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NHA Director Responds to Out of Context Quote

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8 hours ago, TheHansonGoons said:

My issue, along with other people is how long did they know? They could have created polls to ask the community where priorities lie.

this right here^^^^^. they could of came out and said we can work on uber and grendel and hurry and release before said deadline. and come out and say that there will be bugs and glitches because they just wanted to ensure we got the content we wanted and asked for before they couldnt release anything new. i dont know for sure but i wouldnt think an engine update would be considered content so they could have worked on that after the june deadline and in doin so worked out the bugs on the content they dropped before the deadline

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On 7/11/2018 at 1:02 AM, Brevator said:

You have repeatedly accused me of this, and it's bullshit. I've never once presented my opinion as fact, and I challenge you to prove otherwise. 

On the other hand, you've gone out of your way to dance around the fact that they knew about this as far back as January and failed to inform us. That's not a fucking "conspiracy theory", kid, that's what happened. I'm sorry you can't wrap your mind around that, but that's your problem, not mine. 

Go back and read this thread.... you have been pushing a negative opinion as fact in nearly every post.

I just keep calling you out on it.

so I guess it’s your problem.

I have never danced around anything I have acknowledged that they were concerned in January you just keep assuming you know that they knew that content would have to be stopped at that time... which you don’t and keep assuming that they hid it from us since that time....

concerns don't = notification of ending content.

if that was the case we wouldn’t have most of the work finished and would have been released by this time if it wasn’t for the lawsuit.

On 7/11/2018 at 1:08 AM, sfosterjr said:

this right here^^^^^. they could of came out and said we can work on uber and grendel and hurry and release before said deadline. and come out and say that there will be bugs and glitches because they just wanted to ensure we got the content we wanted and asked for before they couldnt release anything new. i dont know for sure but i wouldnt think an engine update would be considered content so they could have worked on that after the june deadline and in doin so worked out the bugs on the content they dropped before the deadline

Easier said with hindsight..... there have been many mistakes made, we all wish things were different.

I don’t know if an engine upgrade is new content either and that would have been great if they had included us in more decision making... but I also honestly feel in my opinion that they thought they would have all the newer content done along side the engine upgrade which was supposed to fix several bugs and glitches the community had been asking for. 

But I am not a developer nor do I work for illfonic so can’t say for sure what their thought process was.

 

On 7/11/2018 at 1:10 AM, OCT 31 1978 said:

Go back and read this thread.... you have been pushing a negative opinion as fact in nearly every post.

So you can't prove otherwise. Gotcha. 

On 7/11/2018 at 1:10 AM, OCT 31 1978 said:

I just keep call you out on it.

Actually, I just called you out and you just proved that you can't back up shit. See above. 

 

On 7/11/2018 at 1:10 AM, OCT 31 1978 said:

I have never danced around anything

No you've just made really poor excuses for the fact that they knew ahead of time and didn't tell us. This is dishonesty in its most basic form, but you simply can't reconcile the fact that Gun Media would be dishonest with us. It's called "cognitive dissonance". Google it. 

 

On 7/11/2018 at 1:10 AM, OCT 31 1978 said:

Concerns dont = notification of ending content

Not sharing concerns = lack of transparency

Knowing the lawsuit would affect the game and not telling us immediately = dishonesty

This isn't trigonometry, son.

 

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i guess what confuses me about the whole thing is the "apparent" lack of communication. they knew going into this whole project they were going to attract a huge and loyal fanbase of a franchise. they also had to know that in todays times there is nothing that is a "secret" anything goin on in the world today can be found somehow and someway online. so they had to know sooner or later all this legal stuff would see the light of day and that they might be seen in a negative light when they didnt infrom us of what goin on. im saying we needed full details but just a heads up woulda went a very long way

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19 minutes ago, Brevator said:

So you can't prove otherwise. Gotch

I cant post the dialogue of nearly the entire thread in one post “kid.”

 

Quote

 

Actually, I just called you out and you just proved that you can't back up shit. See above. 

Proof is in your own posts.

 

 

Quote

 

No you've just made really poor excuses for the fact that they knew ahead of time and didn't tell us. This is dishonesty in its most basic form, but you simply can't reconcile the fact that Gun Media would be dishonest with us. It's called "cognitive dissonance". Google it. 

I didn’t make any excuses I said I didn’t have the facts....just like you don’t just  assumptions of dishonesty and misleading.

