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NHA Director Responds to Out of Context Quote

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20 minutes ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

They have posted already about not being able to say anything about the lawsuit.

what you want from them is more info to try to place blame as to why this wasn’t done or that wasn’t done and the developers don’t need that from some “rando” on their forum pushing some conspiracy theory to make themselves feel better.

but if constantly spewing your opinion heavy negativity is your thing you do you....

I'm demanding information as a consumer to know whether or not I should invest in their next project. I even suggested they seek the license for Michael Myers a couple weeks ago, but given the recent developments, I'm not sure I want them to have it.

Clearly you know nothing about consumerism or the ethics of business and are only here to white knight for Gun Media at the cost of logic and reason and civil discussion.

This is my last reply to your comments. I have no further use for you. Good evening.

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1 minute ago, NScarlato said:

And you don’t know that it wasn’t.  Even the $80 M top line of sales doesn’t account for DLC and sales after they stopped reporting.  They also made this money before the game was ever for sale under $40.  

Starting from nothing and needing a kickstarter to earning that much top lines mean you made some dough unless you are a terrible businessman. 

My point is that even if the game was as profitable as we are assuming.... who cares that has no Bearing on the lawsuit or the end of new content....

I am fine with them making money.

I am a slasher backer... I got what I backed for form this game so far do I want more of Course I do we all do....do I want it to run smoother hell yes I do...

 

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38 minutes ago, Brevator said:

Okay, fine let's say 75%. I think @DasMurich's estimate of $70 - $80 million is probably accurate.

 

 

Fair enough, but it obviously hasn't disappeared yet, unlike the communication from Gun Media...

I'm well aware that license-holders take their cut, which is why I believe Sean Cunningham was so eager to hand them the license to begin with.

ROFL you really have no clue, do you?

Publisher makes 30%, Developer makes 15% Other money goes to the retailer and to the console maker and advertising. 

Gun Media then made a grand total of 12 dollars per unit sold.  As of August 1.8m units sold.  I'd generously say they sold another 500k since then.  I'm unsure of if the publisher/developer makes more money when you knock the retailer out, digital download, or if that just goes to the Amazon's, PS Store, Xbox Store, Steam store.  

And then there's whatever side deal they have with Cunningham for the licensing, it's probably a percentage...whatever deal they have with Hodder himself, also likely a percentage. 

Being extremely generous, they've likely only made about half of what you think.  I'd say more like a third. 

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2 minutes ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

My point is that even if the game was as profitable as we are assuming.... who cares that has no Bearing on the lawsuit or the end of new content....

I am fine with them making money.

I am a slasher backer... I got what I backed for form this game so far do I want more of Course I do we all do....do I want it to run smoother hell yes I do...

 

I’m fine with them making money also.  But I’m not fine with this “let’s kickstart bug fixes” we are getting into here.  What’s next - bug fixes as DLc?

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35 minutes ago, Brevator said:

Yeah, again, I'd feel much better about it if this were coming from them, and not some rando

Good thing they have literally stated they can't speak on the lawsuit then, hmm?

27 minutes ago, Brevator said:

A game that they've already told us will not be getting any new content at all ever until the end of time, even if this gets resolved.

You really just don't get it. At all. This lawsuit will likely go on for at LEAST another year, probably more due to appeals. Do you expect the devs at Illfonic to sit around twiddling their thumbs? No, they will all need to move on to new projects. They will move on to new games and will not just be able to drop everything and come back when this all settles. That's simply not how game development works. It won't be feasible to come back to this game in  a few years when when the lawsuit is over. It's just common damn sense.

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3 minutes ago, NScarlato said:

I’m fine with them making money also.  But I’m not fine with this “let’s kickstart bug fixes” we are getting into here.  What’s next - bug fixes as DLc?

I agree they don’t need more of our money they need to make the game the most polished it can be for all platforms with out cost to us.

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Just now, OCT 31 1978 said:

I agree they don’t need more of our money they need to make the game the most polished it can be for all platforms with out cost to us.

Unfortunately that's not the way the real/business world works.

This game has zero future earnings potential, so once Gun and Ill decide they're done throwing money away on a sinking ship, they'll cut bait and just leave this to die while working on another project. 

