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NHA Director Responds to Out of Context Quote

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7 minutes ago, Brevator said:

Since the game is still available to buy on all platforms, I assume they still have the license.

Well I could also assume since the discs were manufactured before the cut off ... that is why they are still able to sell them....but we both don’t have the answer 

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2 minutes ago, 2moar said:

And even a few words, would help the forums a lot. If they can't talk about stuff, say we can't comment, dont go silent.

If they were so inclined, they could shed light on the whole situation in just one post and settle the playerbase down. Certain things they may not be able to talk about, but I’m also sure there is much they can talk about. They just don’t seem to want to, or care enough to. 

The most burning questions that people want definite answers to are these, and they are simple -

1. When exactly did they learn of the lawsuit’s possible effect on the game?

2. If it was prior to the engine upgrade (Feb 2018), why did they choose to go ahead with it instead of pushing content?

Additionally -

3. If the reason was dedicated servers, why would they prioritise servers over content? Knowing that they may not be able to recoup costs with DLC to even help support the servers in the future.

4. Why was Uber left unreleased when even Wes’ own statement reveals there was only minimal work required to finish him? And could’ve been legally done since he was already in the game from as far back as Dec 2017.

If someone from Gun were to jump on right now and answer these questions, the whole situation could change. But the longer they remain unanswered, the more people will just continue digging on their own which is not favourable for Gun.  

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12 minutes ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

Well I could also assume since the discs were manufactured before the cut off ... that is why they are still able to sell them....but we both don’t have the answer we are making an assumption........

Well to be fair, they are still selling it digitally, and the DLC as well, so they still have the license... for now. Wes said they can keep selling what they have already made, so they will probably have the license for a while yet, although quite possibly not as long as the lawsuit will take.

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5 hours ago, Big Daddy J said:

Well to be fair, they are still selling it digitally, and the DLC as well, so they still have the license... for now. Wes said they can keep selling what they have already made, so they will probably have the license for a while yet, although quite possibly not as long as the lawsuit will take.

Good points

 

5 hours ago, Tommy86 said:

If they were so inclined, they could shed light on the whole situation in just one post and settle the playerbase down. Certain things they may not be able to talk about, but I’m also sure there is much they can talk about. They just don’t seem to want to, or care enough to. 

The most burning questions that people want definite answers to are these, and they are simple -

1. When exactly did they learn of the lawsuit’s possible effect on the game?

2. If it was prior to the engine upgrade (Feb 2018), why did they choose to go ahead with it instead of pushing content?

Additionally -

3. If the reason was dedicated servers, why would they prioritise servers over content? Knowing that they may not be able to recoup costs with DLC to even help support the servers in the future.

4. Why was Uber left unreleased when even Wes’ own statement reveals there was only minimal work required to finish him? And could’ve been legally done since he was already in the game from as far back as Dec 2017.

If someone from Gun were to jump on right now and answer these questions, the whole situation could change. But the longer they remain unanswered, the more people will just continue digging on their own which is not favourable for Gun.  

I wouldn’t be opposed to hearing answers to these questions.... but honestly no answer is going to change anything except  our personal opinions of Gun media and Illfonic....

I would rather find out about....

when we will get client side saves ...

what the next bug fixes will be....

a known issue to the last patch notes....

and a dedicated servers update for console update...

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7 hours ago, NScarlato said:

Can we please stop suggesting more kickstarters for these people?   I understand financing, licensing fees and overhead both as an attorney and a business owner myself.   But to suggest we should throw money at them to fix a shoddy product when we already purchased the product and others funded the project to begin with is a bit much. This game made them millions of dollars and I’m sure those profits are being funneled into the new game they are developing and not the game that made them the money to begin with. 

Enough is enough. 

This is a valid point. As a business owner you know that your #1 goal as an owner is to stay in business and business doesn’t alway align with what your preferences are.

