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Stunning jason is bullshit

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New players still run away without weapon after grabbed and knife or fellow counselor saved. Still baffles me. I agree if they dropped their weapon after being slashed it wouldnt be much different. heck id rather it so i could pick up that weapon and actually get a hit on jason.. Most are just running away with weapon in hand anyways. Biggest players effected would be the skilled hunters.

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19 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

Doesn't mean changes should be as a "punishment" for these player, making the game more frustrating for them. 

Punishment for getting hit by Jason?..  YES!

What are you trying to say?  Average players who play as counselors need to be able to tank/trade shots with Jason so they don't get frustrated?

 

As opposed to what?    When average players play as Jason and get frustrated at how easy they get a beat down?  

 

19 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

  Doesn't need to be as drastic as unarming the counselors and make it a snore fest for Jason, as I likely will feel like it would be.

Disarming isn't drastic.    The melee weapon just flops on.  Thats it.

 

And the SNORE fest.. is being stunned constantly because counselors can tank/trade shots with Jason.   And making it to easy to beat down and kill Jason.

 

 

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19 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

Punishment for getting hit by Jason?..  YES!

I wasn't using punishment in the sense of gameplay.  I used it as in this change feels like a big FU and a punishment toward player to spite them for taking advantage of Jason's flaw.

19 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

What are trying to say?  Average players who play as counselors need to be able to tank/trade shots with Jason so they don't get frustrated?

Why are you repeating this?  Especially since I agree this is a problem and already make my own suggestion of addressing it.  Pushback prevents trading hit.  Counselor takes damage and doesn't regain stamina since they didn't get a free swing on Jason.  Jason's pressure game is still in effect and he maintains advantage without the need of disarming counselors.

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27 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

Disarming isn't drastic.    The melee weapon just flops on.  Thats it.

It is, since most situations with a single counselor w/ Jason takes the swing because they need a stamina boost.  Once disarmed, they have no hope as Jason can just sit on the weapon.  Its a massive change to the meta and will likely lead even more players to avoid repair counselors (slow and low stamina) and just use Vanessa for safe kiting.  Jason players will likely never grab, as slashing leads into many 1-hit = death scenarios.

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4 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

I wasn't using punishment in the sense of gameplay.  I used it as in this change feels like a big FU and a punishment toward player to spite them for taking advantage of Jason's flaw.

Jason flaw?  You mean game play mechanic flaws....

It really doesn't make any sense to be able to trade shots with Jason.   

A big FU towards players trying to tank Jason hits to land melee shots of their own..   Isn't a bad thing.     Its almost comical that you think it is.

7 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

.  Pushback prevents trading hit.  

Push back would only make sense with Blunt Weapons...  

Jason is a power house using Sharp Weapons..   Push back would look stupid.  

 

You must really rely on tanking/trading hits with Jason.  Good thing your reasons for defending this game play mechanic is so weak.  Its makes me look like a genius... :D

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25 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

It is, since most situations with a single counselor w/ Jason takes the swing because they need a stamina boost. 

Not everyone hits Jason for stamina boosts.    But either way, that is not a good reason for trading hits with Jason so easily.

25 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

  Once disarmed, they have no hope as Jason can just sit on the weapon.  

And Jason sitting on the weapon means what?  The counselor isn't tethered to the weapon..  so go find another weapon or get some help.  

25 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

  Jason players will likely never grab, as slashing leads into many 1-hit = death scenarios.

   Actually this will lead to more grabbing.   Also slashing doesn't = kills.    You can dodge slashes just as you can dodge grabs.

25 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

  Its a massive change to the meta and will likely lead even more players to avoid repair counselors (slow and low stamina) and just use Vanessa for safe kiting. 

All the try hard meta jock riders use Vanessa already...   So, that changes nothing.

All the normal cool players, just use what ever counselors they want.   And still would if disarms where added.  Since disarms for Jason melee attacks  doesn't really change anything other than TRADING hits with JASON.

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22 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

IActually this will lead to more grabbing.   Also slashing doesn't = kills.    You can dodge slashes just as you can dodge grabs.

No it would lead to more slashing.  Slashing is a safer option than the easy to punish grab.  If the disarm happens when the counselor in stamina crisis and need a hit, they can't pick up the weapon nor have the stamina to find another one.  Since if Jason grabs them and they have a PK, he risks giving them stamina and picking up the weapon, its ALWAYS better to slash them once disarm.  Counselor has a weapon, Jason has to respect their ability to stun him and gives a reason to use grab,  I do enjoy that interaction from both ends.

