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NHA Director Responds to Out of Context Quote

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32 minutes ago, Slasher_Clone said:

More posts like these, I actually feel like posting in this thread now......

I think @Ahab already said what I wanted to add, so hopefully the conversation can keep moving in this direction and I’ll have something to add. 

“Come on in the water is fine!!”

Edited by OCT 31 1978
Slasher called me out on my spelling.

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There's a lot of back and forth here but I think the whole argument regarding what they did or didn't know hinges on January. 

This, in my opinion, is how it can best be described. 

1. We heard that as of January of 2018 they could no longer create new content, but, continue working on new content that had already been started.

2. It's reasonable to assume they knew this was coming, it's also reasonable to assume that this deadline was sprung on them. The former is reasonable because the lawsuit was already ongoing, the latter is reasonable because there's nothing that specifically states they were notified any exact date. This is a really gray area.

3. Either way, it's very reasonable to assume that this is why in February they announced they were not creating any new content and only focusing on the upgrade and the content already coming with it. I don't believe it's a coincidence. 

4. In June anything deemed new content that was not complete was ended. It was too late. 

Anyways this is how I'm interpreting things, or how I'm forming my opinion. Everything after that becomes a matter of priorities and management of the time they had left.

I just want the damn game working and then patch to be client sided. 

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4 hours ago, DasMurich said:

There's a lot of back and forth here but I think the whole argument regarding what they did or didn't know hinges on January. 

This, in my opinion, is how it can best be described. 

1. We heard that as of January of 2018 they could no longer create new content, but, continue working on new content that had already been started.

2. It's reasonable to assume they knew this was coming, it's also reasonable to assume that this deadline was sprung on them. The former is reasonable because the lawsuit was already ongoing, the latter is reasonable because there's nothing that specifically states they were notified any exact date. This is a really gray area.

3. Either way, it's very reasonable to assume that this is why in February they announced they were not creating any new content and only focusing on the upgrade and the content already coming with it. I don't believe it's a coincidence. 

4. In June anything deemed new content that was not complete was ended. It was too late. 

Anyways this is how I'm interpreting things, or how I'm forming my opinion. 

I just want the damn game working and then patch to be client sided. 

This seems well thought out, Patches can’t happen soon enough, and client side saves are important down the line.

 

5 hours ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

“Come on in the water if fine!!”

Didn’t have anything to say before, well that’s not entirely true, I could have argued with both sides of the previous argument. It wouldn’t have served any purpose though, it was just going in circles. 

This conversation seems more productive, if only as a way to dispel some tension from the forum. (‘is’ not ‘if’ by the way)

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1 minute ago, Slasher_Clone said:

Didn’t have anything to say before, well that’s not entirely true, I could have argued with both sides of the previous argument. It wouldn’t have served any purpose though, it was just going in circles. 

This conversation seems more productive, if only as a way to dispel some tension from the forum. (‘is’ not ‘if’ by the way)

Edited......lol

sorry my fingers are burnt from typing so much.....I agree I perfer more productive posts

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50 minutes ago, Slasher_Clone said:

This conversation seems more productive, if only as a way to dispel some tension from the forum. (‘is’ not ‘if’ by the way)

That’s exactly what I have told the mods. It is better to leave these kind of posts and threads up rather than deleting them as before. Community wants to discuss the topic so it is better to let it do so and reach some resolution on it eventually.

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26 minutes ago, Tommy86 said:

That’s exactly what I have told the mods. It is better to leave these kind of posts and threads up rather than deleting them as before. Community wants to discuss the topic so it is better to let it do so and reach some resolution on it eventually.

#Catharsis

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2 hours ago, Tommy86 said:

Yeah I agree with what you’ve written in this post. Particularly this part since you’re correct that the silence does them no favours. More info could be for the better or possibly worse, but out of the two scenarios I think providing any info they can is the more ethical one and would show they are at least trying to communicate. But they have really addressed very little, whether that’s because they can’t or simply don’t care to, I just don’t know. Based on their past interactions with the community, I lean more towards that they don’t care.

Anyway I’m not here demanding answers, I’m just putting forth the questions that have been in my mind since the announcement, and I think they are legitimate ones that people who do care enough to look into it have a better starting point. My time on the forums and with the game is nearly up, I will be releasing a series of final guides and that will be it. I don’t mind leaving a few bread crumbs on this topic in the meantime since it has understandably struck a chord with me too. 

   Honesty is the best policy... for better or worse, at least it is honest... It can still sting like a hot knife that slipped (I have stories you would not believe)... but it is honest at least.