As of this moment Friday the 13th: The Game can no longer be expanded so it doesn’t make sense to commit large sums of resources for content. Bug patches are probably cheaper than content creation, but dedicated servers are going in at some point. I am sure those aren’t cheap. At least, it doesn’t sound cheap. The money we invested is going into those items right now. 

Friday the 13th: The Game did well but that money won’t last forever. Once they complete the f13 patchwork, a new game is pretty much essential to helping them survive long enough for this stupid lawsuit to reach its bitter end. We can speculate all we want but Gun’s focus right now has to be to stay in business, so I can’t blame them for being excited about a new project.

One day its going to be like one of those dude looking over his shoulder memes. The devs with their arm around their new game, but they can’t help but looking back at Chad’s sweet ass. 

If that ever happens, I’d happily take part in whatever they needed from the fan base. 

 

5 hours ago, Tommy86 said:

If they were so inclined, they could shed light on the whole situation in just one post and settle the playerbase down. Certain things they may not be able to talk about, but I’m also sure there is much they can talk about. They just don’t seem to want to, or care enough to. 

The most burning questions that people want definite answers to are these, and they are simple -

1. When exactly did they learn of the lawsuit’s possible effect on the game?

2. If it was prior to the engine upgrade (Feb 2018), why did they choose to go ahead with it instead of pushing content?

Additionally -

3. If the reason was dedicated servers, why would they prioritise servers over content? Knowing that they may not be able to recoup costs with DLC to even help support the servers in the future.

4. Why was Uber left unreleased when even Wes’ own statement reveals there was only minimal work required to finish him? And could’ve been legally done since he was already in the game from as far back as Dec 2017.

If someone from Gun were to jump on right now and answer these questions, the whole situation could change. But the longer they remain unanswered, the more people will just continue digging on their own which is not favourable for Gun.  

1 and 2 sound like legal nightmares. 

3 is sort of dependent on 1. If they didnt know or were told the case was going to be concluded, that was simply the long term strategy of a much longer schedule of work. One that would take lots of funding for a long period of time. 

Makes me believe that the answer to 1 was about as much time as the captain of the Titanic had to swerve around that iceburg. 

4 Is a good one. I know would have happily taken a half baked Uber as a consolation prize along with the bad news. I’m not losing sleep over it though

Took me a while to read through the pages but I am hearing you all loud and clear.


I think one misconception is that somehow everyone thinks I referred to them as an ungrateful sob. That is not the case at all. After reading through these comments I can see plenty of members who know how to state you case and raise valid arguments. There are a few SOBS as well, but it wouldn't be a Friday forum without those either.  

I also get that all of you want to know every single detail of every decision that was made, but twisting words and committing to toxic speculation is not the answer. That's what brought me here in the first place. What's kept me here is an engaging conversation that I have enjoyed very much. 

To those of you who have asked very fair questions, my advice for you is to be patient. It's not worth the stress or losing sleep over. There are plenty of other things to talk about other than speculation of what happened. Personally I'd rather stop going around in circles about the fate of the game and the law suit, but rather what things should be done once the lawsuit has concluded.  Can anyone point me to thread where everyone is discussing that? 

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14 minutes ago, damnenchiladas said:

To those of you who have asked very fair questions, my advice for you is to be patient. It's not worth the stress or losing sleep over. There are plenty of other things to talk about other than speculation of what happened. Personally I'd rather stop going around in circles about the fate of the game and the law suit, but rather what things should be done once the lawsuit has concluded.  Can anyone point me to thread where everyone is discussing that? 

Unfortunately there is nothing that will be done once the lawsuit passes. Gun have said as much themselves, although I don’t have the quote ready to post. But you can probably find it easily enough. The gist of it is that even if the lawsuit were to be resolved tomorrow, they are never coming back to the game. Even Victor Miller himself was under the impression the game would continue after lawsuit, but no such thing will happen according to Gun. They can’t be paying staff to do nothing after all for x amount of time.

