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IVIalicious

More options for Offline Bots/SP Challenges would be nice

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What do i mean for more options?.

Well, think of it as more features instead to give more variety and customisation for players that play OB or SP Challenges exclusively. (I'm one of them for now) 

New features that would be nice would go something like this i think:

1. The option to toggle rain on and off. (Pls for the sake of my FPS)

2. Counselors are able to use a variety of costumes like the Halloween pack for example along with emotes. It would give them more life i think. (Though this might be coming, i can't remember, the costumes that is in OB)

3. The ability to change and customise Jason's abilities, like their cooldown times or rage being instantly active from the start of the game. (It's a pain in the ass to find Tommy Jarvis if he's the last one alive and you don't have rage and a  -Morph) 

4. This may be difficult to implement but in all of my time in OB, i have never once seen the Counselors actually try to kill Jason and they've been near my shack/house multiple times yet they never go inside to try and get the sweater to actually ATTEMPT to try and kill me. I don't know if this feature is already in the mode and the AI has trouble figuring out how to kill the player or if it's non-existent but it needs tuning if it actually is a thing for OB. Would be nice if they actually tried to kill you on the Hard difficulty exclusively for example.

5. The AI intelligence needs a serious looking into. I'm sure all of you by now have seen Counselors getting stuck to rocks, drawers, doors, walls, standing out in the open not doing anything (Jarvis i'm looking at you) etc, etc. I know general improvements are coming but i don't believe it will be enough for the meantime. AI this poor should not be a thing, even for Indie games. These things are very, very basic for AI guys, c'mon. It's basic navigational errors. I know they're very busy tackling bigger, more concerning problems but the state of the AI really is a mess. God knows what the SP Challenges AI could act like if it's anything like the AI on OB.

6. The option to have Jason unmasked from the start. Now this might sound a little silly but some people might prefer to see Jason's actual face instead of those masks a lot more oftenly. Also, it will make the killing process for the AI a hell of a lot easier. Giving the player more of a challenge, especially on Hard mode if the difficulty setting is tweaked so Hard mode will actually act like it's on the Hard difficulty. Right now, the difficulties are pretty much the same and determine if Counselors are just going to hide under beds or in closets more oftenly than not. Could also be a nice option for people who want to roleplay as Jason who wouldn't have found his mask yet like in Part III, Part VI, VIII and the 2009 Remake.

Yeah, that's pretty much it for now. Unless someone has more suggestions which they can provide in the comment section. I think adding these few features would give OB and possibly SP Challenges more variety and appeal because let's face it, OB is pretty empty and sadly boring for the most part right now and that's sad to see as an F13 fan who was waiting for OB to arrive since they first announced it all the way on the Kickstarter page. (Yes, it's been that long, lol :D) I was fairly dissapointed with OB because of how lackluster it is. But anyway, let me know what you think in the comments and add suggestions if you have any and hopefully with luck, the devs will see this and get around to adding some of these interesting features. (In my opinion) I still have faith in you guys!. Even with all of the game's problems right now.

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2 hours ago, IVIalicious said:

What do i mean for more options?.

Well, think of it as more features instead to give more variety and customisation for players that play OB or SP Challenges exclusively. (I'm one of them for now) 

New features that would be nice would go something like this i think:

1. The option to toggle rain on and off. (Pls for the sake of my FPS)

2. Counselors are able to use a variety of costumes like the Halloween pack for example along with emotes. It would give them more life i think. (Though this might be coming, i can't remember, the costumes that is in OB)

3. The ability to change and customise Jason's abilities, like their cooldown times or rage being instantly active from the start of the game. (It's a pain in the ass to find Tommy Jarvis if he's the last one alive and you don't have rage and a  -Morph) 

4. This may be difficult to implement but in all of my time in OB, i have never once seen the Counselors actually try to kill Jason and they've been near my shack/house multiple times yet they never go inside to try and get the sweater to actually ATTEMPT to try and kill me. I don't know if this feature is already in the mode and the AI has trouble figuring out how to kill the player or if it's non-existent but it needs tuning if it actually is a thing for OB. Would be nice if they actually tried to kill you on the Hard difficulty exclusively for example.

