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AldermachXI

Hitting Jason through Doors - Intended or Not?

Should you be able to hit THROUGH doors?  

208 members have voted

  1. 1. Should you be able to hit THROUGH doors?

    • Yes
      69
    • No
      139


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2 minutes ago, AldermachXI said:

I don't think you should be able to. Simply because the door is already there acting as a buffer between you and Jason. You shouldn't get to stun Jason THROUGH a door. It's not happening because it's "realistic". It's happening due to a clipping issue.

I say remove it fully. It's better for balance. Doors are to buy you time. Not give you free shots at Jason.

Perfect!

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21 minutes ago, [IllFonic]Courier said:

We've been discussing this topic and combat mechanics in general.
How do you all feel about combat through the doors?
How many of you prefer it the way it is and why?

I think it's rather well balanced as-is. At windows and doors, counselors have a rare opportunity: deal damage/stuns to Jason with a 0% chance of getting grabbed. Slashed or knifed, yes...but not grabbed. Jason still has the chance to slash or knife the counselor through the door/window, and the counselor may well find themselves limping or dead due to missed swings, broken weapons, or just being in the wrong spot when the door comes down. 

Overall, it adds some nuance to combat interactions and doesn't seem to be inherently exploitable like swing/dodge canceling.

Leave it alone for the foreseeable future.

 

30 minutes ago, VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow said:

Cabin walls are impermeable....

Yeah...no, they're not. Which is actually something they should fix after getting rid of the Stalk-ruining counselor screams. Nothing funnier/sadder than a stalking Jason's machete wagging back and forth through the cabin wall he's next to.

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15 minutes ago, Jawbone said:

Rest my soul. The devs just came out and admitted they don't know how to balance the game.

Im still curious as to why you are so salty towards the courier? Especially after a good patch and moving in the right direction. Uncalled for 👎

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1 minute ago, Dr. Lecter said:

I think it's rather well balanced as-is. At windows and doors, counselors have a rare opportunity: deal damage/stuns to Jason with a 0% chance of getting grabbed. Slashed or knifed, yes...but not grabbed. Jason still has the chance to slash or knife the counselor through the door/window, and the counselor may well find themselves limping or dead due to missed swings, broken weapons, or just being in the wrong spot when the door comes down. 

Overall, it adds some nuance to combat interactions and doesn't seem to be inherently exploitable like swing/dodge canceling.

Leave it alone for the foreseeable future.

And when Jason enters on his door breaking animation? He becomes completely vulnerable to stuns. And using combat stance doesn't help it either since hit detection is now trash and it takes 4 or 5 swings (with a +destruction Jason) to break down a door.

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12 minutes ago, [IllFonic]Courier said:

In what way does my post imply that?
As a Community Manager, one of my jobs is to collect feedback from the community and pass it along to the appropriate people.
While we work on balance and introducing new changes, we are always monitoring feedback and take that into consideration.

If you are the community manager you should already realize that these forums want Jason to run rampant on any group. If its good for Jason they want a buff and if its bad for Jason they want a nerf. Do you think sitting in a cabin waiting until Jason smashed all the windows and starts breaking down the doors is fun? The one good counter to this was nerfed bear traps which serve almost no purpose anymore since they can't be put directly in door ways anymore.

The topic of pocketknives popping traps on Jason's map is a huge balance problem but that isn't touched and greatly reduces the usefulness of the item. Shifting into firecrackers and not stunning Jason hasn't been touched. Flares randomly bouncing off Jason in a clean hit was never addressed. Almost all perks being complete garbage was only mentioned once and it was said that they are basically supposed to be useless.  The new maps being designed in a way that majorly impacts the slower characters worse than the meta characters. Ninja nerfing car speeds while making offroading impossible on the new maps. Sense spam not being addressed. Bad stat break points. 10 stealth being better on A.J. than Tiffany even though they both have a 10 in it.

Removing advanced combat mechanics the counselors once had in attempt to fix bugs and not fixing the bugs but never reinstating the combat mechanics. There is just a laundry list of things wrong with the game currently which has been that way for a long time some even since launch. and you aren't going to get the real answers you need from these folks.

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14 minutes ago, Jballz said:

Agreed. If anything, removing combat lock in general would improve gameplay. The hitting through doors is not a game breaker, more silly then anything. 

I agree with this as well, it's definitely dumb and is more often than not a waste of weapon durability for counselors. The only downside of completely removing the combat lock would be no more quick lock smacks when Jason is right on your ass. 

If they really wanted to make Jason scarier they should reduce the new speed just a tad bit and remove the lock on mechanic. There's no way in hell I would manually turn around to smack Jason in the face when he was right on my ass if there was no combat lock.

But now that I think about it a bit more it might ruin the fun. I use that tactic in every single game and it has saved my life a billion times. Maybe remove combat lock when playing as Jason and leave it on for counselors so they have a chance to fight back.