   No one can force any one to answer a question... and demanding answers does not get answers... But neither should any of us be condemned or made to look like assholes for asking a question. Whether it be a good question or bad question is not the point. We ask questions when we do not know something that we want to know... being condemned for asking a question makes those that condemn the questioner look worse than if the answer was a lie... but the silence is almost as bad as a condemnation of the people who asked questions. Neither does any of this mean our questions will be answered... but it would be nice... even if it stings a bit.
   I am sorry to hear you may be leaving the forums, we have lost too many already. I will check out your guides when you post them... you always had good advice about tactics and mechanics.

@Slasher_Clone That whole "Come on in, the water is fine!!"... Well... Its a trap. There is some freaky lookin' guy with a hockey mask out there waiting to drown our sorry asses... I think he is also wearing water wings.

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1 hour ago, Ahab said:

   Honesty is the best policy... for better or worse, at least it is honest... It can still sting like a hot knife that slipped (I have stories you would not believe)... but it is honest at least.

Not when you are selling a product and trying to squeeze every last bit of profit out. Which is why I think we didn’t hear anything. 

At this point why bother making any kind of statement. The bridge has been burned. Just patch it and close up shop. There’s no real point in dedicated servers anymore. I can’t imagine the player base justifies it. Do that side save thing people are complaining about. 

I’d like to get a few more hours in before I delete it and move on. One final community session.

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3 hours ago, Ahab said:

I am sorry to hear you may be leaving the forums, we have lost too many already. I will check out your guides when you post them... you always had good advice about tactics and mechanics.

Thanks, I appreciate it. I am not leaving just yet, I want to leave some parting gifts for the community before I move on for good. It will take some time but it will be worth it, only thing I ever wanted to do here was provide some valuable info for you guys so that’s exactly what I will do before departing. I am sure a small group of hardcore players will remain so that’s who I’m doing it for.

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10 hours ago, Toddarino said:

Not when you are selling a product and trying to squeeze every last bit of profit out. Which is why I think we didn’t hear anything. 

At this point why bother making any kind of statement. The bridge has been burned. Just patch it and close up shop. There’s no real point in dedicated servers anymore. I can’t imagine the player base justifies it. Do that side save thing people are complaining about. 

I’d like to get a few more hours in before I delete it and move on. One final community session.

   I have a very good friend in sales... been in sales a long time. Top sale man everywhere he goes. You know how he achieves this? He is totally honest about his product, with EVERY potential customer. What the product is does not matter. Many sales men will lie about the product to achieve sales, and think they are doing good... he does WAY better than them, everywhere he has worked, with every product he has sold... without fail. Always number 1 salesman, everywhere he has ever worked... go figure.
   Do not try to justify dishonesty... that is a ridiculous statement. When you (or anyone else for that matter) is caught in a lie, the liar's reputation suffers for it. This is just a fact. I do not trust the word of ANYONE who justifies telling a lie for ANY reason. When trust is lost, it is incredibly hard to regain it.
   The game is still selling in case you are wondering... they would not be putting up dedicated servers for consoles just to shut all servers down a month later. How ridiculous of a waste of money would that be? There is a lot of negative publicity around this game right now and most people out there cannot even read beyond a headline... and most headlines are misleading clickbait.
   Some truth could help polish a tarnish reputation... just from being honest. Yes honesty can come with some backlash, but people prefer honesty in general to being lied to... or silence amid accusations which is pretty much as bad. Bridges can be repaired... even under fire.

@Tommy86 Noble goals... I like that. I think you are correct, some of us hardcore players (and hardcore fans of the franchise itself) are not going anywhere... How many will be left is another matter.

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3 hours ago, Lady_goldfish said:

Picturing Jason in water wings just made my day lol 

   I am pretty sure he has a rubber ducky hidden in his shack as well.

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5 hours ago, Ahab said:

   I have a very good friend in sales... been in sales a long time. Top sale man everywhere he goes. You know how he achieves this? He is totally honest about his product, with EVERY potential customer. What the product is does not matter. Many sales men will lie about the product to achieve sales, and think they are doing good... he does WAY better than them, everywhere he has worked, with every product he has sold... without fail. Always number 1 salesman, everywhere he has ever worked... go figure.
   Do not try to justify dishonesty... that is a ridiculous statement. When you (or anyone else for that matter) is caught in a lie, the liar's reputation suffers for it. This is just a fact. I do not trust the word of ANYONE who justifies telling a lie for ANY reason. When trust is lost, it is incredibly hard to regain it.
   The game is still selling in case you are wondering... they would not be putting up dedicated servers for consoles just to shut all servers down a month later. How ridiculous of a waste of money would that be? There is a lot of negative publicity around this game right now and most people out there cannot even read beyond a headline... and most headlines are misleading clickbait.
   Some truth could help polish a tarnish reputation... just from being honest. Yes honesty can come with some backlash, but people prefer honesty in general to being lied to... or silence amid accusations which is pretty much as bad. Bridges can be repaired... even under fire.