5. The AI intelligence needs a serious looking into. I'm sure all of you by now have seen Counselors getting stuck to rocks, drawers, doors, walls, standing out in the open not doing anything (Jarvis i'm looking at you) etc, etc. I know general improvements are coming but i don't believe it will be enough for the meantime. AI this poor should not be a thing, even for Indie games. These things are very, very basic for AI guys, c'mon. It's basic navigational errors. I know they're very busy tackling bigger, more concerning problems but the state of the AI really is a mess. God knows what the SP Challenges AI could act like if it's anything like the AI on OB.

6. The option to have Jason unmasked from the start. Now this might sound a little silly but some people might prefer to see Jason's actual face instead of those masks a lot more oftenly. Also, it will make the killing process for the AI a hell of a lot easier. Giving the player more of a challenge, especially on Hard mode if the difficulty setting is tweaked so Hard mode will actually act like it's on the Hard difficulty. Right now, the difficulties are pretty much the same and determine if Counselors are just going to hide under beds or in closets more oftenly than not. Could also be a nice option for people who want to roleplay as Jason who wouldn't have found his mask yet like in Part III, Part VI, VIII and the 2009 Remake.

Yeah, that's pretty much it for now. Unless someone has more suggestions which they can provide in the comment section. I think adding these few features would give OB and possibly SP Challenges more variety and appeal because let's face it, OB is pretty empty and sadly boring for the most part right now and that's sad to see as an F13 fan who was waiting for OB to arrive since they first announced it all the way on the Kickstarter page. (Yes, it's been that long, lol :D) I was fairly dissapointed with OB because of how lackluster it is. But anyway, let me know what you think in the comments and add suggestions if you have any and hopefully with luck, the devs will see this and get around to adding some of these interesting features. (In my opinion) I still have faith in you guys!. Even with all of the game's problems right now.

Playing against, 7 A.J.’s or Tiffany’s, in swim suits would be fun. Or even 7 Lachappas. 

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2 hours ago, IVIalicious said:

1. The option to toggle rain on and off. (Pls for the sake of my FPS)

This is fucking VITAL. Until the devs can program rain that doesn't make the game chug they need to include an option to turn that shit OFF.

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16 hours ago, IVIalicious said:

1. The option to toggle rain on and off. (Pls for the sake of my FPS)

Given how horrible the rain is for console FPS, the rain shouldn’t even be an option. It is a royal fuck up in its current state.

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My PS4 can run the rain, I just think rain looks awful on certain maps ( Higgins Haven ) so I just end up restarting until the rain is gone. Being able to turn it on and off would be nice.

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18 hours ago, Dolemite said:

This is fucking VITAL. Until the devs can program rain that doesn't make the game chug they need to include an option to turn that shit OFF.

Ikr?. The current state of the optimization in this game is god-awful sometimes. Sometimes i hit around the 30-40 FPS mark in certain areas and i have a GTX Titan X, 16GB of RAM and an I7 CPU... something tells me that shouldn't be happening on a rig like mine. 

That and you can actually turn the rain off IN PRIVATE MATCHES. Why OB doesn't have this option i... i don't even know. 

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2 hours ago, IVIalicious said:

Ikr?. The current state of the optimization in this game is god-awful sometimes. Sometimes i hit around the 30-40 FPS mark in certain areas and i have a GTX Titan X, 16GB of RAM and an I7 CPU... something tells me that shouldn't be happening on a rig like mine. 

I'm not going to say that the overall optimization for the game is bad, as while I'm in the process of getting a new PC I'm currently playing on a laptop that is actually juuusssttt under minimum specs and getting about 30 fps consistently, believe it or not. Granted, it's on lower graphical settings, but I still get confused when a guy with a mammoth rig complains of shit frame rates when I'm at the moment playing it decently on a toaster. 

2 hours ago, IVIalicious said:

That and you can actually turn the rain off IN PRIVATE MATCHES. Why OB doesn't have this option i... i don't even know. 

I don't play private much, so I wasn't even aware that was an option...there's even less of an excuse now for that option to not be included in all match types.

