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20 minutes ago, Somethin Cool said:

I've about used up all my lives on this thread so I'm going to try to be done posting here¬† but I have to say I agree with you 100% on this. Although I did find a perk build where I could get a 1 hit demask with an axe from Buggzy. Provided the first hit didn't stun. Sounds like you really know what you're talking about. Hope to see you around.ūüėé

Yo, literally this dude in the thread Tommy86, check him out. He's on page 4 i think. I know very little compared to what he knows, i have learned most from him as 150 aswell. I may even go as far to say he's a pioneer haha if you saw some of his work. Yeah il be sure to see you, hit me up with your PSN if you wish. 

And non stun dmg > stun dmg is a fact btw now, all but confirmed by everyone at the top tier level anyway

I edited my previous post, go take a look. I gave an example of stun dmg and non stun dmg and some numbers.

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Hope something is done soon to flip the current state of the game upside down.

RDR2/O is basically taken over my life at the moment.

Unless counselors get put in check and Jason gets the buffs that he deserves..  I'll probably have zero reason to jump back into this game again.

 

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2 hours ago, Fridaythe131 said:

Yo, literally this dude in the thread Tommy86, check him out. He's on page 4 i think. I know very little compared to what he knows, i have learned most from him as 150 aswell. I may even go as far to say he's a pioneer haha if you saw some of his work. Yeah il be sure to see you, hit me up with your PSN if you wish. 

And non stun dmg > stun dmg is a fact btw now, all but confirmed by everyone at the top tier level anyway

I edited my previous post, go take a look. I gave an example of stun dmg and non stun dmg and some numbers.

Tommy86 is the man, right? I learned quite alot from him, his YouTube videos are awesome. And a great person too, have PM'd him a few times for a couple issues I was having. He's among the most knowledgeable guys around. Some people have their issues with him, but no one can question his dedication to learning the intricacies of this game. He's definitely my "go to guy" for what's gonna work, and why. GeneiJin is very good too, combat tactics he uses are superb. I know I learned alot from those guys, but Tommy really seems to know everything about this game.

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i also suggest a hit speed nerf if possible, mainly with the swift attacker perk. I have done swing testing and grab speed testing and the high tier swift attacker beats the grab speed, making Jason resort to hitting them or spinning away as the counselor even bats a eye at him and just keeps running after them, while both people spin trying to bait one another or he can try his luck with shifting if the counselor doesn't hit Jason out of shift too, or just run wild everywhere making a chance he could catch them or not.  It seems like a silly annoyance.

also I never ever insult people I disagree with btw, only when I'm attacked with disrespectful nature like with slander etc

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19 minutes ago, Dynamic skills7 said:

i also suggest a hit speed nerf if possible, mainly with the swift attacker perk. I have done swing testing and grab speed testing and the high tier swift attacker beats the grab speed, making Jason resort to hitting them or spinning away as the counselor even bats a eye at him and just keeps running after them, while both people spin trying to bait one another or he can try his luck with shifting if the counselor doesn't hit Jason out of shift too, or just run wild everywhere making a chance he could catch them or not.  It seems like a silly annoyance.

also I never ever insult people I disagree with btw, only when I'm attacked with disrespectful nature like with slander etc

Simple fix! Fix block. No need to grab first then, you can block then counter with grab. Ez pz. 20% isn't quick enough for that. If you grab first over blocking the Jason is at fault and should be punished with swift for his impulse to grab, that's a rookie mistake not the perks or mechanics in the game. 

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19 hours ago, SirMang said:

To be fair on this point...

You never were in any danger if you spawned at the fuse house.  Outside of running right to Jason or trying to square up one on one, he has no ability to catch you.  That hasn't changed.  Plus obviously as we've all played the game longer, we fully realize that Jason can't do anything to kill us so we transfer that also to when we play as Jason. 

If someone is in the fuse house when I morph there, I'll trap the box, break some windows and a break a door while waiting for my morph to come back.  I won't go inside and harass whoever is in there as it's a losing endeavor for me.  Once morph is ready, I'm gone to the car.  Now, of course, if it's a new player who thinks it's time to square up with me, they're dead.  Because Jason in a one on one is still stronger than a counselor. 