@Tommy86 Noble goals... I like that. I think you are correct, some of us hardcore players (and hardcore fans of the franchise itself) are not going anywhere... How many will be left is another matter.

We may not be going anywhere, but that doesn't mean we won't complain so they get their asses in gear. The last two updates were complete trash.

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21 hours ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

.... we should be pushing for fixes that will expand the longevity of what we have now and still need.

client side saves....

local hosting after dedicated servers are done.....

the bug fixes that will hopefully allow this game to run like a polished and finished game instead of a beta version.

 

client side saves would be nice,but i wish the game would get re-released on physical disc,with the offline modes on the disc.As i've said before on the forums,i've had to replace systems that have gone bad before,and had to download a bunch of DLC all over again,and i don't really want to be in the situation of "I can't play the offline modes anymore because they are no longer available for download."

Overall,great points in your post.Cheers.

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2 hours ago, x OLd ScRatCh x said:

We may not be going anywhere, but that doesn't mean we won't complain so they get their asses in gear. The last two updates were complete trash.

   Every update since I have been around has caused new bugs... I have not been happy about that either. Its not like anyone is thanking them for the new bugs. Having to complain pisses me off, so I try not to complain... much. I am not saying anyone else should not complain either... but since the last patch, I have been seeing way less bugs in the many matches I have played so far... but that could change in the near future... who knows.

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11 hours ago, Ahab said:

   I have a very good friend in sales... been in sales a long time. Top sale man everywhere he goes. You know how he achieves this? He is totally honest about his product, with EVERY potential customer. What the product is does not matter. Many sales men will lie about the product to achieve sales, and think they are doing good... he does WAY better than them, everywhere he has worked, with every product he has sold... without fail. Always number 1 salesman, everywhere he has ever worked... go figure.
   Do not try to justify dishonesty... that is a ridiculous statement. When you (or anyone else for that matter) is caught in a lie, the liar's reputation suffers for it. This is just a fact. I do not trust the word of ANYONE who justifies telling a lie for ANY reason. When trust is lost, it is incredibly hard to regain it.
   The game is still selling in case you are wondering... they would not be putting up dedicated servers for consoles just to shut all servers down a month later. How ridiculous of a waste of money would that be? There is a lot of negative publicity around this game right now and most people out there cannot even read beyond a headline... and most headlines are misleading clickbait.
   Some truth could help polish a tarnish reputation... just from being honest. Yes honesty can come with some backlash, but people prefer honesty in general to being lied to... or silence amid accusations which is pretty much as bad. Bridges can be repaired... even under fire.

@Tommy86 Noble goals... I like that. I think you are correct, some of us hardcore players (and hardcore fans of the franchise itself) are not going anywhere... How many will be left is another matter.

How about you continue to go through life wearing rose colored glasses.

If they would have came out in January and said they were cutting off all new content, you honestly think the game would have continued to sell? Give me a break. That doesn’t make it right, but that’s obviously the reason they didn’t make it public.

No amount of goodwill on their part is going to bring people back around to supporting Gun. Too many fuck ups.

While I admire your optimism, I’ll continue to go through life with a realistic view of how things really work.

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12 hours ago, Toddarino said:

How about you continue to go through life wearing rose colored glasses.

If they would have came out in January and said they were cutting off all new content, you honestly think the game would have continued to sell? Give me a break. That doesn’t make it right, but that’s obviously the reason they didn’t make it public.

No amount of goodwill on their part is going to bring people back around to supporting Gun. Too many fuck ups.

While I admire your optimism, I’ll continue to go through life with a realistic view of how things really work.