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1 hour ago, Dolemite said:

I'm not going to say that the overall optimization for the game is bad, as while I'm in the process of getting a new PC I'm currently playing on a laptop that is actually juuusssttt under minimum specs and getting about 30 fps consistently, believe it or not. Granted, it's on lower graphical settings, but I still get confused when a guy with a mammoth rig complains of shit frame rates when I'm at the moment playing it decently on a toaster. 

I don't play private much, so I wasn't even aware that was an option...there's even less of an excuse now for that option to not be included in all match types.

Well, when you have a rig like mine you expect 60FPS at the best of times. When you're used to that kind of framerate anything lower than it has an affect on you, makes you think it looks like ass when it's decent really. I never always had a monster rig like i do now, it took years to save up the kind of money i spent on this thing. 

But yeah, private match has had the option of rain since they first implemented it a couple patches back. (The Part IV Jason and Jarvis House update i believe) It's a little odd that one game mode has it and the other one doesn't especially since the game mode that doesn't is offline play only. Like i said, some people don't like to play online right now and like you said, there's no excuse for not having that option. All the other mentioned features are just common niceties. The option to toggle rain on and off when it has an impact on performance is vital like you say. It's like it forces you to play on specs that you don't match. 

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The artificial intelligence intelligence as you say @IVIalicious is actually pretty good considering a solid AI takes years to properly develop. These bots are in the toddler stage of development and it shows. They can and will get better but AI takes time to develop and killing Jason takes multiple steps. 

However I agree that you should be allowed to toggle rain on or off and put the counselors in the costumes you paid for. Just don't expect the world from the offline bots until IllFonic makes them an actual priority.

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28 minutes ago, Quinn FTW said:

Also, moar counselors please.

Up the number of counselors to 10 or 12 (or more).

I'd really enjoy this as well. The bloodbath would be intense. 

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2 hours ago, Alien_Number_Six said:

The artificial intelligence intelligence as you say. @IVIalicious is actually pretty good considering a solid AI takes years to properly develop. These bots are in the toddler stage of development and it shows. They can and will get better but AI takes time to develop and killing Jason takes multiple steps. 

However I agree that you should be allowed to toggle rain on or off and put the counselors in the costumes you paid for. Just don't expect the world from the offline bots until IllFonic makes them an actual priority.

Oh i have no doubt that they will improve significantly in time. (Hopefully) It's not as good as you make it out to be. Yes, there are other factors like decision making and such which can confuse the AI and cause it to ignore/bypass some other functions like its navigational programming. (You often see this a lot in Early Access games or betas where the AI gets confused when other factors have interrupted its normal routine and get stuck somewhere) But the fact of the matter is that this is a full product. Yes, it launched without AI at all but if you're going to make AI, at least delay it if you know it's not going to be up to a professional standard. Things like them getting stuck as they do as frequently as they do is not a professional standard. 

I mean, the AI you're talking about is the kind of AI that is VERY, VERY advanced. Like top of the line stuff that has took years to make and rarely falters in live gameplay. A great example of this would be the AI for the Xenomorph in Alien Isolation. To this day the xeno AI in Alien Isolation is without a doubt the best and most realistic I've ever seen. And that came from a developer who makes STRATEGY games who managed to make an AI as believable, fault-less and as realistic as the AI for the Xenomorph was in a HORROR game. Just goes to show that with enough passion and talent, anyone can do it. So in light of that, what is everyone else's excuse when their games have been in development for years and their AI is sub-par at best?. (Not F13 The Game of course, that AI was made in only a few months and with 3rd party software)

But yes, hopefully we see many more improvements and inclusions like the features i noted down in my post added. I for one would really enjoy OB if even just some of these features were implemented.

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2 hours ago, Quinn FTW said:

Also, moar counselors please.

Up the number of counselors to 10 or 12 (or more).

That would be awesome. Good note.

However, i think they may be saving that for the SP Challenges since the AI won't be notified of your presence at first. I think they only have 7 in OB for now for balancing reasons. More might be too much to handle, especially if they improve the bot AI and make it smarter so it will complete objectives faster, try to kill you, escape faster, etc. 