About the previous post -

1 hour ago, damnenchiladas said:

1 and 2 sound like legal nightmares. 

3 is sort of dependent on 1. If they didnt know or were told the case was going to be concluded, that was simply the long term strategy of a much longer schedule of work. One that would take lots of funding for a long period of time. 

I think most people would understand that they cannot give specifics on the subject, and I don’t believe anyone is really hounding them for that either. I could even retract that question, and not even bother asking exactly when they knew. Because all that really matters, and all anyone wants to know, is a reasonable explanation for their decision making after finding out (whenever that may have been).

That engine upgrade is the #1 thing people have been bringing up, specifically why they took on such a gargantuan task with high risk of problems (which did rear their head after all) instead of pushing content. Even a basic explanation why would help the situation.

Their reputation is completely tarnished now, not just according to me but majority of the playerbase, and I would think they would want to enact some kind of damage control by providing even a little bit of info behind their actions. I’m in no way losing sleep over it but I do think people do have a right to know whatever it is Gun are safe to reveal. And I think it would be in their own best interests to reveal that - otherwise there is simply more motivation for people to find out on their own.

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7 hours ago, The Doctor said:

Thanks. I thought they looked pretty good, honestly. Some of those can look really bad or really obvious. I thought the effect was pretty spot on. Did you end up wearing any padding or anything to bulk up Jason? Don't know how tall you are. I thought your interpretation was buff and menacing but not 'roided out goofy looking either.

I am not sure how many of you know this but there were two Jason actors in the film. Myself and a stunt performer by the name of Bryan Forrest. Bryan is a trained stunt performer and took over on a few occasions when stunts and camera work were at their highest complexity. To move fast enough to get all of the shots, I had to be behind camera. That, and if I somehow got hurt during the stunts, the film would have basically been over. 

To keep Bryan and I looking similar, we wore a set of stunt pads that created the body shape. Bryan also took real punches, a chair to his chest, and even an accidental haymaker to the face from Drew that ended up splitting Drew's knuckle. The point is the pads were mostly there to keep Bryan safe and I wore them to keep a consistent look.

 I am 6'3 225 and Bryan is about 6'2 215. Since I never took Jason to be a weight lifter, Bryan and I pretty much fit the right size for what I think makes a good Jason. In costume all of the elements had us up around 6'4" - 6'5." The padding added a little bulk but I still wanted a Jason that felt like he was starting to enter longer term stages of decay. That's why the mask reveal had no eyes. Ghost Jason truly is the vengeful spirit of Jason Voorhees trapped in a decomposing body, the un-living embodiment of the "Death Curse". 

 

57 minutes ago, Tommy86 said:

Unfortunately there is nothing that will be done once the lawsuit passes. Gun have said as much themselves, although I don’t have the quote ready to post. But you can probably find it easily enough. The gist of it is that even if the lawsuit were to be resolved tomorrow, they are never coming back to the game. Even Victor Miller himself was under the impression the game would continue after lawsuit, but no such thing will happen according to Gun. They can’t be paying staff to do nothing after all for x amount of time.

About the previous post -

I think most people would understand that they cannot give specifics on the subject, and I don’t believe anyone is really hounding them for that either. I could even retract that question, and not even bother asking exactly when they knew. Because all that really matters, and all anyone wants to know, is a reasonable explanation for their decision making after finding out (whenever that may have been).

That engine upgrade is the #1 thing people have been bringing up, specifically why they took on such a gargantuan task with high risk of problems (which did rear their head after all) instead of pushing content. Even a basic explanation why would help the situation.

Their reputation is completely tarnished now, not just according to me but majority of the playerbase, and I would think they would want to enact some kind of damage control by providing even a little bit of info behind their actions. I’m in no way losing sleep over it but I do think people do have a right to know whatever it is Gun are safe to reveal. And I think it would be in their own best interests to reveal that - otherwise there is simply more motivation for people to find out on their own.

