting help completing objectives. As for the good players, they figure out ut the strategy or key and still get it done. We play counselor way more often than we play Jason. We will learn to make this happen. If people are determined to kill him and protect one asset, they will. This would lead to groups hanging out at Tommy radio house now. Doing the demasking there. Will produce the same result. Reason being is the counselors are working together to accomplish a similar objective. Only now Jason has to focus on an objective while a group pounds away at him. Those are two reasons why I dont see this as a fix. Now you have created another objective for him to guard. Adding this objective isnt making Jason intimidating again, which is what we all want. 

I just dislike the idea of hindering Tommy play. Remember when you were new and died early? It sucked waiting for that long to come back, and how many times you didnt get it. I dont see anything wrong with how Tommy comes in.

I said this when the patch first released, the buff only affects later in the game. Jason's speed is still an issue, he still has very limited ways to combat 5 surrounding counselor, his defense is lacking. Give him the ability to grab someone out of a window even. Add a trap to each Jason so he can trap his shack. More throwing knifes to deal with groups, sweater girls or Tommy from the distance. 

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On ‎3‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 5:47 PM, tyrant666 said:

they've said it was so difficult that it only happened 1 in 75 matches in their playtesting.

   But... did they attempt to kill Jason in each match?

On ‎3‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 5:47 PM, tyrant666 said:

I bet the ratio is NOWHERE CLOSE to that low now.

   My point with the question above was simply this... Matches in which no attempt to kill Jason cannot be included here to give you an accurate ratio of games in which it is happening for a difficulty, or rarity ratio... Literally for it to be a true 1 in 75 games rarity ratio... ALL 75 matches had to include an attempt, and the kill was achieved only once. Otherwise, the people coming up with these numbers will be made a fool of by the first Jason hunter to come along and get even 4 Jason kills out of say... 10 tries... or even out of 4 or 5 tries for that matter.

   The matches in which no attempt was made would simply skew the numbers. Just using "the sweater being picked up" cannot even be called a game in which and attempt was made... many players grab the sweater just to get a stun from it for the achievement and couldn't care less about trying to kill Jason. But in some matches... players will try to kill him, but never get as far as even grabbing the sweater, because sometimes, shit happens... So how do we chose the what the factors are to judge which matches included an actual attempt on Jason's life?

    To get a ratio that is even close to accurate... some players have to sit down and play 75 matches and honestly try to kill Jason in every match... and let us know how many times they achieved it within the 75 matches.
    The numbers here are easy to skew as well... by taking an extremely skilled Jason player and having him play Jason in each of these matches... against players that are new to the game... and there would be many other ways to skew the numbers.
     Random players are needed for all roles... but an attempt must be made on Jason's life in each match.
     And still..... another experiment like this will produce a different ratio than the first experiment did... so it would still give a better idea just using the average between four or more such experiments... we could not go by just one group's numbers.

   If the devs just gave us a total number of games played in a day and the total number of Jason kills in that day... it is an inaccurate number for the purpose of rarity or difficulty.... When one Jason hunter can get 8 or even 9 kills in 10 matches... and others do not even try to kill Jason... the numbers can be heavily swung in either direction when considering how many games there were with no attempt.
   Myself as an example... I do not even try for the Jason kill... unless someone really wants to do it and asks nicely... and with the added requirement that this person is not being an asshole to the Jason player... so it is pretty damned rare for me to do it... somewhere probably around 1 in 200 matches... But then, I only tried once in these 200 matches, which would make it a ratio of 1 Jason kill for 1 match.
   Other people on these forums claim to kill Jason upwards of twenty times per night... Given that these matches probably last for around ten minutes each... that is almost two hours of playing time, plus waiting time between matches... which can also add up... So really, how many more games did they play and not kill Jason?... probably not too many... even if they played another ten matches on top of this and failed in each attempt, that would still make their ratio 20 Jason kills for 30 matches.
   And people wonder why this game is hard to balance properly.
 

On ‎3‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 8:49 PM, Big Daddy J said:

Do you realize how stupid it is that Jason can't fight counselors head on? Killing Jason is piss-easy, and it is not supposed to be, so say the devs.

   I have to agree here... "Running Away" is not something Jason ever did... nor does it seem like something he should EVER have to do.
 

4 hours ago, Fair Play said:

Many of us have seen Jason killed four times in the same day. It happens.

   Eight times in a night... but there are many nights I do not keep track... so this number could easily be higher... And if I actively tried to do it... it could be MUCH higher than that. But many nights I do not see it happen at all... because I am playing with friends... and non of them bother trying to kill Jason at all.
 

3 hours ago, TheHansonGoons said:

If you can show me the algorithm of how after Rage mode damage is increased damage and its not when status = rage, stun = null if using (blunt weapons), then I will concede this statement. 

   Do not need to show you the algorithm... it is observable in game.
   Without Jason taking damage... Bugsy, with the proper perks can demask him in two or three hits.... Why the two or three hits variable you ask... when it takes three... One included a stun from that axe. Easy to conclude here that a stunning hit is doing less damage than a hit that does not stun... and this is not even a stretch of the imagination. Particularly when basing this on my own experience as Jason and I know for a fact I did not take damage from anything else yet.
   You can test this out in a private match... demask Jason three times (or more times, at least one of these attempts needs to include one or more stunning hits... but three attempts should be enough)... damaging him ONLY with one type of weapon (to keep damage a constant).... with ANY counselor (but using the same counselor for each set of three demaskings). The more stuns he takes, the more hits it takes to demask him... It is an easy conclusion to make after observing this... So it is easier to remove the mask after rage... whether he was damaged previously or not... previous damage would still make it even easier of course.

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