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@IVIalicious 
  * Toggling rain off and on is needed desperately, but if the updated engine fixes the frame rate issues, the complaint may not be made so much. I like the look of the rain and the reduction to visibility from both sides of game play (excluding Jason's sense of course). It should still be an option for quick play and offline bots as well either way.... its always nice to have choices.
  * The option to use your preferred clothing on counselors should also be added.... the way I see it, its always wabbit season in Crystal Lake.... Still waiting for Duck season. There is no one to complain about how the counselors are dressed when you play by yourself... except... yourself, but why would anyone complain about their own choices?
  * Changing Jason's abilities in offline mode would be fun for experimentation beyond just using a different Jason... but I think that should definitely be kept to offline mode or we would just be seeing every Jason with the best strengths and minimal weaknesses. Strengths could be tied to several weakness and picking a second or third strength could be limited by the first choice due to ties with other strengths and weaknesses... there could be a way to do it for online anyway, but it could be difficult to come up with a system that is hard to abuse.
  * I have seen a Tommy and Tiffany going for the shack together once, but it did not occur to me to wait and see if they would go in and try to get the sweater. We may be waiting a while for A.I. improvements that are advanced enough for them to attempt, let alone be successful at a Jason kill.... but we can hope that it will come one day.
  * If you have not seen it, there is a post from Shifty about offline bot A.I. improvement under: About Friday the 13th: The Game... dated March 29. They never tell us everything before we get official patch notes, so we can still hope these are not the only improvements coming. When the update is completed... we can also hope they put some resources towards more improvements to the A.I. More of a challenge from the bots would be a welcome change.
   * A no mask option is a good idea... I believe some one suggested that be an option in online play a while back as well. I like a good challenge, but as the game stands now I doubt I would use it very often in online mode. Offline mode though... who doesn't like to see that face that only Pamela could love in all of the glorious kill animations.
   
   More variety would be most welcome, particularly in offline mode where it only affects your own game play experience. It will be very interesting to see how the improvements they have made to the A.I. for the next update work... as well as the single player challenges. I doubt the A.I. will differ much, if at all between the two... at least not at first. I am sure the future holds many a tweak to the A.I. and other aspects of game play both on and offline.

   One thing I would like to see would be our own choice on each counselor's perks used in offline mode, specifically... the perks that are already set to each counselor as they would be going into online play. We could change them as we wished in existing menus... but those that want to use no perks or crappy perks to have an easier time would have to remember to re-do their perks before returning to online play..... Unfortunately, in the announcement for the changes to offline bots, they already have a plan for perk selection that they will be using to help match perks with difficulty settings.
    Another thing some would like to see would be the ability to pick which counselors you will be hunting... which should, of course... also have a random option like it is now. Facing 7 different clothed and perk equipped versions of any one counselor or mixture of counselors could be interesting... Like I said earlier... It is always wabbit season in Crystal Lake.
    We cannot forget the holy grail of offline play that is (for now at least) out of reach..... playing a counselor in offline mode. If they can ever make an A.I. for Jason that would be at least an acceptable challenge, I do not doubt that many would play offline counselors.
    As @Quinn FTW suggested above.... extra counselors in offline mode would be awesome.... even more than 12. Perhaps up to 16... but that could be limited by the game engine itself or memory issues... I don't know specifics that this would effect. Still.... more counselors could be even more of a challenge when some A.I. changes become enough to make offline mode difficult to play. I am all for a challenge.
   

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9 hours ago, IVIalicious said:

Oh i have no doubt that they will improve significantly in time. (Hopefully) It's not as good as you make it out to be. Yes, there are other factors like decision making and such which can confuse the AI and cause it to ignore/bypass some other functions like its navigational programming. (You often see this a lot in Early Access games or betas where the AI gets confused when other factors have interrupted its normal routine and get stuck somewhere) But the fact of the matter is that this is a full product. Yes, it launched without AI at all but if you're going to make AI, at least delay it if you know it's not going to be up to a professional standard. Things like them getting stuck as they do as frequently as they do is not a professional standard. 