 

Quote

 

Not sharing concerns = lack of transparency

Knowing the lawsuit would affect the game and not telling us = dishonesty

This isn't trigonometry.

You don’t know whether they could at the time even tell us the lawsuit would be a problem you just keep assuming the worst with no proof.

you’re  right this isn’t trigonometry.....it’s a lot easier than that....opinions of how you feel about what’s going on are not facts....

Yet you are unable to click previous page on this thread and see your assumptions and opinions being posted as facts in every post.

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That's my entire issue, @sfosterjr

A simple statement from them at the time they began having concerns would have prevented all of this. Instead, they kept silent about it and went ahead with an engine upgrade. That's shady af, and I'm not going to apologize for questioning everything they've told us in light of their dishonesty.

It just goes hand-in-hand with their inconsistent communication and lack of transparency. But if you point these things out, you're a "conspiracy theorist", even if you've been defending this game and its developer for nearly a year. 

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6 minutes ago, sfosterjr said:

i guess what confuses me about the whole thing is the "apparent" lack of communication. they knew going into this whole project they were going to attract a huge and loyal fanbase of a franchise. they also had to know that in todays times there is nothing that is a "secret" anything goin on in the world today can be found somehow and someway online. so they had to know sooner or later all this legal stuff would see the light of day and that they might be seen in a negative light when they didnt infrom us of what goin on. im saying we needed full details but just a heads up woulda went a very long way

I agree communication has been vary lack luster....

and a lot of drama could be tackled head on if they would interact with the community more.

and at day one they severely underestimated this large fan base because we broke their servers....

 

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15 minutes ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

and at day one they severely underestimated this large fan base because we broke their servers....

i dont know how they could underestimate the fanbase?? look at all those guys in the NHL wearing decorated jason masks!! lol

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21 minutes ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

opinions of how you feel about what’s going on are not facts.

Nor have I ever presented them as such and you know it because you can't even cite one specific example. No one asked you to quote the entire thread, but your attempt to weasel out of your accusations now that you can't prove them is pretty gosh darn adorable. 

Once again, I'm quite flattered that you're attempting to take the focus off of Gun by putting it on me, but this isn't about me, kid. This is about Gun Media and their less-than-honest business practices. 

 

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On 7/11/2018 at 1:55 AM, Brevator said:

Nor have I ever presented them as such and you know it because you can't even cite one specific example. No one asked you to quote the entire thread, but your attempt to weasel out of your accusations now that you can't prove them is pretty gosh darn adorable. 

 

Glad you think it’s cute but me attaching 37 of your posts to mine might break this forum .

Trust me it’s your opinions that need proof To back them and make them facts and believable statements.

On 7/11/2018 at 1:58 AM, sfosterjr said:

snickers_google_mispeltcover_0.jpg

Mmmm lol

On 7/11/2018 at 1:55 AM, sfosterjr said:

i dont know how they could underestimate the fanbase?? look at all those guys in the NHL wearing decorated jason masks!! lol

I know right! They were expecting like 30,000 players on day one and 3x that many logged in and just tore those servers down...it took 45 minuets to 2 hours to find a session back then.

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16 minutes ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

Glad you think it’s cute but me attaching 37 of your posts to mine might break this forum .

Again, not sure how you interpreted "one specific example" to mean "37", but thanks for letting me know what a total weasel you are who can't even back up his claims. 

You can accuse me of pushing opinions or theories or whatever you like, but you can't erase the fact that Gun had concerns about the lawsuit and they didn't tell us.

Excuse it, apologize for it, distract us from it, but it's not going away and I believe it's obvious at this point that you're never going to shut me up about it so I'm not sure why you keep trying...

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Some people just can't deal with reality. 

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1 hour ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

concerns dont = notification of ending content.

But deep concerns should have motivated different decisions than the ones that were made. I am not a fan of the Titanic example in that it was too late to change course. These guys were changing course all the time, from the very beginning. They literally started a new game mode then just decided to scrap it because they didn’t find it fun. Never mind the game mode was already teased and promoted with a spot on the content road map, probably before even one line of code was written. That’s just one example.

I don’t believe that they weren’t able to change course on an engine upgrade they had just began work on in Feb 2018. If they were concerned even in Jan, that means a decision was made to continue on course despite legal concerns by the time they announced their plans in Feb. And these plans included delaying content that was already past schedule according to the road map. Anyone want to tell me how any of this makes sense? You have a lawsuit looming over your head and this is the decision you make?