LOL any time Jason is around you're in danger! I used to have your mindset that it's early on in the game, just go somewhere else trap something, destroy a gen but Jason has knives and doesn't need to wait on his abilities to be used! Counselors trip, make mistakes etc. Should be one of the easiest kills for Jason seeing as the counselor more than likely cannot find any resources 

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1 hour ago, Redrum138 said:

Tommy86 is the man, right? I learned quite alot from him, his YouTube videos are awesome. And a great person too, have PM'd him a few times for a couple issues I was having. He's among the most knowledgeable guys around. Some people have their issues with him, but no one can question his dedication to learning the intricacies of this game. He's definitely my "go to guy" for what's gonna work, and why. GeneiJin is very good too, combat tactics he uses are superb. I know I learned alot from those guys, but Tommy really seems to know everything about this game.

I personally believe he IS the most knowlegable person in game. I've been talking to him for months in PM, lengthy conversations, parting his wisdom. THE MAN KNOWS HIS STUFF.¬†I haven't met anyone in this game who has had an answer for pretty much all my curiosities and questions regarding this game like this man has. I don't think ANYONE knows as much as him, like i can say as fact he is the most knowlegable player to grace this game ūüėāūüėā. You should see some of the stuff he's found, a lot of the stuff he has privated too,¬†done extensive testing in private lobbies and¬†also I see him as¬†the most knowlegable¬†due to how diminished the player base is and how small¬†it was to start off with too, in addition. Who are the ones who disagree with him I'd like to know? Alien number six and methodicalize? I thought the rest respected him or atleast respected what he had to say. I have a feeling i may know the one or two¬†but i won't know the rest. Just like to get a flavour haha. People should respect tommy imo, the stuff he knows some of the people won't even be able to grasp or fathom at first lol sometimes it took him a while to explain to me even though he explains very methodically, clearly and concise, not that it was very¬†easy to explain or to understand to begin with yet he did a great job. He's never short of time trying to fully help you understand whenever he's free, explains fully and in detail as opposed to other people in the community, barring the forum pages ofc which do a good job of being very clear and helpful too.

Edit:¬†And also to add he's a very friendly guy to boot from the other side (Australia).¬†¬†Fighting alligators and what not. ūü§£

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11 hours ago, tobirulezs said:

LOL any time Jason is around you're in danger! I used to have your mindset that it's early on in the game, just go somewhere else trap something, destroy a gen but Jason has knives and doesn't need to wait on his abilities to be used! Counselors trip, make mistakes etc. Should be one of the easiest kills for Jason seeing as the counselor more than likely cannot find any resources 

Tbh wasn't that purely based on how new we were to the game? I.e noobs, nowadays people be actively seeking Jason at the start of the game due to experience they have gained of not to fear him as long as its not a host Jason who can "quick" block, which is damn near impossible to 1v1 lol and I'd be running from, not to.

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19 hours ago, Somethin Cool said:

Well we certainly don't want Jason to be so strong that the little kid that gets lost in the woods just outside the shack becomes a threat. At some point skill is going to have to be brought into the equation. But I want Jason capable of playing the whole round without worrying about Tommy boxing. At least a skilled Jason player.  Make it so only unskilled players need to Tommy box. I think we're on the right track. But I really hope they don't go too far with it. 

When I say Jason is weak its not saying he is under powered, he is under movable, make sense? Like the grab for instance, too many times counselors just whiz right by not a foot away and he is useless to grab them, at least the old grab Jason could have got them but now he has tunnel vision and can just see straight ahead, I think they should have the Tommy gen or at least Tommy house marked on the map so Jason can see where that is because some newer people have no clue where it's at. and alert him when Tommy has been called, like when cops arrive or cops called etc

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3 minutes ago, Fridaythe131 said:

Tbh wasn't that purely based on how new we were to the game? I.e noobs, nowadays people be actively seeking Jason at the start of the game due to experience as long as its not a host Jason who can "quick" block, which is damn near impossible to 1v1 lol

yeah people look for Jason now, we do, he don't need to come to us lol in a time not so long ago though that was different 

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21 hours ago, Fridaythe131 said:

Simple fix! Fix block. No need to grab first then, you can block then counter with grab. Ez pz. 20% isn't quick enough for that. If you grab first over blocking the Jason is at fault and should be punished with swift for his impulse to grab, that's a rookie mistake not the perks or mechanics in the game. 