I mean, the AI you're talking about is the kind of AI that is VERY, VERY advanced. Like top of the line stuff that has took years to make and rarely falters in live gameplay. A great example of this would be the AI for the Xenomorph in Alien Isolation. To this day the xeno AI in Alien Isolation is without a doubt the best and most realistic I've ever seen. And that came from a developer who makes STRATEGY games who managed to make an AI as believable, fault-less and as realistic as the AI for the Xenomorph was in a HORROR game. Just goes to show that with enough passion and talent, anyone can do it. So in light of that, what is everyone else's excuse when their games have been in development for years and their AI is sub-par at best?. (Not F13 The Game of course, that AI was made in only a few months and with 3rd party software)

But yes, hopefully we see many more improvements and inclusions like the features i noted down in my post added. I for one would really enjoy OB if even just some of these features were implemented.

Alien: Isolation is my favorite game on PS4. It's Alien AI is solid and one of the best in the business. It also took four years to develop. Expecting the counselor AI in Friday the 13th the Game to be on par with Alien: Isolation's Alien AI after a few months of work is unrealistic. Coding AI to do complex things takes time. Time that may or may not be afforded to an offline mode that was never the main focus of the game to begin with. There is no doubt they can be improved opon. But I have to say that IllFonic did a decent job with the bots with the time they put into them. I'm looking forward to further updates to them in the future. But for now I am just happy I have something to chase when I don't feel like dealing with quick play.

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I am all for them adding anything that would make the single player experience more enjoyable and entertaining.  I'm no longer terrible at being Jason in multiplayer, but I really enjoy playing single player a lot (even though the bots are extremely stupid and no challenge at all). Sometimes I just want to hop on and enjoy the experience without dealing with connection issues, host quitting, or toxic members of the community and trolls in QP matches.  I hope they are truly improving the AI; however, I am aware of what it takes to develop AI and I am not expecting anything like Alien Isolation AI.  I will be satisfied with counselors actually utilizing traps at locked doors, actually working to repair things and escape, and being able to actually drive the car off the map if they manage to fix it.  Currently in bot mode, I don't even bother putting traps at the cars, because I know even if they are repaired the bots will drive into a tree and just sit there until I am ready to get them.  I also hope they make the bots smart enough to avoid hiding under a bed or in a closet when I am standing right in front of them and, overall, make them utilize hiding spots less.  Every offline bot session I tend to get the "seek and destroy" kill on four or five counselors because they all seem to love to hide.  I also hope a few bots will actually stick together and defend one another to simulate the groups of counselors you get in the multiplayer experience.  However, like I said, I understand the limited amount of time and resources the team have in terms of developing AI, so my I am trying to keep my expectations realistic and low.  Oh, and I would like the ability to turn off team killing in offline bot mode, as well.  I cannot count how many times I have gone in to kill a counselor only to have another counselor accidentally blow them away with the shotgun lol. 

I am really looking forward to the single player challenges because it gives us a mode where the counselors are completely unaware of Jason's presence, which offers more of the feeling of being a killer from in the movies.  I'm really hoping there are several of these scenarios to chose from and it isn't just two or three.  I also hope they take a bit longer to achieve and involve more counselors than the early footage we saw of Adam and Bugzy fixing the car.   I believe they are adding kills for single player challenges like the sickle n the barn, the wood chipper, etc.  I hope these later get added to locations in online multiplayer to offer more context kills in the barn and other locations.  That would be nice.  

Anyway, I'm getting off topic.  I love the idea of toggling weather conditions.  I would like other customizing for the bots as well.  I wish we could go through the roster and fill it with counselors we select (including their outfits and perks), as well as the ability to have a whole roster of stealth characters or repair characters to customize our challenge level.  Hell, for more of a challenge, I wish we could get an option to start the match with certain (or all) repairs already completed.  Starting a match knowing that all the bots need to do is call the cops or find the keys would really make for a greater challenge.  Being able to adjust (increase)  the number of pocket knives and health sprays available in offline bot mode could also be an interesting way of customizing the challenge level.  That may be getting too specific and detailed though.   The only other customization I can think of for offline bot mode would be the ability to completely skip the opening scene of Jason killing the "victim" counselor and all other counselors running for cover.  Its not really a huge deal, but I would just like to skip it and load directly into Jason's shack and start hunting.  

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