It's just like poker, if you have a losing hand, you just don't keep putting money in the middle. 

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6 minutes ago, Big Daddy J said:

Goo thing they have literally stated they can't speak on the lawsuit then, hmm?

When exactly did they say this? Can you give me a specific quote?
 

 

6 minutes ago, Big Daddy J said:

 That's simply not how game development works. It won't be feasible to come back to this game in  a few years when when the lawsuit is over. It's just common damn sense.



Yeah, "it's just common sense", despite the fact that, as many others have repeatedly pointed out, there are several games that have released content as long as ten year after development had stopped. But please, tell me more about game how development works, I can't wait to learn more...I'm sure you've developed dozens.

 

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4 minutes ago, Big Daddy J said:

It won't be feasible to come back to this game in  a few years when when the lawsuit is over. It's just common damn sense.

I'd like your opinion on that hypothetical though: how would you react if another company were willing and able to take up that task?

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2 minutes ago, Brevator said:

When exactly did they say this? Can you give me a specific quote?
 

 



Yeah, "it's just common sense", despite the fact that, as many others have repeatedly pointed out, there are several games that have released content as long as ten year after development had stopped. But please, tell me more about game how development works, I can't wait to learn more...I'm sure you've developed dozens.

 

Give an example of a game that has released content 10 years later, especially a console game.

In 10 years, PS4 and XBone will both be dead and buried. 

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28 minutes ago, Brevator said:

I'm demanding information as a consumer to know whether or not I should invest in their next project. I even suggested they seek the license for Michael Myers a couple weeks ago, but given the recent developments, I'm not sure I want them to have it.

Clearly you know nothing about consumerism or the ethics of business and are only here to white knight for Gun Media at the cost of logic and reason and civil discussion.

This is my last reply to your comments. I have no further use for you. Good evening.

No problem on that being your last post to me.

it seems from your negativity and heavy “fact “ based opinions that you have already decided whether you would support Guns next project.

I am sure several of us members here have.

The answers you are looking for will not change anything......you have the director of NHA telling you they didn’t know the lawsuit would effect them Gun said it and Sean’s Lawyer said it but no amount of info is good enough because you already have your opinion and that’s how it is or in this case must have been.......That Gun media took your money and ran with it after you bought a “buggy “ game that you probably spent more than several hours playing and enjoying! Especially since you even said you would like them to make a Michael Myers game.

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6 minutes ago, SirMang said:

Give an example of a game that has released content 10 years later, especially a console game.

In 10 years, PS4 and XBone will both be dead and buried. 

Not for nothing but PAYDAY 2 launched in 2013 on consoles, re-released on next gens a year later I believe and has been steady drip with content updates still to this day.

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6 minutes ago, Brevator said:

When exactly did they say this? Can you give me a specific quote?
 

 



Yeah, "it's just common sense", despite the fact that, as many others have repeatedly pointed out, there are several games that have released content as long as ten year after development had stopped. But please, tell me more about game how development works, I can't wait to learn more...I'm sure you've developed dozens.

 

Wow... you really DON"T get it. Those special cases of developers coming back to old games was a privilege and a very rare thing.

You people just like to say for every damn argument "But *INSERT SOMETHING SOMEONE ELSE DID* happened *INSERT TIME THING HAPPENED* so if it happened then, it can happen now!" THAT ISN"T A VALID ARGUMENT. You are comparing different games, with different levels of developers, at different periods of time. Just because somone else once did something does not mean it is viable in this situation. It's not a fucking relevant statement.

But clearly nothing anyone says is going to penetrate that granite skull of yours.

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12 minutes ago, SirMang said:

Unfortunately that's not the way the real/business world works.

This game has zero future earnings potential, so once Gun and Ill decide they're done throwing money away on a sinking ship, they'll cut bait and just leave this to die while working on another project. 

It's just like poker, if you have a losing hand, you just don't keep putting money in the middle. 

I understand that....

Gun has said all they are able to do from this point on is bug fixes and maintenance...

I won’t pay or put any money into a Kickstarter for that.

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2 minutes ago, The Doctor said:

Not for nothing but PAYDAY 2 launched in 2013 on consoles, re-released on next gens a year later I believe and has been steady drip with content updates still to this day.