I have also tried that strategy with a friendly Jason and also when playing Jason with friendly counselors. If you instead block the attack instead of moving away, Jason doesn't have enough time to grab if they counselor quickly moves left or right beside you, he can only grab if they run straight ahead of you, Jason will just barely make the distance to grab them and it's a guessing game if they choose to run ahead or left or right and you need to choose a way to look immediately and that's if they even get baited to hit you, they could just keep pretending the whole time making you trigger combat stance.

EDIT I did watch tommy 86 video on it and it seems he does it faster, I have only tested on controller a few days ago and somethings blocking the time from being that fast. We tried many times to do it instantly, from mashing the 2 buttons to pressing just one and timing when the other allows a response. I will test again in a day with friends, if nothing changes there has to have been a fix for it in the past 9 months. Talking about entering combat stance btw, not exiting. You don't have to read further if this actually works like the video. Ok another EDIT I tested it more and no it's not possible with baiting and even having low ping, I have around 50 ping along with that brain second to process. It's not possible if the swings activated before block or grab.

20% is quick enough to beat a grab that's milaseconds later since it takes the brain a second to even process the counselors actually committing to a swing and not faking it unless you try and randomly predict, but you would suffer from that if wrong. Both Jason and the counselor will never hit at the same time and unless that happens it wouldn't beat it. 

This does bring up another great idea though, I think Jason should be able to block much faster with one button without entering combat stance maybe, by doing this they can take away his original more protective block, like blocking attacks from behind that he has currently and make it that he takes damage still maybe and instead of taking away stun completely it could be lowered by 50%? Blocking should be a instant action almost, just a bit better to beat swift attacker. They could also make it that his block cancels after someone hits you if it's too unbalanced. This does seem like a more balanced skilled thing to do and very satisfying. Counselors would just be promoted to attack his back more in a team and no one has to play a game of spins baiting each other for eternity to lead no where. It's up to the devs how fast you can grab after this block.

Edited by Dynamic skills7

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1 hour ago, tobirulezs said:

LOL any time Jason is around you're in danger! I used to have your mindset that it's early on in the game, just go somewhere else trap something, destroy a gen but Jason has knives and doesn't need to wait on his abilities to be used! Counselors trip, make mistakes etc. Should be one of the easiest kills for Jason seeing as the counselor more than likely cannot find any resources 

I welcome any Jason to chase after me wasting his time early in the match. 

Until Jason gets shift he has no ability to kill anyone because he's too slow to keep up with anyone. 

The time you're wasting to break windows on the cabin then getting smacked by a weapon after doing so, then finally getting to the door to break it down, just to come in the cabin and watch me go out the window to the next cabin is an easy 2 minutes where other people have free reign to get other stuff done.  I'll then take Jason to the next cabin and we'll do it all over again.  

After the second cabin of doing this, we're probably 5 minutes into the match and in a lobby with 1-2 other people who actually do objectives, one of the cars is already started. 

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13 hours ago, Fridaythe131 said:

Is this the same Devils Rejects on twitch? Someone else had a point how can we take you seriously with your lack of punctuation, anyway off topic.

  I, to some extent, agree with your sentiments on Jason of him being underpowered however after watching your gameplay as Jason I feel your not the right person to be representing these "pro" players. Then you blab out names that no one has even heard of and that we're expected to know who they are. Which further diminishes how serious we take you. Do you not play as Host Jason in these tournaments? I have noticed you do and others do, which is smart as Jason is lag free, usually glitch free too. Jason at his most strongest, not only that but a fully functioning block.

