Jump to content
tyrant666

Needing Room To Execute Kills...Is Absurd And A Killer

Recommended Posts

I get that the devs probably don't want to deal with the likely hassles of Jason getting stuck inside objects after executing a kill up against an object, like a tree or a car or a wall, etc. I also think obviously they want you to be able to see the kills.

The problem is this is the reason why you see so much choke/decapatation spam kills. Cuz they require the least amount of room and the least amount of time before stunathon.

I play without those two kills on all my Jasons, but its quite clear most of the other kills require too much room IMO.

Scenario from last night...

Lame Packanack Small.

That lame car down by the water. Every single time I wanted to execute a grab kill on a mostly army of lame ass Vanessas. Between the car and the trees and uneven surface and the obvious stun. I literally could not execute ANY of my grab kills as Part 7. Doesn't matter if you do a circle or move away from counselors, if your surrounded or near objects, you can't execute the kills you want. I couldn't count how many times I could've had easy kills if it weren't for not enough space.

Now don't get me wrong, I got 6/8 after one person left everybody behind with the 4 seater and they failed to kill me or call the cops, so why complain? When you are unable to execute kills based on space, its frustratingly stupid. Especially when you evade some stuns giving you the window to execute kills and you can't and by that time...surprise stun/counselor free.

I wish the devs would make grab kills less space sensitive. I should be able to execute a kill up against a tree or car or surrounded by counselors. Figure out a way to prevent any potential issues of clipping/getting stuck in objects and make kills less space sensitive. Especially since Swift Attacker/Medic/Thick Skin spammers make non Weapon Strength Jasons meleeing through crowds of counselors a really pointless ideal to kill with. Even with less pocket knives, you still have things like space working against Jason. On top of the melee detection of course.

Makes me worry how much space will be needed for any sort of multi kill. The devs will probably be like 'see...the multi kill you wanted!' but then the players will realize you need a football field worth of space to perform it.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By this logic Part 8 should be able to do the axe throw kill in a crowded bathroom and phase through the walls to complete the animation, then end up stuck in a "negative space" in between the collision boxes of different parts of the building with the only way to get out being morph.

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
46 minutes ago, VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow said:

By this logic Part 8 should be able to do the axe throw kill in a crowded bathroom and phase through the walls to complete the animation, then end up stuck in a "negative space" in between the collision boxes of different parts of the building with the only way to get out being morph.

Thank you for saying that! Beat me to it. Head punch and the choke.... I don't use them anymore, unless I'm feeling mean. Maybe that's why I go 3 for 8 against top tier opponents instead of clearing them out. I know my kills would go up exponentially if I used them, I see enough other Jason players head punch everyone in the lobby they get their hands on. But, I hate those kills and think my friends deserve a grand exit. The only time I use them is if I have a troll to deal with, and even then I'm not big on it because I've killed good friends with them in the heat of the moment. I'd rather go 3 for 8 playing great counselors with grand kills, then 8 for 8 asphyxiated and decapitated. But that's me, I understand why others use them. Quick, and easy. Pad the stats. Luckily, I don't care about that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd like to point out its scenarios like that where if Grip Strength had the damage modifier. It wouldn't be as ridiculous, because at least if your crowded and grab people over time, they will take damage because of it. Since I was Part 7.

If anything, this just shows melee combat for Jason is still so inferior to counselor, unless you have a weapon strength Jason because of its own damage modifier

1. You slash them, nothing happens...they don't fall backwards or even respond in a negative way whatsoever

2. You slash them, they can still slash through your swing, especially with Swift Attacker

3. They hit you, most often its a stun, if your standing up...they can continue to chain stun you until their weapon breaks...or you actually fall down

4. You miss because random object gets in the way or they duck, etc because the hitbox is attached to the weapon apparently and not the counselor. If your standing in front of the counselor, it should be a hit every time regardless of surroundings

@VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow

It would look stupid to see that Part 8 kill in a crowded room and I totally get why the devs don't allow it for the reasons I said and you said.

Maybe they just change the sensitivity slightly on the radius or even as I said...rehaul how combat works. Or perhaps positive Grip Strength could carry some sort of temporary immunity/god frames of like 2-3 seconds preventing stuns while giving those Jasons more time to perform a kill. Since only two Jasons have it as a strength, it could work. Though for Part 3, it would be really OP on top of Weapon Strength.

  • Like 1
  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, tyrant666 said:

It would look stupid to see that Part 8 kill in a crowded room and I totally get why the devs don't allow it for the reasons I said and you said.

