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Should the Perk ,,Medic´´ get removed?  

142 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the Perk ,,Medic´´ get removed?

    • Yes , it should be removed!
      40
    • No , it should stay in the game!
      103
  2. 2. If it should stay in the game ,.......

    • It should be nerfed!
      26
    • It should be in it´s current state!
      40


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Medic is so powerful that it forces Jason to avoid using his knives unless he is absolutely sure he can shift grab during the healing animation. With Medic, dealing damage in and of itself is worthless and you'll never wound a counselor and then chase them down as they limp to their environmental kill death indoors. It's an absolutely broken perk.

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14 hours ago, Somethin Cool said:

@HuDawg if you're not looking at it from Jasons perspective then who cares if you have 6 med sprays or not. Are you jealous if another counselor lives and you don't? 

 

 

You're just proving my point...lol.

Im looking it from my own perspective.   On how i can use 6 med sprays..    Its not even about OTHER counselors or Jealousy.

I try in take into context the entire cause and effect in game of having 6 med sprays.  Its the only real way of looking at thing when it comes to video games.

 

 

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17 hours ago, Hancove said:

 As Lachappa or Deborah or AJ, medic is a valid perk, sometime is vital, and we all need a smart character alive in the map if we want to repair parts....

I main LaChappa/Mitch. Never use Medic. I actually tend to make it a point not to use it because it is so broke in terms of combining it with Thick Skin (which I do use). I also find I simply don't need Medic to survive; even against great players. Starting out, and having neither Medic or Thick Skin can really be painful for any characters.

I still wish they'd introduce new items. Make a med spray temporary relief for limping (say 15 seconds per spray as a base). Add a first aid kit that is hand carried and can render a full heal using a QTE. Make the counselor choose between a healing item, weapon, or repair part.

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2 hours ago, The Wolf with that Toast said:

Well , that last one wasn´t directed to you.

Oh ok, sorry, I misunderstood that. :)

 

58 minutes ago, Alkavian said:

I main LaChappa/Mitch. Never use Medic. I actually tend to make it a point not to use it because it is so broke in terms of combining it with Thick Skin (which I do use). I also find I simply don't need Medic to survive; even against great players. Starting out, and having neither Medic or Thick Skin can really be painful for any characters.

I still wish they'd introduce new items. Make a med spray temporary relief for limping (say 15 seconds per spray as a base). Add a first aid kit that is hand carried and can render a full heal using a QTE. Make the counselor choose between a healing item, weapon, or repair part.

 There are different styles. Maybe you don't need it, others do... Again, you're not looking at the game as a whole but only from your perspective. 

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20 hours ago, Hancove said:

There are from 3 to 5 pocket knives in each game so it's not true that Vanessas have always pocket knives.
Also consider that they're more difficult to catch but more easy to detect.

Again, I've seen a lot of skilled Vanessas survive and lot of skilled Jason killing Vanessas it's not that Vanessa + medic is 100% surviving. 

You guys that don't want this perk because you are not able to improve, are you considering that there are other counselors in the game? As Lachappa or Deborah or AJ, medic is a valid perk, sometime is vital, and we all need a smart character alive in the map if we want to repair parts.... But we have to RUIN all our game experience and strategies because you struggle a little bit to clean the map if there is someone able to survive? 

You're full of shaving cream.

I was in a match where a vanessa tanked two traps in front of the phone box and healed from it, along with suffering slashes and knives and, inbetween times I was stunned ,healed freely every single time.

That's not now the game is meant to be played.

"Oh, but go for a grab."

I did and I ate two pocket knives for my troubles.

So what now? I have knifed and slashed the vanessa and had her hit two traps and she's still in good health after I get stunned once. I go to grab and I end up eating a knife two separate times. Where is that MY fault? Where is that MY failure to "adapt"?

Just admit that every asshat that uses medic is a jason trolling teamer who stacks it with thick skinned to go for a Jason kill all the time.

I bet you'd like it if every counselor started with a med spray and a pocket knife. Oh, better yet, lets make it so that Jason spawns in without his mask and Tommy spawns right away with an axe as well. Hell, lets just remove the sweater thing completely and just make it so tommy just has to find Jason and push E.

That's the sort of game you're pushing for, numb nuts.

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28 minutes ago, Hancove said:

This is where I stop to read.

Pro-medic folks often don't want to hear the truth.

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@Daneasaur Firstly, I use medic and don't team so check your assumptions. Secondly, I don't use medic with thick skin. I actually almost never use thick skin. I think it's an overrated perk. I use medic so if I encounter an injured teammate I can heal them and still cover myself. Third, I only troll a Jason who I know is teaming. Next time don't jump to conclusions about people and their motives. 

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36 minutes ago, Daneasaur said:

You're full of shaving cream.

I was in a match where a vanessa tanked two traps in front of the phone box and healed from it, along with suffering slashes and knives and, inbetween times I was stunned ,healed freely every single time.