Edit: But no matter what counselors locking on to one another needs to be removed.

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4 minutes ago, NoOneK9503 said:

And when Jason enters on his door breaking animation? He becomes completely vulnerable to stuns. And using combat stance doesn't help it either since hit detection is now trash and it takes 4 or 5 swings (with a +destruction Jason) to break down a door.

I consistently CS barricaded doors in three hits with Part 4, though I understand and agree hit detection desperately needs improvement. Nothing being discussed in here will change the post-animation stuns associated with animated door breaks.

 

2 minutes ago, Psychosocial23 said:

Maybe remove combat lock when playing as Jason and leave it on for counselors so they have a chance to fight back.

Hahaha, nope... no crutch for you :JasonPt4: While it's a separate thread, they really need to just remove CS altogether and find a way to cleanly (i.e., not the emote wheel/sweater stun fiasco) map dodge/block/heavy attack to their own controls.

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Well, talking about the fight mechanics i say that removing the hit through doors is a must, it doesn't give you an advantage and it's unrealistic, plus, remove the autolock (especially for Jason but for the counselours too) would improve the chances of Jason at fighting against gangs, that and the hit detection, the wouldn't be any other problem then.

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11 minutes ago, [IllFonic]Courier said:

How do you all feel about combat through the doors?
How many of you prefer it the way it is and why?

I don't like it the way it is simply because it doesn't look right. I don't think Jason should get a full stun if it only looks like his hand or weapon gets hit. 

I would like it for the counselor's weapons to reach Jason's head or body for him to be stunned. And the stun needs to be a short one, at that. Also the door should be in its final stage of destruction before a counselor can hit through it. Jason, on the other hand, should be able to hit counselors through the doors at all stages because a big giant ax can do that, not a wrench or baseball bat.

And finally, it would be great if Jason's model didn't clip through the door while hitting it in combat stance.    

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5 minutes ago, Jawbone said:

If you are the community manager you should already realize that these forums want Jason to run rampant on any group. If its good for Jason they want a buff and if its bad for Jason they want a nerf. Do you think sitting in a cabin waiting until Jason smashed all the windows and starts breaking down the doors is fun? The one good counter to this was nerfed bear traps which serve almost no purpose anymore since they can't be put directly in door ways anymore.

The topic of pocketknives popping traps on Jason's map is a huge balance problem but that isn't touched and greatly reduces the usefulness of the item. Shifting into firecrackers and not stunning Jason hasn't been touched. Flares randomly bouncing off Jason in a clean hit was never addressed. Almost all perks being complete garbage was only mentioned once and it was said that they are basically supposed to be useless.  The new maps being designed in a way that majorly impacts the slower characters worse than the meta characters. Ninja nerfing car speeds while making offroading impossible on the new maps. Sense spam not being addressed. Bad stat break points. 10 stealth being better on A.J. than Tiffany even though they both have a 10 in it.

Removing advanced combat mechanics the counselors once had in attempt to fix bugs and not fixing the bugs but never reinstating the combat mechanics. There is just a laundry list of things wrong with the game currently which has been that way for a long time some even since launch. and you aren't going to get the real answers you need from these folks.

Oh i see... that is why you are rude, another cry hard counsellor. The courier didn't ask about anything you mentioned that needs fixed by the way. He simply asked if we like or dislike combat through doors 😕

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45 minutes ago, [IllFonic]Courier said:

We've been discussing this topic and combat mechanics in general.
How do you all feel about combat through the doors?
How many of you prefer it the way it is and why?

In a "best case scenario," INTACT doors and destructible walls should be impermeable. Once they are mostly broken where they have a large hole in them, then melee attacks could reach through. However, I don't know if the game code will allow that. What I would settle for is making doors and destructible walls entirely impermeable until they are destroyed completely. Currently counselors and Jason can clip through doors and destructible walls and hit each other. It's worse for Jason because he becomes a sitting duck while chopping these down.

And I agree with @Psychosocial23, either remove combat lock-on in its entirety(leaving combat aim entirely to the player, which is what I would prefer), or at the very least remove counselor-to-counselor combat lock-on and add a way to switch targets(but I think this would still be a clunky solution).

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3 minutes ago, Dr. Lecter said:

I consistently CS barricaded doors in three hits with Part 4, though I understand and agree hit detection desperately needs improvement. Nothing being discussed in here will change the post-animation stuns associated with animated door breaks.

 

Hahaha, nope... no crutch for you :JasonPt4:

How is it a crutch? Have you tried swinging as a counselor without combat lock? The movement in this game is so awkward that sometimes you will swing in the completely wrong direction.

I can definitely understand why they chose to add that feature in the first place as every match would turn into a "Who can do more damage to air" contest than anything else without it.