This is why some clarity is needed on this topic, because without any other info on it, it makes zero sense.

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38 minutes ago, Tommy86 said:

But deep concerns should have motivated different decisions than the ones that were made. I am not a fan of the Titanic example in that it was too late to change course. These guys were changing course all the time, from the very beginning. They literally started a new game mode then just decided to scrap it because they didn’t find it fun. Never mind the game mode was already teased and promoted with a spot on the content road map, probably before even one line of code was written. That’s just one example.

I don’t believe that they weren’t able to change course on an engine upgrade they had just began work on in Feb 2018. If they were concerned even in Jan, that means a decision was made to continue on course despite legal concerns by the time they announced their plans in Feb. And these plans included delaying content that was already past schedule according to the road map. Anyone want to tell me how any of this makes sense? 

Deep concerns..... regular concerns it doesn’t Matter until a CAD is issued it will be business as usual for any company.

Not one member on this forum will be able to answer for why decisions were made as they were... we don’t have that information only Gun and Sean and the lawyers can...

but assuming that it’s all because of dishonesty or misleading or trying to make a cash grab..... by using a out of context post by Vincent and combining it with the original post by Gun..... is still an assumption made and  are not facts and should not be blasted to everyone here in the forum as if it is.

that info is out there if people want to come to those conclusion as there opinion that is fine. Just don’t post it like it’s a fact.

emotions are high enough the community is still upset .... if you truly believed that Gun was hiding it for sales and trying to make a cash grab we wouldn’t have videos of  content that was being created and worked on to be released mid July or talks about adding ghost Jason into the game.

what would be the point if in January they knew all hope of creating new content was known. They would have stopped then.....

I just keep say we don’t have the whole story and it may be awhile before we do.

And untill Gun posts about it or speaks out about it we won’t have all the facts and even after they do we still probably won’t.

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Anyone playing on Xbox here in the next 30 min? If so add me. MrBeefyMorris

 

Can we all agree that we are pissy about the state of the game and the shitty communication. They knew/didn't know/whatever, because all we have is a buggy pile of shit that we hopefully get fixed.

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14 minutes ago, MrBeefy said:

Anyone playing on Xbox here in the next 30 min? If so add me. MrBeefyMorris

 

Can we all agree that we are pissy about the state of the game and the shitty communication. They knew/didn't know/whatever, because all we have is a buggy pile of shit that we hopefully get fixed.

Yeah man I really want a known issues to the last patch thread .....and what is next on the bug fixes list...for the next patch/hot fix

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@OCT 31 1978 Well I am not yelling scam or cash grab, I am simply asking questions. I am also not particularly surprised at the conclusions that people are coming to, given the game’s history. I personally find Gun to be deeply dishonest, that is my opinion based on their interaction with the community and playerbase since the beginning. Just an opinion but it is one shared by many.

I also want to comment on this part of your post -

10 minutes ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

Deep concerns..... regular concerns it doesn’t Matter until a CAD is issued it will be business as usual for any company.

You’re right, deep concerns / regular concerns, that doesn’t matter too much. Because logically any kind of possible threat to them being able to release content that was already scheduled should’ve motivated them to prioritise that first and foremost. And in fact it was the engine upgrade that was a change in course from their original plans.

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****Wow what the hell is wrong with a lot of you people here??? *****

Jesus guys!! Come on I was one of the first few on the forums years ago and this was a relaxing fun community here!  Listen to yourselves... be nice chill 

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3 hours ago, Tommy86 said:

I think the remaining playerbase just wants closure on this topic honestly, some kind of reasonable explanation for why things went down the way they did. That’s all there is to it really, people invested a lot of time into the game, and some even invested a lot of money such as the higher tier backers. Some are still waiting to have promises delivered with little to no news.

The way the whole situation was handled by Gun simply wasn’t good enough, considering the game’s history from start to end and the astonishingly poor communication throughout. This is why Gun continues to get so much criticism, and this is what I’d like anyone who is unabashedly defending them to understand. The criticism is not without good reason.