36 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

A big FU towards players trying to tank Jason hits to land melee shots of their own..   Isn't a bad thing

It's not the player's fault for taking advantage, it's devs for poorly implemented mechanics. Game balance and changes are intended to preserve fun for both and be fair enough on both ends, not make change in spite of one party so the other can feel vindicated.

36 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

 Push back would look stupid. 

Pushback is a typical mechanic to ensure the player isn't recovering into a unfavourable or "cheap" situation.  Platformers, shooters, fighter, etc all use some form of pushback.  Besides, Jason's so massive a swing from his axe/machete would likely send someone flying with the cut.  It's a game, there is plenty here that already looks silly and unrealistic without actually benefiting it like pushback could.

36 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

You must really rely on tanking/trading hits with Jason.  Good thing your reasons for defending this game play mechanic is so weak.  Its makes me look like a genius...

Once again you resort to juvenile insults and accusations when I've not said one thing disrespectful to you. I stand by what I said about you. You don't care or want to consider other points, and will be hostile to anyone in disagreements to yours.

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@HuDawg Actually push back would make perfect sense as an axe would still have alot of force behind it. A push back or some kind of staggering animation would make sense and be far less punishing. If counselors dropped their weapons it'd probably stop playing as Jason. It's already too easy for me alot of the time anyway. 

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42 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

No it would lead to more slashing.  Slashing is a safer option than the easy to punish grab.  If the disarm happens when the counselor in stamina crisis and need a hit,

Then they DIE!    Case closed.. balance restored.

Like I give ass if counselor past his expiration date needs to land a hit.      They got put into that position for a reason.

You sit there and bang on about skills all day long.   Yet for some reason forget about managing stamina and making sure you get a clean hit on Jason.  

Yet you think counselors need to be able to trade hit with Jason because (Your new excuse)  Stamina!  :D

42 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

  Since if Jason grabs them and they have a PK, he risks giving them stamina and picking up the weapon, its ALWAYS better to slash them once disarm. 

You sounds good.   But, really this is a fix for counselors attacking Jason for easy hits.  Not about stamina.   

42 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

 

Pushback is a typical mechanic to ensure the player isn't recovering into a unfavourable or "cheap" situation.  Platformers, shooters, fighter, etc all use some form of pushback. 

Dude, Jason is hacking people.. not shoving them back.     A push back would look like shit in this game.  This isn't a fighting game, its not shooters and its not platformer.     Having counselors pushed back 7+ feet because Jason attacked him with a melee slash would just look silly.

42 minutes ago, GeneiJin said:

 

Once again you resort to juvenile insults and accusations when I've not said one thing disrespectful to you. I stand by what I said about you. You don't care or want to consider other points, and will be hostile to anyone in disagreements to yours.

I didn't insult you..  I mocked your reply.    And theres nothing hostile about it.

Also my entire reason for disarming on melee attacks comes from being fair for both sides.   So what are you talking.. I don't care?

(I would prefer the counselor flop on the ground like a fish out a water, while screaming and their melee weapon go flying)

So a simple disarm is pretty peeled back.

Its also fair.

Fair as in.   HE WHO HITS 1st.. Goes the spoils.  It doesn't get much more fair then that.

If anything, disarm could be tied to composure.  So a counselor with 10 composure would have a 10% chance of not getting disarmed on hit.  But thats seems like alot more work.

 

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9 minutes ago, thrawn3054 said:

@HuDawg Actually push back would make perfect sense as an axe would still have alot of force behind it. A push back or some kind of staggering animation would make sense and be far less punishing. If counselors dropped their weapons it'd probably stop playing as Jason. It's already too easy for me alot of the time anyway. 

So a side swing from and axe should knock players backwards 7+ feet?   Really?  How does that work?  Because that not only sounds stupid, but would also look stupid.  

 

Also, i call BS on you quitting because counselors can't trade shots with you when you're Jason and lay you out on your ass.  Im just sayin'  

 

"OMG, counselors can't take a hit from me and still stun me anymore.. i quit"      Doesn't sound right to me.

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3 minutes ago, HuDawg said:

So a side swing from and axe should knock players backwards 7+ feet?   Really?  How does that work?  Because that not only sounds stupid, but would also look stupid.  

 

Also, i call BS on you quitting because counselors can't trade shots with you when you're Jason and lay you out on your ass.  Im just sayin'  

 

"OMG, counselors can't take a hit from me and still stun me anymore.. i quit"      Doesn't sound right to me.

