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1 hour ago, Dynamic skills7 said:

, also the only decent slow one is savini having that weapon damage and shift all while having door breaking too, lucky I have him.  The rest of the listed options are way too broken.

Have to disagree with you on this comment. I don't have Savini, but Jason 8 cant be  that far from him. Jason 8 is my main and I prefer him over any of the running Jason selections.

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19 minutes ago, Dragonfire82877 said:

Have to disagree with you on this comment. I don't have Savini, but Jason 8 cant be  that far from him. Jason 8 is my main and I prefer him over any of the running Jason selections.

8 and 6 are both better than any of the running Jasons. 

I haven't played with 7 or 9 enough to have an opinion of them. 

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9 minutes ago, SirMang said:

8 and 6 are both better than any of the running Jasons. 

I haven't played with 7 or 9 enough to have an opinion of them. 

everyone has their own preference. I hate both 8 and 6. I used to play 5, but was losing mask too much against a good lobby, so i switched to part3. With the machete, he is one bad ass mo fo.. honestly, my fav to play was part 9, but again, he is easy to kill and i hate the -traps..

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3 hours ago, Dynamic skills7 said:

On a balancing perspective most of those options will break the game and not be fair. I do wish walking Jason’s were faster though or had something more to compensate and no competitive person I know uses them, when people do use a slow Jason they only pick a upgraded shift to waste people’s stamina more and catch them, also the only decent slow one is savini having that weapon damage and shift all while having door breaking too, lucky I have him.  The rest of the listed options are way too broken.

My balance idea is just more speed for slow Jason’s or a swap around with perks or a extra perk or something, with the games current state. if Jason is made more powerful overall, the slow ones might not need to be changed I’m not sure, I think this is more of a topic for after the release of their changes to see where they sit.

Running Jasons don't die now? Here's some balance ideas that aren't broken:

1) meat shielding

2) quick block

3) damage/stun immunity after animations

And if you really want to see some blood fly:

Neutral shift for pt 2 and pt 4

1 more trap and 2 more throwing knives for all Jasons

 

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12 minutes ago, Somethin Cool said:

Running Jasons don't die now? Here's some balance ideas that aren't broken:

1) meat shielding

2) quick block

3) damage/stun immunity after animations

And if you really want to see some blood fly:

Neutral shift for pt 2 and pt 4

1 more trap and 2 more throwing knives for all Jasons

 

Pt 4 with your blood fly idea would be top tier.

1 and 2 on your ideas, yes, yes, yes.  I've said enough about meat shielding in this topic so no more required.  A one button press quick block would be ideal. 

3. meh, it would just change the timing of when to get a free stun.  Would be good for a few days, and then people would figure out when exactly to keep chain stunning Jason. 

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3 minutes ago, SirMang said:

Pt 4 with your blood fly idea would be top tier.

1 and 2 on your ideas, yes, yes, yes.  I've said enough about meat shielding in this topic so no more required.  A one button press quick block would be ideal. 

3. meh, it would just change the timing of when to get a free stun.  Would be good for a few days, and then people would figure out when exactly to keep chain stunning Jason. 

I'm hoping if they see meat shielding enough they'll get the hint and give it back. 

Meat shielding

Meat shielding

Damage/stun immunity with a block that doesn't have a delay (not a single button push. Keep it like it is just lose the off host delay) combined with meat shielding and some skill will easily take care of crowds of would be chain stunners. 

I agree pt 4 with a neutral shift would easily make him the best Jason in the game. Pt 2 with a neutral shift and +morph would be a beast too.  Especially with 8 traps. For that matter adding one more trap and two throwing knives to all the rest would give them the small buff that they need without throwing things too far out of balance. I know I'd enjoy using pt 7 and pt 9 a lot more if they had an extra trap.

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56 minutes ago, Somethin Cool said:

Running Jasons don't die now? Here's some balance ideas that aren't broken:

1) meat shielding

2) quick block

3) damage/stun immunity after animations

And if you really want to see some blood fly:

Neutral shift for pt 2 and pt 4

1 more trap and 2 more throwing knives for all Jasons

 

All good ideas, similar to some on my list. Except instead of a truly neutral Shift, I would change the properties of minus Shift so that it only differs by cooldown, not speed or duration.

Base Shift and plus Shift are the same speed as it is, so it is odd that minus Shift not only has longer cooldown but also significantly lower speed and duration. That’s a bit overkill on a negative as it currently is.

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3 minutes ago, Tommy86 said:

All good ideas, similar to some on my list. Except instead of a truly neutral Shift, I would change the properties of minus Shift so that it only differs by cooldown, not speed or duration.