   I was not a backer... but if I would have known about it during the kickstarter, I would have thrown some money into it... Love the franchise... love the game, even with all of its buggy goodness.... or I would not still be here.
   I understand what you are saying and agree with you. I would like closure on these matters as well... but I am not going to hold my breath, we could be waiting a long time for that. I follow what is going on to the best of my ability. But I do not know any more than anyone else that has been following the issues. Sorting through the bullshit takes time... and you have to admit, there is a lot of bullshit out there along with what we know to be true. More information will come, eventually... the truth will always show its ugly face whether someone wants it to or not, but sometimes it takes patience. The truth may not be very pretty, but lies are truly disgusting.
   There are many things Gun/Illfonic could have handled better than they did... there could even be more than we know about that could have been handled better. But the silence against the criticism is deafening... This is the problem, someone not speaking in their own defense is almost unilaterally viewed as guilty... even if they are not. With this situation, a few more tidbits of information, depending on what the information is... could make things better, but could also make things much worse... and all we ever get are tidbits that really do not explain much and just beg more questions. Its a screwed up situation from every angle.

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7 minutes ago, PowellCampsNAKED said:

****Wow what the hell is wrong with a lot of you people here??? *****

Jesus guys!! Come on I was one of the first few on the forums years ago and this was a relaxing fun community here!  Listen to yourselves... be nice chill 

The chill people are in a different thread, down in off topic. Something about a coma, so kinda on topic. 

They’re just chasing their tails, as long as they’re civil, don’t get involved. 

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5 hours ago, Brevator said:

Wes confirmed that Grendel was to be the last map, which further supports the notion that Gun knew about this earlier than they let on. Part of me thinks that they had hoped to have it out before the deadline, but then they bewilderingly chose to upgrade the engine instead, which makes absolutely no sense to me, unless they knew it was impossible at that point and were just stalling until the last possible minute. 

 

Wes confirmed that interview saying Grendel was the last map was fake. So there goes that little theory of yours.

 

4 hours ago, Brevator said:

What I do know is this: They were, at the very least, concerned about the lawsuit's effect on the game, regardless if they knew to what extent it would affect the game, and at no point did anyone from Gun Media share those concerns with the people buying their game. 

Of course they were fucking concerned with the lawsuit. It wasn't supposed to effect them, but I guarantee it was still in the back of their minds since day one. That doesn't mean there was anything devious going on. FFS

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@Tommy86

Listen, you have always been level headed with your posts and you are more then entitled to your opinions and conclusions you can feel however you want about the developers.  

And there is nothing wrong with asking for answers to questions a lot of us want answered......at the end of the day will it change anything.....No.

Most of us backers deserved more communication then we got.

. But we did get what we backed at the end of the day even with all the bugs included.

A friday the 13th experiences like no other. 

I can’t speak for why the developers switched focus to the engine upgrade it is another question that I would love answered....many assumptions could be made... that it was to fix present and pre-existing bugs get ready for dedicated servers for consoles these are some of the reasons we were given....but who knows...my point is..... this community is here because we love the game / franchise and what limited future is left shouldn’t be shrouded in why didn’t Gun and illfonic do this or that or make this choice or that choice.... we should be pushing for fixes that will expand the longevity of what we have now and still need.

client side saves....

local hosting after dedicated servers are done.....

the bug fixes that will hopefully allow this game to run like a polished and finished game instead of a beta version.

 

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13 minutes ago, Ahab said:

There are many things Gun/Illfonic could have handled better than they did... there could even be more than we know about that could have been handled better. But the silence against the criticism is deafening... This is the problem, someone not speaking in their own defense is almost unilaterally viewed as guilty... even if they are not. With this situation, a few more tidbits of information, depending on what the information is... could make things better, but could also make things much worse... and all we ever get are tidbits that really do not explain much and just beg more questions. Its a screwed up situation from every angle.

Yeah I agree with what you’ve written in this post. Particularly this part since you’re correct that the silence does them no favours. More info could be for the better or possibly worse, but out of the two scenarios I think providing any info they can is the more ethical one and would show they are at least trying to communicate. But they have really addressed very little, whether that’s because they can’t or simply don’t care to, I just don’t know. Based on their past interactions with the community, I lean more towards that they don’t care.

Anyway I’m not here demanding answers, I’m just putting forth the questions that have been in my mind since the announcement, and I think they are legitimate ones that people who do care enough to look into it have a better starting point. My time on the forums and with the game is nearly up, I will be releasing a series of final guides and that will be it. I don’t mind leaving a few bread crumbs on this topic in the meantime since it has understandably struck a chord with me too. 

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More posts like these, I actually feel like posting in this thread now......

I think @Ahab already said what I wanted to add, so hopefully the conversation can keep moving in this direction and I’ll have something to add. 

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