I would probably quit because it would be boring and too easy. As for the axe staggering you would make sense. Granted to the side would make more sense but whatever works. 

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12 minutes ago, thrawn3054 said:

I would probably quit because it would be boring and too easy. As for the axe staggering you would make sense. Granted to the side would make more sense but whatever works. 

 Jason melee disarms isn't changing anything that matters.  So you're quitting for no reason.   I mean, are you only playing people who attack you non stop, only looking for Jason kills and not doing objectives?     Because they could just RUN, DODGE.. get help.     Getting disarmed is not instant death.

Besides, a push back would have to be longer that the counselors melee range to prevent them from instantly hitting Jason. 

BUT!   This would lead to many counselors getting stuck up against objects and walls..  ( Which would really get them killed easily if they have no weapons)

OR those same objects and walls being used against Jason to prevent the push back and still get a swing in.

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How about a push back and weapons disarm...

I definitely agree trading hits with Jason looks ridiculous, and is a terrible gameplay mechanic....both Counselors and Jason need a combat rework.... and the ability to block out of combat stance would definitely help the situation,  but will not be enough to stop the trading hits with Jason....

  @HuDawg and @GeneiJin  both have good suggestions what if they were combined......Counselors get a slight stamina boost when hit with the push back ( think about it like an adrenaline boost.) and are disarmed  stoping the hit trading/ allowing them to flee / prevents the “instant kill”  and gives them the ability to get another weapon??

 

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2 hours ago, badassgixxer05 said:

A lobby full of 150lv counselors does not make this game easy 1 bit. Hella tough for Jason(yeah hes prob dying). Just sayin..

It is rare to run into that situation unless you're playing in private matches. Even when I do end up in a lobby full of high level counselors most of them are pretty bad at the game.

2 hours ago, HuDawg said:

 Jason melee disarms isn't changing anything that matters.  So you're quitting for no reason.   I mean, are you only playing people who attack you non stop, only looking for Jason kills and not doing objectives?     Because they could just RUN, DODGE.. get help.     Getting disarmed is not instant death.

Besides, a push back would have to be longer that the counselors melee range to prevent them from instantly hitting Jason. 

BUT!   This would lead to many counselors getting stuck up against objects and walls..  ( Which would really get them killed easily if they have no weapons)

OR those same objects and walls being used against Jason to prevent the push back and still get a swing in.

We're going to have to agree to disagree here. We just aren't going to see eye to eye.

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22 hours ago, JennyMyers1984 said:

Agree to disagree...

The length of the grab was never an issue after the January patch. However the cone should be readjusted because it is too narrow. I didn’t experience many lag issues after that patch.

Don’t be R2 trigger happy and you won’t be punished as much. Yes it is TOO easy to punish but the grab is not the only way to elminate a counselor.

Casual? I see the little sneaky diss you did there, know that I’m not a casual and that’s all I’ll say about that.

The game was also losing players by August/September after the team-killing patch. The “Jason nerfs” did not single handely kill the game and you cannot say that it did. It played a part but you are exaggerating how much of a part it played in the game losing it’s playerbase. People did not stop playing because Jason was nerfed. Wouldn’t make sense as people mainly play counselor.

Agree to agree? ?

...and no, no sneak disses. ?

12 hours ago, RustInPeace said:

Hey man, thanks for the name drop... Oh, wait...

?????

My bad Rust! ?

OT: Im not sure about a disarm mechanic. Maybe after 2 consecutive hits? Ramdom like Jason stuns? I don't think I'd like it, tho.

@ Everyone, don't take Hudawg's frustration too personally. He just want the game to be awesome again. He's passionate, like I think we all are.

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51 minutes ago, Caulus said:

@ Everyone, don't take Hudawg's frustration too personally. He just want the game to be awesome again. He's passionate, like I think we all are.

Everyone wants the game to be the best it can be. We just all can't agree on how to make that happen.

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7 hours ago, HuDawg said:

So a side swing from and axe should knock players backwards 7+ feet?   Really?  How does that work?  Because that not only sounds stupid, but would also look stupid.  

 

Also, i call BS on you quitting because counselors can't trade shots with you when you're Jason and lay you out on your ass.  Im just sayin'  

 

"OMG, counselors can't take a hit from me and still stun me anymore.. i quit"      Doesn't sound right to me.

Well.....wasn't there a Scene in FvJ where Jason attacks someone near the end with the machete (I think it was the black Girl) and....she just flies until she hits a tree…? Lol but I've gotta say with the current Physics it would look extremely off. 