Maybe they just change the sensitivity slightly on the radius or even as I said...rehaul how combat works. Or perhaps positive Grip Strength could carry some sort of temporary immunity/god frames of like 2-3 seconds preventing stuns while giving those Jasons more time to perform a kill. Since only two Jasons have it as a strength, it could work. Though for Part 3, it would be really OP on top of Weapon Strength.

Giving immunity frames to +grip strength would make part 3 the ONLY viable Jason in the meta. He'd be unstoppable because you couldn't stop him from killing anyone. And I say part 3 because part 7's weaknesses would still be a problem.

Requiring space to kill is one of the balancing features of the game. If Jason could kill anyone anywhere or had immunity frames to allow him to get into position, he'd be unstoppable, period.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow said:

Giving immunity frames to +grip strength would make part 3 the ONLY viable Jason in the meta. He'd be unstoppable because you couldn't stop him from killing anyone. And I say part 3 because part 7's weaknesses would still be a problem.

Requiring space to kill is one of the balancing features of the game. If Jason could kill anyone anywhere or had immunity frames to allow him to get into position, he'd be unstoppable, period.

Everything he said, stun needs a tweak that's all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Without this part of the game, escaping from a grab is a redundant mechanic.

It's a big part of the entire mechanics of the game, hoping you get caught in a space small enouh to offer you an escape opportunity.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, tyrant666 said:

1. You slash them, nothing happens...they don't fall backwards or even respond in a negative way whatsoever

2. You slash them, they can still slash through your swing, especially with Swift Attacker

I'm totally fine with the space required to activate the executions, never had a problem with it and those quick non-weapon kills that require no room to activate are not equipped on any of my Jason's load out.

What you said here is more of an issue from my point of view. Whenever Jason connects with a swing it should stun/delay the counselors from swinging his or her weapon for a good two seconds or so, many times Jason connects with his weapon that would cripple or kill a normal person, only for the counselor to immediately retaliate and stun Jason.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are kills which require less space and there are kills which require more space. I'd suggest just swapping around some of your choices a bit or using environmental kills more often. There needs to be space for these kills to happen otherwise you get things like this happening:

Debs_finger.jpg

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Kodiak said:

There are kills which require less space and there are kills which require more space. I'd suggest just swapping around some of your choices a bit or using environmental kills more often. There needs to be space for these kills to happen otherwise you get things like this happening:

Debs_finger.jpg

A player gets buried then gives you the middle finger??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lol the original screenshot I took can be found here, but I Photoshopped it a little bit to make Deb's open hand a middle finger :) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Completely disagree. There over 50 environmental kills that are never used because people mash kills. It makes the game boring. I say take the unlucky counselor to an environmental kill and actually give them a chance to break free or see a kill besides asphyxiation or decapitation. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, tyrant666 said:

I'd like to point out its scenarios like that where if Grip Strength had the damage modifier. It wouldn't be as ridiculous, because at least if your crowded and grab people over time, they will take damage because of it. Since I was Part 7.

If anything, this just shows melee combat for Jason is still so inferior to counselor, unless you have a weapon strength Jason because of its own damage modifier

1. You slash them, nothing happens...they don't fall backwards or even respond in a negative way whatsoever

2. You slash them, they can still slash through your swing, especially with Swift Attacker

3. They hit you, most often its a stun, if your standing up...they can continue to chain stun you until their weapon breaks...or you actually fall down

4. You miss because random object gets in the way or they duck, etc because the hitbox is attached to the weapon apparently and not the counselor. If your standing in front of the counselor, it should be a hit every time regardless of surroundings

@VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow

It would look stupid to see that Part 8 kill in a crowded room and I totally get why the devs don't allow it for the reasons I said and you said.

Maybe they just change the sensitivity slightly on the radius or even as I said...rehaul how combat works. Or perhaps positive Grip Strength could carry some sort of temporary immunity/god frames of like 2-3 seconds preventing stuns while giving those Jasons more time to perform a kill. Since only two Jasons have it as a strength, it could work. Though for Part 3, it would be really OP on top of Weapon Strength.