That's not now the game is meant to be played.

"Oh, but go for a grab."

I did and I ate two pocket knives for my troubles.

So what now? I have knifed and slashed the vanessa and had her hit two traps and she's still in good health after I get stunned once. I go to grab and I end up eating a knife two separate times. Where is that MY fault? Where is that MY failure to "adapt"?

Just admit that every asshat that uses medic is a jason trolling teamer who stacks it with thick skinned to go for a Jason kill all the time.

I bet you'd like it if every counselor started with a med spray and a pocket knife. Oh, better yet, lets make it so that Jason spawns in without his mask and Tommy spawns right away with an axe as well. Hell, lets just remove the sweater thing completely and just make it so tommy just has to find Jason and push E.

That's the sort of game you're pushing for, numb nuts.

Yeah , man , only those who encountered it know how bad it can be but they are going to tell us that ,,we aren´t using Jason properly´´ or something like that.

I know it´s frustrating but chill a bit , ok.

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2 hours ago, Alkavian said:

I main LaChappa/Mitch. Never use Medic. I actually tend to make it a point not to use it because it is so broke in terms of combining it with Thick Skin (which I do use). I also find I simply don't need Medic to survive; even against great players. Starting out, and having neither Medic or Thick Skin can really be painful for any characters.

I still wish they'd introduce new items. Make a med spray temporary relief for limping (say 15 seconds per spray as a base). Add a first aid kit that is hand carried and can render a full heal using a QTE. Make the counselor choose between a healing item, weapon, or repair part.

Repeating the voice of reason...I don't necessarily agree with the total nerf to medic proposed above but I do think healing needs to be seriously looked at. 

I'd go with Spray for cuts, knives. Bandages to heal limping, 15 second time delay to apply, or full heal with a med kit. Medic can use the kit twice. It would need some testing but in my head it seems more balanced. 

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@The Wolf with that Toast Everybody who plays Jason has encountered this scenario. It's frustrating, but doesn't warrant the removal of a perk.

@Slasher_Clone In theory it'd be okay, but I think it'd be too easy for Jason to get you limping and you'd be screwed with a long heal time. Not saying it wouldn't be more realistic, but likely too much of a balance swing.

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17 minutes ago, thrawn3054 said:

@The Wolf with that Toast Everybody who plays Jason has encountered this scenario. It's frustrating, but doesn't warrant the removal of a perk.

@Slasher_Clone In theory it'd be okay, but I think it'd be too easy for Jason to get you limping and you'd be screwed with a long heal time. Not saying it wouldn't be more realistic, but likely too much of a balance swing.

Ah, yes I'd still let you use the spray to stave off limping, maybe a bit longer, 30 seconds the first time, then decrease by five seconds with each subsequent heal. 

 

Thought I'd add a link, as a first aid kit and bandages were suggested here.

http://forum.f13game.com/topic/17192-more-interactable-thingies/?tab=comments#comment-220708

 

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2 hours ago, Hancove said:

Oh ok, sorry, I misunderstood that. :)

 

 There are different styles. Maybe you don't need it, others do... Again, you're not looking at the game as a whole but only from your perspective. 

Actually, I do tend to analyze the game as a whole. Medic isn't so much of an issue as is the abundance of health sprays. You can either adjust spray spawn rates, change the perk, change how sprays work, redesign aspects of the system currently in place or do some combination thereof. 

How to adjust things, or not adjust them, seems to be the crux of the debate. I think the game needs an overhaul in quite a few areas because of design shortcomings. There tends to be too much focus on specific issues and not enough attention given to systemic failings. We are seeing symptoms and debating how to treat them without looking critically at underlying causes. 

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2 hours ago, Daneasaur said:

So what now? I have knifed and slashed the vanessa and had her hit two traps and she's still in good health after I get stunned once. I go to grab and I end up eating a knife two separate times. Where is that MY fault? Where is that MY failure to "adapt"?

So now she's out of knives AND medsprays and you can grab her... What's the problem?

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2 minutes ago, Truth said:

So now she's out of knives AND medsprays and you can grab her... What's the problem?

That two traps are dead and that he has to waste time chasing a Vanessa around.

Whereas if medic was gone. He would likely still have at least one less spray and one less knife to worry about.

Seems pretty obvious.

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6 minutes ago, malloymk said:

That two traps are dead and that he has to waste time chasing a Vanessa around.

Whereas if medic was gone. He would likely still have at least one less spray and one less knife to worry about.

Seems pretty obvious.

Maybe he should only place 1 down at a time instead of 2 at the same spot. He could've just come back and placed another and they wouldn't have been wasted.

Either way, she was then out of options and totally vulnerable.

Also, If she had 2 knives, then she only had 2 sprays. Could've just kept slashing her and those 2 knives would've been useless. 