Erm…..Maybe Jason just goes even more Forward when he attacks? I dunno.

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Having given it a bit more thought what about something like a stun animation? You could still move and evade if hit as a counselor. You'd simply be unable to swing you weapon for say 3 seconds after being hit by Jason. That way you can't trade blows but you won't be scrambling to find a new weapon.

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5 minutes ago, The Wolf with that Toast said:

Well.....wasn't there a Scene in FvJ where Jason attacks someone near the end with the machete (I think it was the black Girl) and....she just flies until she hits a tree…? Lol but I've gotta say with the current Physics it would look extremely off. 

Erm…..Maybe Jason just goes even more Forward when he attacks? I dunno.

Yes, you are correct. It was the black girl (spacing on her name at the moment) that happened to in FvJ.

Didn't mean to double post.

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2 hours ago, thrawn3054 said:

Yes, you are correct. It was the black girl (spacing on her name at the moment) that happened to in FvJ.

Didn't mean to double post.

The young lady's name you are referring to is Kia Waterson, played by the lovely Kelly Rowland.

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13 hours ago, HuDawg said:

Anyone who disagrees with me doesn't care about fairness and prefers the game to be easy to beat on and kill Jason.. and its as simple as that. 

Hell, just last night i decided to help a Tommy player help kill Jason because he asked me nicely.  Against a high level Jason player who knew full well how to play.

We demasked Jason easily..  Then both of us strolled to Jason shack while easily defending against ANYTHING Jason had.  

During that, Jason grabbed me twice.. Tommy freed me twice.    We beat Jason easily when Jason attacked us.  Jason melee'd me 6 times and Tommy twice, which didn't matter, because we can instantly hit him back and stun him.  And we also healed which basically nulled all those landed attackes by Jason..    So it was simple to demask Jason and attempt to kill him.

The Jason player then Jumped in the lake.  And to be honest, i wasn't angry about it.   I understand..lol

The Tommy player was FURIOUS..     Started to rag on the Jason player non stop.  

But again, all i saw was the PROBLEMS with the current state of the game.  We where SLOPPY, yet it was Jason getting punished for it.

 

 

If it was fair, Jason should have slaughtered us for being so sloppy.    If the game had disarm on Melee attacks from Jason it would force counselors to dodge Jason attacks better instead of just going ALL IN.  Because we know we can get the stun/melee attacks in regardless if we get hit by Jason melee attacks.  

 

You’re not a God at this game and you don’t have any right to say that what YOU say is right and everybody else who disagrees is just playing to be a bully to the Jason player.

I’m never going to agree with your stance of Jason being able to disarm counselors and it is as SIMPLE as that, period. 

Nobody is disagreeing that Jason needs quality of life changes, but the changes you suggest is not what most people agree with.

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5 hours ago, thrawn3054 said:

Yes, you are correct. It was the black girl (spacing on her name at the moment) that happened to in FvJ.

Didn't mean to double post.

That would not be a bad idea.  Conveyance may be bad at first, since players will at first think the swing is unresponsive, but would adjust.  Overall, it would accomplish somewhat what I suggested.

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10 hours ago, thrawn3054 said:

Having given it a bit more thought what about something like a stun animation? You could still move and evade if hit as a counselor. You'd simply be unable to swing you weapon for say 3 seconds after being hit by Jason. That way you can't trade blows but you won't be scrambling to find a new weapon.

I've thought about counselors unable to swing after getting melee attacked by Jason.

But... Disarms, and scrambling to find a new weapon OR picking up the one that dropped.. Just feels more exciting and something that could happen in a horror movie.

 

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20 hours ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

 

  @HuDawg and @GeneiJin  both have good suggestions what if they were combined......Counselors get a slight stamina boost when hit with the push back ( think about like an adrenaline boost.) and are disarmed  stoping the hit trading/ allowing them to flee / prevents the “instant kill”  and gives them the ability to get another weapon??

 

Don't really think a push back is needed.

But, Gaining stamina after getting hit and disarmed is something that I could live with.  I could understand the adrenaline boost type of re-action.  And seems fair to me.  

Jason chasing more and getting stunned less..  Is more inline with how the game should actually play out.

 

But as far as Stamina goes.   I would prefer if Stamina only drained when sprinting.  And double the rate that stamina decreases when sprinting.   While making jogging take no stamina at all.   Also remove the stamina on hit game mechanic.    

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