   I understand your frustration but needing the space to perform a kill is required to avoid Jason's weapon clipping through a tree or wall or the car which is not only unrealistic, but would look too weird. As others have stated above, the escape mechanic would also be totally useless. @Kodiak's above screenshot is a perfect illustration that some of the spaces do need reworking, however. Some of them require flat ground or they become laughable, which I doubt was intended.
   Your first two points are understandable as well, combat does need to be reworked somewhat. Don't forget, combat stance is weird for Jason, after a block it is several second before you can attack again. Although counselors being stunned briefly or otherwise showing some detrimental effect from each hit would be more believable, it would make it way too easy for Jason to get his grab.
   For your third point, I have said it before and I will say it again; Jason needs a brief stun immunity (random one to five seconds or the battle Chads will adapt to this too easily) If Jason can't stun a counselor, it should be impossible for them to chain stun him. Not impossible to stun him, just impossible to chain stun him. Strengthen up that duration of stun on Jason perk again to balance it for the counselors if you need to. (I forget the name of that perk). At this point Jason needs no buffs other than this. I am not seeing why any counselors would need any more buffing either. I escape a lot and am far from the best player in game.
   For your fourth point, If a random object (tree, doorframe, car or any other solid object) gets in the way of your swing, then your weapon should be stopped by said random object. There is enough weapon clipping through objects already. For example; counselors stunning Jason through a door (I would love to see this done in real life, but you cannot change the laws of physics....yet). We are not using light sabers here, although there are times that would be a cool addition too, as long as it fells the tree. (Just kidding, no light sabers please).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Redrum138 said:

Thank you for saying that! Beat me to it. Head punch and the choke.... I don't use them anymore, unless I'm feeling mean. Maybe that's why I go 3 for 8 against top tier opponents instead of clearing them out. I know my kills would go up exponentially if I used them, I see enough other Jason players head punch everyone in the lobby they get their hands on. But, I hate those kills and think my friends deserve a grand exit. The only time I use them is if I have a troll to deal with, and even then I'm not big on it because I've killed good friends with them in the heat of the moment. I'd rather go 3 for 8 playing great counselors with grand kills, then 8 for 8 asphyxiated and decapitated. But that's me, I understand why others use them. Quick, and easy. Pad the stats. Luckily, I don't care about that.

I'm a fan of playing to win.  Shift-grab (on unaware counselors), hack and slash, and quick insta-kill are all ok in my book >:D  LOL  Don't care about the varied grab-kills since if I wanted to see them, I always have youtube. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You just need better Jason's with a flair for the cinematic.

My Jason's are all each equipped with their three weapon kills and one additional kill that either fits their look or movie.

Savini gets asphyxiate, part 8 the head punch, 7 the eye gouge, 6 the counselor/Jason camera cameo face-lock and crush, part 2 a backbreaker, 9 a heart punch, etc. 

I typically do not reuse the same kill and add in weapon slashing and environmental kills. 

When I asphyxiate on Savini it's usually after shifting inside of a cabin where no environmental kill is handy.

I found it fitting with his style due to his sudden appearance from a shift.

It felt cold and calculating.

I go to great lengths to put on a show.

Jason in the movies did so I honor that.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, BeautyNumber2 said:

Completely disagree. There over 50 environmental kills that are never used because people mash kills. It makes the game boring. I say take the unlucky counselor to an environmental kill and actually give them a chance to break free or see a kill besides asphyxiation or decapitation. 

I'll look for an environment kill anytime there's not another counselor around with a bat looking to save there friend. If there is they get choked out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With part 7 the following grab kills: stab in the stomach, decapitation, football punt. Those seem to work in close quarters.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I use bear hug as my only semi-quick kill. Jason absolutely should need space to execute certain kills. This makes tapping out a slim possibility and promotes strategy for both Jason and a counsellor.

The problem with choke isn't that every jason uses them in close quarters, it's that they use them when they could have space for other kills. That's when choke becomes redundant. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, AdmiralJT said:

I'll look for an environment kill anytime there's not another counselor around with a bat looking to save there friend. If there is they get choked out.

That sounds great. It’s good to try new things. Button mashing the same 2 kills is never any fun. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, BeautyNumber2 said:

Completely disagree. There over 50 environmental kills that are never used because people mash kills. It makes the game boring. I say take the unlucky counselor to an environmental kill and actually give them a chance to break free or see a kill besides asphyxiation or decapitation. 

The problem with the enviormental kills is that they are not consistent in their placement.  A good example is the amount of enviormental kills in the big map to the small maps.  There are a ton of more opportunities where you can use cabin walls, corners, furniture but for some reason it’s not available in the bigger versions.

There a large portions in the woods of Packanack and Crystal Lake they don’t have the the hanging or prune kill on them so you get stuck using grab kills.  If you play single player and the councelor run off in woods you capture them and there’s no environmental kills.

I had the game since launch and found a new enviormental kill at one of the small open area where chairs are that has a roof but no walls.  There was kill where Jason grabs the councelors and beats there head into the posts 4/5 times.  I think this is the only place in the game where the kill is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Locked for necroposting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...