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4 hours ago, Alkavian said:

I main LaChappa/Mitch. Never use Medic. I actually tend to make it a point not to use it because it is so broke in terms of combining it with Thick Skin (which I do use). I also find I simply don't need Medic to survive; even against great players. Starting out, and having neither Medic or Thick Skin can really be painful for any characters.

I still wish they'd introduce new items. Make a med spray temporary relief for limping (say 15 seconds per spray as a base). Add a first aid kit that is hand carried and can render a full heal using a QTE. Make the counselor choose between a healing item, weapon, or repair part.

Was hoping I'd see your take on this matter Alkavian. The major problem with Medic is that, as it is now, it's simply too good to not use in terms of meta perks. Medic does the following when equipped:

  • Grants you effectively a fourth item slot.
  • Makes healing from traps trivial when Jason isn't around.
  • Allows more healing while juking Jason through broken windows.

In terms of item efficiency as well as survivability, this perk is a clear winner of a chicken dinner. Combined with the number of increased healing sprays due to the existence of Hypochondriac, and the ability to reduce damage using Thick Skinned, it makes Jason's traps easy to overcome.

Jason's biggest weakness is that he cannot be everywhere all at once, so he needs traps to secure other places. But when healing supplies are reasonably abundant, and the ability to increase/strengthen them via perk choice exist as well, it's too easy for coordinated groups to simutaneously push objectives while taking down the traps with little effort. Medic also breaks the dev's promise that perks wouldn't be powerful, and moreso just for flavor, yet Medic still exists.

Edited by Trident77
typos
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7 minutes ago, Truth said:

Maybe he should only place 1 down at a time instead of 2 at the same spot. He could've just come back and placed another and they wouldn't have been wasted.

Either way, she was then out of options and totally vulnerable.

Also, If she had 2 knives, then she only had 2 sprays. Could've just kept slashing her and those 2 knives would've been useless. 

Yeah, because she surely couldn't find more health somewhere.

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3 minutes ago, malloymk said:

Yeah, because she surely couldn't find more health somewhere.

Not if he caught her first...

Regardless, is it really so bad that ONE PLAYER was able survive? You guys are acting like EVERYONE is running medic on all their counselors. I honestly can't say I've encountered more than one person in a lobby using it (while playing as Jason, obviously). Does a few counselors escaping once in a while due to a perk justify removing said perk? I sure don't think so.

And (in case you didn't see my first post here) this is coming from someone who has never used the perk. I've never rolled higher than an uncommon so I always just sold it.

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Most of this conversation is about Vanessa but there are other counselors this perk is balanced on.  Like AJ and her 1 luck.  She limps after a couple broken window climbs and doesn't have the speed or stamina to run around the entire map.  This just ends up balancing her survivability slightly instead of being OP at all.

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2 minutes ago, NScarlato said:

Most of this conversation is about Vanessa but there are other counselors this perk is balanced on.  Like AJ and her 1 luck.  She limps after a couple broken window climbs and doesn't have the speed or stamina to run around the entire map.  This just ends up balancing her survivability slightly instead of being OP at all.

It's jsut that Vanessa is the hardest to catch, so that's the counselor everyone bitches about. It has little to do with the perk itself, and more to do with spending 5 minutes to get her limping and watching her spray it off like nothing happened. Really it's just salty players.

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1 minute ago, Truth said:

It's jsut that Vanessa is the hardest to catch, so that's the counselor everyone bitches about. It has little to do with the perk itself, and more to do with spending 5 minutes to get her limping and watching her spray it off like nothing happened. Really it's just salty players.

Honestly Vanessa is a pain in the ass without her using any med sprays at all.  She's just annoying and can most likely run around to all cabins without any broken windows yet for some time.  She's also hard to catch in a "winded" state where it's easy to shift-grab her.  It's mostly on her design not the perk.

Heaven forbid you do catch her and she has a knife and gets her stamina back.  This is a Vanessa problem not a perk problem.

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7 minutes ago, Truth said:

Not if he caught her first...

Regardless, is it really so bad that ONE PLAYER was able survive? You guys are acting like EVERYONE is running medic on all their counselors. I honestly can't say I've encountered more than one person in a lobby using it (while playing as Jason, obviously). Does a few counselors escaping once in a while due to a perk justify removing said perk? I sure don't think so.

And (in case you didn't see my first post here) this is coming from someone who has never used the perk. I've never rolled higher than an uncommon so I always just sold it.

It's not about if ONE PLAYER surviving is a big deal. It's the fact that one player can tank Jason's traps with mostlt no consequence.

I do run medic and hypochondriac with Vanessa and eating traps is too easy. The earlier traps are tanked the more difficult it is for Jason to control objectives.

If you think that medic is not OP that's your belief. But telling a player to get good is kind of a reach. Lets say she had no knives. She tanked two traps and got nabbed a minute later. She still tanked two traps and had a chance to get away. Or lets say it's not a Vanessa, but its Deb. She can tank and repair an item before she dies. 

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