That works too. Keep the cooldown add neutral speed and duration. That'd probably be better for balance. Pt 4 might be a little too OP with a true neutral shift. 

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37 minutes ago, Somethin Cool said:

That works too. Keep the cooldown add neutral speed and duration. That'd probably be better for balance. Pt 4 might be a little too OP with a true neutral shift. 

Yeah the cooldown on minus Shift would be enough as a negative, as Part 4 has the worst objective control in the game. I also consider him to be the worst Jason in the game, especially since there is zero reason to pick him over Part 3. And he is basically Part 3 with +Destruction at the cost of the worst negatives in the game. The trade off is horrendous. +Destruction is a nice stat but nowhere near that valuable. When you consider that Savini has +Wpn Str, +Destruction and +Shift, with basically no negatives, it is simply laughable.

As it stands, Part 3 is pretty much the only Jason that shows up in competitive play, as he is the most balanced. So the other Jasons definitely need some love. Stats like +Throwing Knives also require improvement as all the stat gives you is 4 extra knives, which at most is enough to cripple 2 counselors or kill 1, and that’s providing they have no sprays and are not thick skinned. Once those 4 knives are gone, where is the stat? Nowhere to be found. 

As far as throwing knives go, and I’ve said it many times, there needs to be a small amount that is auto-refilled per x amount of time. I will explain more in the big post. In this case a +Throwing Knives stat would simply provide more on the auto-refill, which would make it an actually useful stat for the whole match.

PS: something else to mention. Minus Stun Resist, if it even functions at all, is actually a POSITIVE. Since if there is more chance of taking a stun, then there is less chance of taking full dmg from a weapon which contributes to killing your mask. You would much rather the low stun dmg. Another stat devs simply didn’t put any thought into at all.

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12 minutes ago, Tommy86 said:

Yeah the cooldown on minus Shift would be enough as a negative, as Part 4 has the worst objective control in the game. I also consider him to be the worst Jason in the game, especially since there is zero reason to pick him over Part 3. And he is basically Part 3 with +Destruction at the cost of the worst negatives in the game. The trade off is horrendous. +Destruction is a nice stat but nowhere near that valuable.

I agree. I know I had more trouble with pt 4 than any other Jason when I was set to random. Now I switch back and forth between 3 and 7 just to mix it up a little without worrying too much about kill squads. 

 

18 minutes ago, Tommy86 said:

As it stands, Part 3 is pretty much the only Jason that shows up in competitive play, as he is the most balanced. So the other Jasons definitely need some love. Stats like +Throwing Knives also require improvement as all the stat gives you is 4 extra knives, which at most is enough to cripple 2 counselors or kill 1, and that’s providing they have no sprays and are not thick skinned.

What's your opinion on balancing the rest of them? I'm not sure 1 extra trap and 2 knives would do anything for making them more selectible for compitive play. Although maybe meat shielding, quick block, and a little damage/stun immunity would help... 

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3 hours ago, Dragonfire82877 said:

Have to disagree with you on this comment. I don't have Savini, but Jason 8 cant be  that far from him. Jason 8 is my main and I prefer him over any of the running Jason selections.

I agree part 8 is easily top tire. Though I am also partial to part 3.

3 hours ago, SirMang said:

8 and 6 are both better than any of the running Jasons. 

I haven't played with 7 or 9 enough to have an opinion of them. 

I have to disagree. I despise part 6 and believe part 3 and 5 are far stronger.

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2 hours ago, Somethin Cool said:

What's your opinion on balancing the rest of them? I'm not sure 1 extra trap and 2 knives would do anything for making them more selectible for compitive play. Although maybe meat shielding, quick block, and a little damage/stun immunity would help... 

It is really hard to say. It would require a significant rework of the Jasons which at this point in the game’s life, I simply don’t see happening. So it’s not really worth spending time on. All you can do is simply make the “lesser” Jasons more tolerable, because it is just as you say - any small improvements to them are likely still not going to make them more selectable for competitive play. And with bigger improvements you either run the risk of something unbalanced or having basically no difference between one Jason and another.

In that case it is almost always going to be Part 3 who is selected. At the very least all Walking Jasons need to be faster because their lower mobility is an automatic disadvantage, particularly in group combat where any extra mobility is valued.

Meat Shielding 100% needs to come back, as it as a highly valuable thing that is often overlooked, same with fixing client block and providing more dmg / stun immunity. I believe those 3 things would go a long way.  