Released in 2013, re-released on next gens in 2015, some dlc released in 2017. 

 

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8 minutes ago, OCT 31 1978 said:

you have the director of NHA telling you they didn’t know the lawsuit would effect them Gun said it and Sean’s Lawyer said it

Alright, I lied. This is my last response to you.

1.) Vince's testimony (if you actually read it and comprehend it) confirms that they not only knew about the lawsuit as early as January but that they were also concerned that it would affect the game. Yet they acted as if nothing was wrong and all the content advertised in the Virtual Cabin was still coming. It wasn't until the absolute last minute that they informed us it would never be coming, and they acted as if they were totally blindsided by it, even though Vince said they knew as early as January.

2.) Of course Sean and his lawyer would say that. They wanted to sell a game with their license on it. They have every motivation to be dishonest.

In all likelihood, Sean Cunningham likely took advantage of an indy developer to make a quick buck, the same way he took advantage of a young writer named Victor Miller back in 1979. But Gun Media is still responsible in some capacity for not being completely honest about the potential legal restriction that the lawsuit would have on their game. If you want to continue to give your money to a company that is less than honest with its backers, that's your problem, not mine.

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4 minutes ago, The Doctor said:

Not for nothing but PAYDAY 2 launched in 2013 on consoles, re-released on next gens a year later I believe and has been steady drip with content updates still to this day.

These game may not have a licensing agreement also.

Especially one tied up in a legal battle.

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Just now, Big Daddy J said:

Wow... you really DON"T get it. Those special cases of developers coming back to old games was a privilege and a very rare thing.

 

That's what I was going to say. No one is saying there is a law against doing it, they are just there are very logical and compelling reasons why people don't support a game after it's no longer profitable. Just because one or two people did it for their specific game and for their specific reasons doesn't suddenly make it industry standard.

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5 minutes ago, The Doctor said:

Not for nothing but PAYDAY 2 launched in 2013 on consoles, re-released on next gens a year later I believe and has been steady drip with content updates still to this day.

Indeed Payday 2 manages to keep it's popularity (although not without controversy) and getting content. The Xbox One just got a new patch today. However, a big thing of note is that it takes them FOREVER to get patches out to console. The last big patch on Xbox was content that the PC version had literally had for over a year, maybe more.

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Just now, OCT 31 1978 said:

These game may not have a licensing agreement also.

Especially one tied up in a legal battle.

That's a fair shake, but I thought the question was in general "what companies do that?". IIRC they had a console update this last April which included more features and content. I stopped following the console updates for that game as heavily so I'll be the first to admit where I'm wrong. 

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It might not be an "industry standard", but it's certainly not the mythical unicorn that some people pretend it is. There is a precedent for it, albeit a minor one.

It just makes zero sense why they can't work on other projects in the meantime and come back to F13 after this clears up and they finish their other projects. Absolutely nothing about that is reasonable to me. Especially when other developers have offered to help.

 

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10 minutes ago, Brevator said:

Alright, I lied. This is my last response to you.

1.) Vince's testimony (if you actually read it and comprehend it) confirms that they not only knew about the lawsuit as early as January but that they were also concerned that it would affect the game. Yet they acted as if nothing was wrong and all the content advertised in the Virtual Cabin was still coming. It wasn't until the absolute last minute that they informed us it would never be coming, and they acted as if they were totally blindsided by it, even though Vince said they knew as early as January.

2.) Of course Sean and his lawyer would say that. They wanted to sell a game with their license on it. They have every motivation to be dishonest.

In all likelihood, Sean Cunningham likely took advantage of an indy developer to make a quick buck, the same way he took advantage of a young writer named Victor Miller back in 1979. But Gun Media is still responsible in some capacity for not being completely honest about the potential legal restriction that the lawsuit would have on their game. If you want to continue to give your money to a company that is less than honest with its backers, that's your problem, not mine.

Here is @damnenchiladas own post to you where he says he believes GUN didn’t know...... it’s right there yet you continue to spew the same conspiracy nonsense over and over you have you mind made up I get it..... just stop pushing your opinions as facts. And we will be done here.

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2 minutes ago, Brevator said:

Especially when other developers have offered to help.

Did I miss where that was stated? I'd be curious to know who did offer their help.

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