 
All good points but the best thing Gun can do right now to win people back is to focus on the next patch and dedicated servers and ignore all distractions.

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19 minutes ago, damnenchiladas said:

 
All good points but the best thing Gun can do right now to win people back is to focus on the next patch and dedicated servers and ignore all distractions.

Well technically that is not in their hands anymore. Illfonic is running the show now, they are the ones still working on patches / maintenance which is the only work that is allowed to continue. Gun’s involvement would be minimal at best now, and as far as I know, they are already onto the next project in collaboration with Bloober.

For dedicated servers they have an unnamed partner in charge of them who we have never received any info on whatsoever. In fact any info about dedicated servers at all is extremely vague. I am assuming because of NDA.

Also here is the thread regarding any content post-lawsuit:

Questions About Future Content

“Is there a chance of any content being added to the game if a ruling on the dispute occurs in the near future? The answer is no.” - Wes

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@damnenchiladas Thank you for the in-depth response. I wasn't expecting that kind of detail but I do appreciate the finer points of how you and your team approached the movie-making process. Everything came together perfectly except for the one minor detail where the foot-steps were a bit heavy-handed, but you probably are already well aware of that. While I look forward to any future projects, namely NHA2, anything else you have in store that's different? Keep up the good work and never stop pursuing that dream. You have a real knack for what you do.

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34 minutes ago, The Doctor said:

While I look forward to any future projects, namely NHA2, anything else you have in store that's different? Keep up the good work and never stop pursuing that dream. You have a real knack for what you do.

I agree, NHA was very well done. I would watch another project of his for sure. 

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10 hours ago, Tommy86 said:

If they were so inclined, they could shed light on the whole situation in just one post and settle the playerbase down. Certain things they may not be able to talk about, but I’m also sure there is much they can talk about. They just don’t seem to want to, or care enough to. 

The most burning questions that people want definite answers to are these, and they are simple -

1. When exactly did they learn of the lawsuit’s possible effect on the game?

2. If it was prior to the engine upgrade (Feb 2018), why did they choose to go ahead with it instead of pushing content?

Additionally -

3. If the reason was dedicated servers, why would they prioritise servers over content? Knowing that they may not be able to recoup costs with DLC to even help support the servers in the future.

4. Why was Uber left unreleased when even Wes’ own statement reveals there was only minimal work required to finish him? And could’ve been legally done since he was already in the game from as far back as Dec 2017.

If someone from Gun were to jump on right now and answer these questions, the whole situation could change. But the longer they remain unanswered, the more people will just continue digging on their own which is not favourable for Gun.  

They have a panel at Mad Monster in Arizona this weekend. Interested to see what kind of info comes out of it.

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6 minutes ago, Dogmatic said:

They have a panel at Mad Monster in Arizona this weekend. Interested to see what kind of info comes out of it.

You should expect nothing relevant on this topic to come from them. If all of the controversy around recent events wasn’t enough to make them talk, then a guest panel certainly won’t be enough to either.

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Even if they're not allowed to say anything, they could at least say, "We're not allowed to say anything". It'll have been a month tomorrow since Wes' initial post on the subject, and they still haven't said...well, anything.

Honestly, I would be much more understanding of their position if they had just been upfront with us in the first place. But as @Tommy86 pointed out, their official statement shows that they weren't.

"When we originally learned that the game fell within the crosshairs of this legal dispute, we tried to balance the creation of new content requested by our fans against the maintenance and bug fixing that our community expects and deserves. We attempted to do both within the limits of the legal case." - Gun Media

That's all well and good and perfectly understandable, but at any point did they attempt to let the community in on any of this? I think we all know the answer to that question. The fact that they deliberately neglected to inform us of the potential legal ramifications as soon as they knew, combined with every mind-boggling decision they've made since January (not the least of which was prioritizing a game-breaking engine upgrade over already-advertised content) implies total and utter incompetence at best and blatant deception at worst. Personally, I've moved beyond giving them the benefit of the doubt.