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7 hours ago, Dragonfire82877 said:

Have to disagree with you on this comment. I don't have Savini, but Jason 8 cant be  that far from him. Jason 8 is my main and I prefer him over any of the running Jason selections.

I said in the games current state and the current state mainly needs weapon attack damage and shift for slow Jason’s in most situations and savini is way off on having everything better and the pitch fork he has, has a longer hit radius I think, but has trouble breaking single windows if possible at all. It would be better analysing them after the game is updated to improve all Jason’s

5 hours ago, Somethin Cool said:

Running Jasons don't die now?

 

 When did I say that?? Their better at pressuring counselors and make it harder to menuver. Slow Jason’s rely on shift a lot more and don’t agree with using any slow Jason with no weapon attack and slow shift in the games current state, you will die more easily.

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10 hours ago, Dynamic skills7 said:

On a balancing perspective most of those options will break the game and not be fair. I do wish walking Jason’s were faster though or had something more to compensate and no competitive person I know uses them, when people do use a slow Jason they only pick a upgraded shift to waste people’s stamina more and catch them, also the only decent slow one is savini having that weapon damage and shift all while having door breaking too, lucky I have him.  The rest of the listed options are way too broken.

My balance idea is just more speed for slow Jason’s or a swap around with perks or a extra perk or something, with the games current state. if Jason is made more powerful overall, the slow ones might not need to be changed I’m not sure, I think this is more of a topic for after the release of their changes to see where they sit.

You said your balance idea is just more speed for "slow" Jasons.

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56 minutes ago, Dynamic skills7 said:

When did I say that?? Their better at pressuring counselors and make it harder to menuver. Slow Jason’s rely on shift a lot more and don’t agree with using any slow Jason with no weapon attack and slow shift in the games current state, you will die more easily.

Thanks for the expert tip. Can you enlighten me as to which walking Jason has a slow shift? I wouldn't want to use that one for sure...

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@Tommy86, I would offer the argument that Part 4 is actually the best at driving Counselors where you want them to go. It requires playing him a bit differently than most people do but it isn’t that hard once you figure out that any route you like as a Counselor is probably the same route others will take. I like to preemptively break window that are likely to be ones I will force them through, or control one corner of the map and push people into it. Ideally you get the phone and a vehicle together, objective parts are key to this strategy you have to keep track of them and given the opportunity push those Counselors into your territory on the map, do it instead of killing them immediately  and you can control even more.

Part 3 is better at handling hunting parties no doubt but in a QP lobbies Part 4 is only as weak as the player controlling him. He’s probably my favourite Jason but he is very weak at objective control unless you can lock two down like I said above. 

As to the other conversation happening, running Jason’s, as much as I prefer them, are actually the weaker ones out of the two groups. Part 2 and Part 5 both have a strength that quickly runs out, Part 4 was mentioned above as having horrible obj. Control. Really Part 3 in the only powerful one that runs (proving the rule) and any of the others that don’t run can zip about the map or cut people off at their leisure. I don’t think some of the people in the conversation have any idea what good means as far as playing Jason goes. I’m an average Jason at best so not the most informed person in the room but it boggles my mind some of the claims that are made in this thread. 

Edit - If you read this pubs/devs don’t take it to mean Part 4 doesn’t need a buff, I would much rather him get one and be as useful as he appears to be when you first unlock him.

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@Slasher_Clone   very briefly: 2,5,6,9 are most easily killed. 3 is decent. 4 would be great with one extra trap and neutral speed shift but as he sits he can't control objectives very well. 7 would be fine for a walker but he only has three traps. 8 is decent until you start running into thick skin and med sprays. Savini arguably has the best stats but he can't run and he's always going to have a target on his back because he's rare. Any of them can be used in QP but you need to know your Jason's strengths and weaknesses and play accordingly.

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7 hours ago, Somethin Cool said:

You said your balance idea is just more speed for "slow" Jasons.

More speed yes, nice and simple, or at least a extra perk or something as I stated, and I also said more can be said once all Jason’s are buffed with the current ideas to see where they sit.I did say that in the previous comment.

7 hours ago, Somethin Cool said:

Thanks for the expert tip. Can you enlighten me as to which walking Jason has a slow shift? I wouldn't want to use that one for sure...

8 and 7 have a default shift and that’s slow recharge compared to others and you need that recharge for a slow Jason, otherwise it’s a joke with no one needing to sprint much at all. How is it a benefit to use them compared to any other one, even ones that have the more shift and needed weapon attack struggle as is. Of course running ones can be bad too depending on the perks, but it’s much better when it comes to engagement in combat and stamina still.