Now a "pro" player that you are you do not even block nor do you strafe shift which is what all these "pro" players do, how are you pro again? To me, I'm being honest your just a good Jason, that's all. No wonder you complain of a weak Jason. The only thing you do well is quick toss knives and take out boxes on your first few morphs. Not to mention your a compulsive short shifter so shift juking you is so easy and stamina drain for a counslor is not even an issue for majority of the game. You also think J4 is one of the best Jasons, how can anyone take you seriously when you say that? J3 is a better version of J4 in every regard that if J3 is available and ready to use J4 shouldn't even be an after thought NEVERMIND "a top Jason" and therefore he is redundant MOST CERTAINLY in kill lobbies where there are skilled players where destruction is such a useless strength that it's only assertive in pub lobbies where being relentless is so overpowering for them that they wilt. I have seen you block as Jason and your not even an incompetent blocker at best, you plain outright don't block barring a few measly spurts that you do here and there which are so conspicuous and premeditated that you may aswell hold a sign up saying "I'm blocking don't engage me" as your stun immune and also their hits will do very little damage to you for the weapon durability it's worth so any half decent counslor won't even engage when they see you holding block then your asking for a buff as Jason...cmon doode!! You block last moment to sucker them in that's how you block, what a "pro" player you are and your playing as host so broken non host block isnt an issue. Learn and understand the game and seek to get better under the conditions presented to you. Don't be so readily to complain. Here's an example how to block (relegated to only host unfortunatly atm and for the time being due to previous devs) Be sure to read the description box of the video too by clicking the drop down tab via the YouTube link:

But at the end of it all, i do believe Jason is somewhat underpowered definitely off host. I think Jason should atleast have 200% hp, at one point i was even saying 300% or even 400% haha. But 400% could be overkill. Someone earlier in the forum was saying 300% is too much but at the end of the day the Jason kill should be like how it used to be as a newb and feel treasured and earnt, not gifted which is often the case it feels many times and also luck comes into play with uncoordinated gang bangs with an average player just spamming the attack trigger with a machete at hand and getting lucky.

Also devils how the HELL does sucker punch being reduced to 10% benefit Jason? Please explain!¬†Quite the contrary I'm afraid friend,¬†again "pro" player jist i will make ūüėā. Are you aware it will just mean Jason's mask will come off that much sooner¬†since non stuns are the most damage inducing towards Jasons HP? Stuns don't deal much dmg to Jason's HP, not any that you should be concerned about but non stuns¬†exhibit maximum damage that¬†the weapon is capable of dealing, respectively. I may be wrong but a non stun baseball bat most likely does more damage than a stunning machete hit, just to give you perspective.¬†If¬†not and i am indeed wrong it'll be close i say nonetheless.

 

Ps. How can you not strafe shift as a "pro" Jason?

M I N D B O G G L E D 

I have only one reason that i can think of and I'm sure this is not the reason for you, infact the reason i have in mind is more befitting a pro Jason (no sarcasm) that if you say it i may have to consider you pro (sarcasm). And this is the exact reason why one of my friends who is a top notch Jason does not strafe/side shift.

 

 

Bottom line: Jason is underpowered OFF HOST¬†where the devs broke block. On host he is perfectly fine apart from the obvious frame lag, actually rather OP on host i may add¬†to some people due to the enhanced shift, grab etc that comes from this¬†this no ping/lag factor making everything smoother. But the main reason players request host as Jason is due to the blocking perks i.e "quick" block (the new term thats been coined in and come into existence due to the two types of blocks with the former¬†having arose). Your the only one it¬†seems who requests it for less/no lag. In essence i am saying block more¬†not just block but also learn how to e f f e c t i v e l y¬†block and possibly add strafe shift into your arsenal too.¬†Two very game changing techniques, will change your game experience as Jason greatly¬†"pro" player ūüėĀ. Ok il stop lol.¬†

 

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13 hours ago, Fridaythe131 said:

Is this the same Devils Rejects on twitch? Someone else had a point how can we take you seriously with your lack of punctuation, anyway off topic.