   Dude, I live in the real world... and don't wear glasses. I can see things perfectly clear.
   As far as I am concerned... you are justifying dishonesty... You just tossed your own credibility out the window... from the 30th floor. There is no saving it now.
   With the amount of honest reviews already explaining this shit show of bugs out there (there are many, and I read them before I bought the game... new reviews saying the same things are still popping up everywhere)... So... please... explain how being honest would have hurt them. There are shitloads of games out there that do not have new content coming... ever again. They still sell.... so give yourself a break. This is Friday the 13th... most of the people still playing it only put up with ANY of the bugs simply because it is Friday the 13th. Die hard fans that have not yet discovered this game will probably feel the same way... if and when they buy it. Much of the fan base has never played a video game... but I have met quite a few who tell me that this is their first video game ever... and they only bought it because of what it is.
   And get it right, I am pretty far from an optimist... I AM a realist... Most intelligent people called me a pessimist... until I explain my view point with enough detail that they can actually understand it. The whole world is a shit show...

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10 hours ago, Ahab said:

   Dude, I live in the real world... and don't wear glasses. I can see things perfectly clear.
   As far as I am concerned... you are justifying dishonesty... You just tossed your own credibility out the window... from the 30th floor. There is no saving it now.
   With the amount of honest reviews already explaining this shit show of bugs out there (there are many, and I read them before I bought the game... new reviews saying the same things are still popping up everywhere)... So... please... explain how being honest would have hurt them. There are shitloads of games out there that do not have new content coming... ever again. They still sell.... so give yourself a break. This is Friday the 13th... most of the people still playing it only put up with ANY of the bugs simply because it is Friday the 13th. Die hard fans that have not yet discovered this game will probably feel the same way... if and when they buy it. Much of the fan base has never played a video game... but I have met quite a few who tell me that this is their first video game ever... and they only bought it because of what it is.
   And get it right, I am pretty far from an optimist... I AM a realist... Most intelligent people called me a pessimist... until I explain my view point with enough detail that they can actually understand it. The whole world is a shit show...

So you’re telling me a whole mess of people who have “never played video games before” are going out, buying this game AND a console or PC to just to play it on? Ok man sure. Maybe you’re just delusional.

I also stand by my statement that this game would have died way faster had they told the truth. It’s bullshit they did it,  but If that’s justifying lying according to you, then I guess that’s what I’m doing. If that make me lose “credibility” in your eyes I couldn’t care less. 

So continue thinking happy thoughts with your head in the clouds.

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10 hours ago, Toddarino said:

So you’re telling me a whole mess of people who have “never played video games before” are going out, buying this game AND a console or PC to just to play it on? Ok man sure. Maybe you’re just delusional.

I also stand by my statement that this game would have died way faster had they told the truth. It’s bullshit they did it,  but If that’s justifying lying according to you, then I guess that’s what I’m doing. If that make me lose “credibility” in your eyes I couldn’t care less. 

So continue thinking happy thoughts with your head in the clouds.

   There have been several posts in this very forum by people who "claim" this is their first video game... or first multi-player game... as to naming names, I have a great memory, but if you expect me to remember the names of the member who wrote every specific post... then I would not be the delusional one... I just read a lot. I speak to people in game... as I said, quite a few there have told me the same thing. 
   As to my thoughts... they are far from happy... dark, dreary... realistic... you have no idea.... but I still try to have a sense of humor. Also... I may be tall compared to most, but my head will never reach the clouds.

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Not going to lie. It's been a few days and not sure I want to dive into the pages I've missed. 

Either way. Happy Friday the 13th! Anyone going to Mad Monster?

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All I know is it seemed like they knew when the deadline was,and they timed the whole "engine upgrade/must stop working on content" pretty conveniently.

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1 hour ago, damnenchiladas said:

Not going to lie. It's been a few days and not sure I want to dive into the pages I've missed. 

Either way. Happy Friday the 13th! Anyone going to Mad Monster?

Going to see the screening of your movie at Eyesore in T.O., happy Friday the 13th man. 

It’s going to be my sons first Friday movie, he’s dressing as Jason. 😁

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4 hours ago, damnenchiladas said:

Not going to lie. It's been a few days and not sure I want to dive into the pages I've missed. 

Either way. Happy Friday the 13th! Anyone going to Mad Monster?

   Some of it is worth a laugh... some of it was laughable...
   I think @MrCaffeine said he was going to Mad Monster (if memory serves)… if memory did serve MrCaffeine… I hope you post pictures!… Sadly, I live in a faraway land known as Canada and might find it too hot down there.

   Happy Friday the 13th to you too!

@Slasher_Clone No one tells me about these movie screenings... That would have even been worth the trip to Toronto for me. I can't remember how many years its been since I saw any Friday the 13th movie on a big screen... well, bigger than 72" anyway... Sadly, I have other plans for this night anyway... but they do involve a Friday the 13th movie of my choice… and the beer current cooling off in my portable beer cooling device.

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