Funny how much can change in 30 days.

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nice well thought out post, but i'm not sure it will matter to anyone, its sad that we have really 3 kind of people on the forums,

those who think we dont deserve anything and we should just be happy we got a game at all

those who are putting in a lot of thought and looking into things and asking pretty dang reasonable questions

and finally the trolls and jerks, who are trying to exploit both of the other users.

 

And like I've said before, it actually really nice to have someone actually come and put something in context, even if its not 100% about where the game is, and is just because of some reddit drama.

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@Brevator

Either way there would be unrest. Pushing out thr additional content to be broken as well would make some players leave. 

Then again lack of future content kills it for other parties. It was a lose/lost situation to be fair.

 

My issue, along with other people is how long did they know? They could have created polls to ask the community where priorities lie.

@Tommy86 i think those same questions are burning within a lot of us. Knowingly selling a game you know is about to be done seems unethical to me. Simple statements could have avoided a lot of the current ugliness.

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1 hour ago, TheHansonGoons said:

Either way there would be unrest. Pushing out thr additional content to be broken as well would make some players leave. 

Then again lack of future content kills it for other parties. It was a lose/lost situation to be fair.

Perhaps, but I feel like there would have been much less backlash if they'd simply said something along the lines of, "Due to the ongoing legal battle over the rights to the F13 franchise, we are primarily dedicating ourselves to putting out as much content as possible while we still can. We will squash the big bugs where we are able, but for now, our focus has to be on delivering the content we promised, before it is no longer legal for us to do so. Afterwards, we can turn our attention to patches and bug fixes."

That would've assuaged most of us, and sounds a helluva lot better than what they actually did... 

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5 minutes ago, Brevator said:

Perhaps, but I feel like there would have been much less backlash if they'd simply said something along the lines of, "Due to the ongoing legal battle over the rights to the F13 franchise, we are primarily dedicating ourselves to putting out as much content as possible while we still can. We will squash the big bugs where we can, but for now, our focus has to be on delivering the content we promised, before it is no longer legal for us to do so. Afterwards, we can turn our attention to patches and bug fixes."

That would've assuaged most of us, and sounds a helluva lot better than what they actually did... 

It's easy to say that after the fact. But being around these forums since BETA and the track record of players this would absolutely have not led to less backlash. I'm 99.9% certain it would've created a bigger hell storm than we have already. Either way...all of this is moot. Gun isn't going to respond to anymore questions nor should they. I certainly wouldn't only because answering these questions from the player base isn't going to change anything. The damage has been done and has been happening throughout this games life cycle. It's damned if they do, damned if they don't scenario. Although I don't agree with a majority of  decisions they've made with this game they've made them and now they have to face the future consequence of those decisions. I for one will never ever ever buy or fund a game from Gun or Illfonic again. Amateurs to the highest degree.

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I fail to see how being upfront about their knowledge of the lawsuit's affect on the game would have created a bigger hellstorm than telling us that content had to be placed on hold for an engine-upgrade while misleadingly acting like content was still coming...honesty is always the best policy, but Gun obviously chose to go in a different direction. 

And maybe their answers wouldn't change anything, but that doesn't make us any less deserving of them, nor am I less inclined to continue seeking them. 

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2 hours ago, Dogmatic said:

They have a panel at Mad Monster in Arizona this weekend. Interested to see what kind of info comes out of it.

I will be there. 

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4 hours ago, undrtkr said:

It's easy to say that after the fact. But being around these forums since BETA and the track record of players this would absolutely have not led to less backlash. I'm 99.9% certain it would've created a bigger hell storm than we have already. Either way...all of this is moot. Gun isn't going to respond to anymore questions nor should they. I certainly wouldn't only because answering these questions from the player base isn't going to change anything. The damage has been done and has been happening throughout this games life cycle. It's damned if they do, damned if they don't scenario. Although I don't agree with a majority of  decisions they've made with this game they've made them and now they have to face the future consequence of those decisions. I for one will never ever ever buy or fund a game from Gun or Illfonic again. Amateurs to the highest degree.