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1 hour ago, Dynamic skills7 said:

More speed yes, nice and simple, or at least a extra perk or something as I stated, and I also said more can be said once all Jason’s are buffed with the current ideas to see where they sit.I did say that in the previous comment.

8 and 7 have a default shift and that’s slow recharge compared to others and you need that recharge for a slow Jason, otherwise it’s a joke with no one needing to sprint much at all. How is it a benefit to use them compared to any other one, even ones that have the more shift and needed weapon attack struggle as is. Of course running ones can be bad too depending on the perks, but it’s much better when it comes to engagement in combat and stamina still.

Slower recharge rate doesn't equal slower shift. The only Jason's that have slower shift are 2 and 4 (both running Jason's). All neutral shift (3,5,7,8) and all +shift (6,9,Savini) Jason's have the same shift speed and duration. The only thing that changes is the recharge rate. And to be honest I don't think 10 seconds either way should make a difference in QP. You just have to be smarter about when you use it.

Like I just said Jason's 2,5,6,9 have lower hit points so I'm pretty sure that makes any of them worse for combat than Jason's 3,4,7,8, Savini. Also only 3,4,7, Savini have +weapon strength. You can pretty much take away part 4 at this point due to his horrible -shift and -traps. Now you can take away part 8 because of no weapon strength. So the top 3 Jason's are 3 (by a long shot despite having neutral shift), followed by Savini (a walking Jason with +shift even though he always has a big target on his back) and part 7 (another walking Jason with neutral shift). So to answer your question 7 and 8 (3rd and 4th) are better than most because they have full health, neutral shift, part 7 has weapon strength, part 8 has +destruction, and an added bonus of +sense for part 7 and +stalk for part 8. 

Edit: you could arguably even put part 4 behind part 6 because of his lack of being able to control objectives

Edited by Somethin Cool

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Sweet lord some of you are over thinking this waaaay too much.

This isn't a complex deep game.    Its a casual party game not a competitive game..   And some of your are really over thinking EVERYTHING..

The fixes need to be simple and direct.

On 12/18/2018 at 6:10 PM, HuDawg said:

 

Jason melee slashes should disarm counselors.

Block needs to actually be fixed.. And block from angles

Counselors should not be able to hold duplicate items

 

This ^..  is all thats really needed to flip this game around and force players to actually play as intended.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

Sweet lord some of you are over thinking this waaaay too much.

This isn't a complex deep game.    Its a casual party game not a competitive game..   And some of your are really over thinking EVERYTHING..

The fixes need to be simple and direct.

This ^..  is all thats really needed to flip this game around and force players to actually play as intended.

 

 

Block works from angles now...

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7 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

Sweet lord some of you are over thinking this waaaay too much.

This isn't a complex deep game.    Its a casual party game not a competitive game..   And some of your are really over thinking EVERYTHING..

The fixes need to be simple and direct.

This ^..  is all thats really needed to flip this game around and force players to actually play as intended.

Not being able to hold duplicate items doesn’t make any sense, and wouldn’t accomplish anything anyway, so it’s pointless as well as being senseless.

Edit - people will adapt to it by making little piles of the items they do need. I would hate to see this implemented because it would lead to people hiding caches of stuff everywhere. When I currently do it I leave the caches in the open of a large room but if it was changed, I’d probably start hiding them too.

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1 minute ago, Slasher_Clone said:

Not being able to hold duplicate items doesn’t make any sense, and wouldn’t accomplish anything anyway, so it pointless as well as senseless.

would help me when im running around all game looking for supplies and find jack shit, while a couple jackoffs are off fucking around loaded up with all the supplies and I end up dying after a 10+ min chase for my life.. lol

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2 minutes ago, badassgixxer05 said:

would help me when im running around all game looking for supplies and find jack shit, while a couple jackoffs are off fucking around loaded up with all the supplies and I end up dying after a 10+ min chase for my life.. lol

Lol, this would still happen for reasons listed in my edit in the comment above yours. 

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10 minutes ago, Slasher_Clone said:

Not being able to hold duplicate items doesn’t make any sense, and wouldn’t accomplish anything anyway, so it’s pointless as well as being senseless.

 

It makes sense when people are using medic perks and running around with 6 heals and/or ONE player is holding 3 pocket knives.    Or a combination of both when spread out between a few players.

So now.. its toned down  much more especially when combined with the two other changes.  Meaning you can only hold 2 sprays via the med perks and one pocket knife.  

  

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