  I, to some extent, agree with your sentiments on Jason of him being underpowered however after watching your gameplay as Jason I feel your not the right person to be representing these "pro" players. Then you blab out names that no one has even heard of and that we're expected to know who they are. Which further diminishes how serious we take you. Do you not play as Host Jason in these tournaments? I have noticed you do and others do, which is smart as Jason is lag free, usually glitch free too. Jason at his most strongest, not only that but a fully functioning block.

Now a "pro" player that you are you do not even block nor do you strafe shift which is what all these "pro" players do, how are you pro again? To me, I'm being honest your just a good Jason, that's all. No wonder you complain of a weak Jason. The only thing you do well is quick toss knives and take out boxes on your first few morphs. Not to mention your a compulsive short shifter so shift juking you is so easy and stamina drain for a counslor is not even an issue for majority of the game. You also think J4 is one of the best Jasons, how can anyone take you seriously when you say that? J3 is a better version of J4 in every regard that if J3 is available and ready to use J4 shouldn't even be an after thought NEVERMIND "a top Jason" and therefore he is redundant MOST CERTAINLY in kill lobbies where there are skilled players where destruction is such a useless strength that it's only assertive in pub lobbies where being relentless is so overpowering for them that they wilt. I have seen you block as Jason and your not even an incompetent blocker at best, you plain outright don't block barring a few measly spurts that you do here and there which are so conspicuous and premeditated that you may aswell hold a sign up saying "I'm blocking don't engage me" as your stun immune and also their hits will do very little damage to you for the weapon durability it's worth so any half decent counslor won't even engage when they see you holding block then your asking for a buff as Jason...cmon doode!! You block last moment to sucker them in that's how you block, what a "pro" player you are and your playing as host so broken non host block isnt an issue. Learn and understand the game and seek to get better under the conditions presented to you. Don't be so readily to complain. Here's an example how to block (relegated to only host unfortunatly atm and for the time being due to previous devs) Be sure to read the description box of the video too by clicking the drop down tab via the YouTube link:

But at the end of it all, i do believe Jason is somewhat underpowered definitely off host. I think Jason should atleast have 200% hp, at one point i was even saying 300% or even 400% haha. But 400% could be overkill. Someone earlier in the forum was saying 300% is too much but at the end of the day the Jason kill should be like how it used to be as a newb and feel treasured and earnt, not gifted which is often the case it feels many times and also luck comes into play with uncoordinated gang bangs with an average player just spamming the attack trigger with a machete at hand and getting lucky.

Also devils how the HELL does sucker punch being reduced to 10% benefit Jason? Please explain!¬†Quite the contrary I'm afraid friend,¬†again "pro" player jist i will make ūüėā. Are you aware it will just mean Jason's mask will come off that much sooner¬†since non stuns are the most damage inducing towards Jasons HP? Stuns don't deal much dmg to Jason's HP, not any that you should be concerned about but non stuns¬†exhibit maximum damage that¬†the weapon is capable of dealing, respectively. I may be wrong but a non stun baseball bat most likely does more damage than a stunning machete hit, just to give you perspective.¬†If¬†not and i am indeed wrong it'll be close i say nonetheless.

 

Ps. How can you not strafe shift as a "pro" Jason?

M I N D B O G G L E D 

I have only one reason that i can think of and I'm sure this is not the reason for you, infact the reason i have in mind is more befitting a pro Jason (no sarcasm) that if you say it i may have to consider you pro (sarcasm). And this is the exact reason why one of my friends who is a top notch Jason does not strafe/side shift.

 

 

Bottom line: Jason is underpowered OFF HOST¬†where the devs broke block. On host he is perfectly fine apart from the obvious frame lag, actually rather OP on host i may add¬†to some people due to the enhanced shift, grab etc that comes from this¬†this no ping/lag factor making everything smoother. But the main reason players request host as Jason is due to the blocking perks i.e "quick" block (the new term thats been coined in and come into existence due to the two types of blocks with the former¬†having arose). Your the only one it¬†seems who requests it for less/no lag. In essence i am saying block more¬†not just block but also learn how to e f f e c t i v e l y¬†block and possibly add strafe shift into your arsenal too.¬†Two very game changing techniques, will change your game experience as Jason greatly¬†"pro" player ūüėĀ. Ok I'll stio

Come try me then lol 

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On 12/5/2018 at 7:00 PM, DEVILS_REJECTS7 said:

 I've been able to run Jason around the whole 20 minutes with just mitch yes I am mitch the snitch lol

seen a debra slap that mask off with just 3 hits umm what about this

ok my plea to the developers is done give what is left of this community what they need A BADASS JASON KILLING MACHINE!!