I agree 100% none of it matters anymore we should be looking forward to the next bug fixes and client side saves and dedicated servers longevity..

 

4 hours ago, Brevator said:

I fail to see how being upfront about their knowledge of the lawsuit's affect on the game would have created a bigger hellstorm than telling us that content had to be placed on hold for an engine-upgrade while misleadingly acting like content was still coming...honesty is always the best policy, but Gun obviously chose to go in a different direction. 

And maybe their answers wouldn't change anything, but that doesn't make us any less deserving of them, nor am I less inclined to continue seeking them. 

Gun did have intent to release more content....  there are models, motion capture, and a new map and discussions about adding Ghost Jason !! How is that trying to mislead if you are doing the work !

this doesn’t sound like a company trying to cut bait and run.

there are more interviews with Wes saying Jason x would be released around this time if the lawsuit hadn’t changed things.... stop pushing your opinions as facts saying  Gun was misleading everyone is not a fact it is your assumption.....

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2 hours ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

there are more interviews with Wes saying Jason x would be released around this time if the lawsuit hadn’t changed things.... stop pushing your opinions as facts saying  Gun was misleading everyone is not a fact it is your assumption.....

I can't believe I even have to say this, but this isn't about Jason X. This is about why Gun Media chose deception instead of honesty. 

What part of "They knew the lawsuit would affect the game and they didn't tell us" are you not getting? That's not my "opinion", son, that's a fact that Gun themselves confirmed with their official statement. Read it again until it sinks in. They knew before June. 

Going by the timeline of Killer Puzzle announcing an end to their content in January, coupled with Gun's announcement around the same time that content would have to be "put on hold" for an engine upgrade, it doesn't take a genius to figure out how long they knew. Yet they still proceeded as if everything was fine, as if the lawsuit didn't exist at all, and not once did they even cryptically tell us that there's a possibility that the rest of the content might not be coming. Nope, they waited until the absolute last minute and acted as though the whole thing just came out of left field. That's the definition of misleading. 

Sorry, but in my OPINION (there, happy, kid?) we were misled with that engine upgrade, and no amount of salt towards me is going to make that go away. 

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19 minutes ago, Brevator said:

I can't believe I even have to say this, but this isn't about Jason X. This is about why Gun Media chose deception instead of honesty. 

What part of "They knew the lawsuit would affect the game and they didn't tell us" are you not getting? That's not my "opinion", son, that's a fact that Gun themselves confirmed with their official statement. Read it again until it sinks in. They knew before June. 

Going by the timeline of Killer Puzzle announcing an end to their content in January, coupled with Gun's announcement around the same time that content would have to be "put on hold" for an engine upgrade, and it doesn't take a genius to figure out how long they knew. Yet they still proceeded as if everything was fine, and not once did they even cryptically tell us that the rest of the content might not be coming. Nope, they waited until the absolute last minute and acted as though the whole thing just came out of left field. That's the definition of misleading. 

Sorry, but in my OPINION (there, happy, kid?) we were misled with that engine upgrade, and no amount of salt towards me is going to make that go away. 

I guess all that is left to do than is get over it and move on.

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2 minutes ago, Manny1985 said:

I guess all that is left to do than is get over it and move on.

Hmmmmmm...

Nope. 

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1 minute ago, Brevator said:

Hmmmmmm...

Nope. 

Ok then, continue to wallow in your own self pity than, and hold resentment to a "truth" you cannot prove without a reasonable doubt. Even if you are right, and the developers knew about the pending lawsuit halting all future content, what do you get out of being right? Nothing....maybe an ego boast?

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