You've ran a Jason around as mitch? That's on the Jason player not Jason himself. We all should know how bad the majority of Jasons are in pubs, you out of all people after your countless hours of play that you have amassed streaming this game. Buffing Jason won't just magically make them better players now, doubt it'll solve anything. 

 

Deborah has demasked Jason in 3 hits? Deborah cannot even demask Jason in 3¬†heavy machete strikes¬†even if they were¬†all to be¬†non stuns. I think it's practically impossible.¬†Surely he took prior damage and got his ass whopped prior to encountering Deborah ūüėāūüėā

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It may not make them better players but atleast give the new players a fighting chance even in private matches Jason is still underpowered and if people disagree fine we know who the trolls are now lol yeah keep him the same so the trolls can run the game haha..I'm not dumb

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1 hour ago, DEVILS_REJECTS7 said:

It may not make them better players but atleast give the new players a fighting chance even in private matches Jason is still underpowered and if people disagree fine we know who the trolls are now lol yeah keep him the same so the trolls can run the game haha..I'm not dumb

What do you suggest, realistically speaking? Revert back to day 1 Jason? That would'nt be bad, problem solved. 

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Not sure if it was mentioned, it used to come up a lot in relation to this topic. Jason should get full rage as soon as his mask comes off.

If they wanted to expand on it, maybe let him recover his mask after one minute or off any body, resetting to half hit points when he puts it on. 

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On 12/7/2018 at 6:46 PM, Grape said:

 

 

15 hours ago, DEVILS_REJECTS7 said:

Come try me then lol 

You are 100% using a controlled that is programmed , you are hitting one button to go into block, not two ,  which would make everything much easier, funny how nobody noticed this, don’t act like you are a thing special, like most people do on the internet.

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I don’t know why I’m sharing this clip because it is very painful for me to watch. But it’s rounds like this that make playing Jason very stressful and feel like he is weak. I’ve definitely played better matches but to be fair I was very drunk at this point.  My mask comes off literally the first hit that I take (from a shotgun). At that point it comes down to whether I can successfully protect the sweater. Have a watch if you care to. 

 

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24 minutes ago, CountYorgaVampir said:

IÔĽŅ don‚Äôt know why I‚Äôm sharing this clip because it is very painful for me to watch. ButÔĽŅ it‚Äôs rounds¬†like this that make playing Jason very stressful and feel like he is weak. I‚Äôve definitely played better matches but to be fair I was very drunk at this point. ¬†My mask comes off literally the first hit that I take (from a shotgun). At that point it comes down to whether I can successfully protect the sweater. Have a watch if you care to.¬†

 

I've never seen the shotgun take the mask off in one hit. That has to be a glitch. 

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3 hours ago, Slasher_Clone said:

Not sure if it was mentioned, it used to come up a lot in relation to this topic. Jason should get full rage as soon as his mask comes off.

If they wanted to expand on it, maybe let him recover his mask after one minute or off any body, resetting to half hit points when he puts it on. 

Agreed 100% on rage when mask is knocked off..

And I Definitely like the idea of being able to put the mask back on after killing the player who has picked it up that is definitely a good buff for the big J...to make killing him a bit harder.

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1 minute ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

Agreed 100% on rage when mask is knocked off..

And I Definitely like the idea of being able to put the mask back on after killing the player who has picked it up that is definitely a good buff for the big J...to make killing him a bit harder.

Lol if they did that I'd actually have to start picking the mask up. But honestly wouldn't make it much harder to kill him. It'd just make them wait til Tommy shows up to take the mask off. 

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