I wouldn't call something a crutch that literally helps the game... work...

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7 minutes ago, WashingtonJones said:

I don't like it the way it is simply because it doesn't look right. I don't think Jason should get a full stun if it only looks like his hand or weapon gets hit. 

I would like it for the counselor's weapons to reach Jason's head or body for him to be stunned. And the stun needs to be a short one, at that. Also the door should be in its final stage of destruction before a counselor can hit through it. Jason, on the other hand, should be able to hit counselors through the doors at all stages because a big giant ax can do that, not a wrench or baseball bat.

And finally, it would be great if Jason's model didn't clip through the door while hitting it in combat stance.    

Jason is clipping through the door because breaking a door in combat stance is not the intended way to break down a door and is just as much of a glitch as counselors being able to hit him through doors.

If they remove the ability to hit Jason through doors, they should also remove the ability to combat stance doors as Jason.

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32 minutes ago, [IllFonic]Courier said:

How do you all feel about combat through the doors?
How many of you prefer it the way it is and why?

The combat through the door can be, at times, fun as well as frustrating. Should it be there? I'll defer to the movies and say yes, in some form. 

As it is Jason's hit detection needs to be on point first and foremost. Attempting to take a door down without the animation can be just down right stupid when you're hitting everything but the door. Using combat stance though is necessary though because much of the time you're trying to gain access as well as defend. I personally would rather just use the animation but it's sluggish and you are completely vulnerable to attack. 

What would be sick is if Jason could open up a hole in the door and then reach in to finishing opening it and in that span of time the counselor could attack. Bust his hand with a wrench and maybe he does a little, yank his hand out and look at it, then back at the door kind of animation. Too much though.

Anyways, don't mind it. Would be nice if it didn't feel like playing with a broken toy though. 

As it is though it's a definite it's advantage to counselors, they can hit through windows too.

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41 minutes ago, [IllFonic]Courier said:

We've been discussing this topic and combat mechanics in general.
How do you all feel about combat through the doors?
How many of you prefer it the way it is and why?

I personally find it annoying that counselor can hit jason through a door. If they can do that Jason's should be able to hit counselor through windows. 

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7 minutes ago, noahvt said:

If they remove the ability to hit Jason through doors, they should also remove the ability to combat stance doors as Jason.

Did I say to remove anything?

They should remove neither. Just fix em up a little. 

47 minutes ago, Jawbone said:

Rest my soul. The devs just came out and admitted they don't know how to balance the game.

You and these new forum members need to be relegated to an orientation section of the forum. This is getting to be too much.

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5 minutes ago, noahvt said:

Jason is clipping through the door because breaking a door in combat stance is not the intended way to break down a door and is just as much of a glitch as counselors being able to hit him through doors.

If they remove the ability to hit Jason through doors, they should also remove the ability to combat stance doors as Jason.

If they remove the ability to hit Jason through doors, then they should remove the ability for Jason to hit counselors through doors as well.

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Jason this patch has the ability to hit counselors through doors now too so yes it's fair

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2 minutes ago, noahvt said:

Jason is clipping through the door because breaking a door in combat stance is not the intended way to break down a door and is just as much of a glitch as counselors being able to hit him through doors.

If they remove the ability to hit Jason through doors, they should also remove the ability to combat stance doors as Jason.

There's a really old post somewhere from Ben or somebody that said combat stancing doors is perfectly fine and was intentional.

I disagree with saying that Jason shouldn't be able to combat stance doors as it is widely considered to be an advanced tactic. If Jason uses the standard door breaking animation it is a guaranteed smack to the face from a counselor as Jason recovers from the last door hit animation.

I will very often as Jason use the standard door break animation then back off and combat stance the last hit for the door to make sure I don't get a bat to the face.

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1 minute ago, Dandan10 said:

Jason this patch has the ability to hit counselors through doors now too so yes it's fair

It's always been that way. In my opinion ANY player phasing through walls should not happen.

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5 minutes ago, WashingtonJones said:

Did I say to remove anything?

They should remove neither. Just fix em up a little. 

You and these new forum members need to be relegated to an orientation section of the forum. This is getting to be too much.

You guys just need to grow thicker skin. If the banter that goes on offends you just save yourself the trouble and stay off the internet entirely.

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Just now, VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow said:

It's always been that way. In my opinion ANY player phasing through walls should not happen.

Doors not walls, last patch I could stand back from a door and hit him with a bat or axe now if you miss Jason or time it wrong to a Jason combat stance a door you get hit instead, that never happened to me before this patch

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Counselors can hit Jason through doors that have not been damaged and stun him.

Same with doors that have taken some damage.

Counselors can stun Jason through cabin walls too.

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2 minutes ago, Dandan10 said:

Doors not walls, last patch I could stand back from a door and hit him with a bat or axe now if you miss Jason or time it wrong to a Jason combat stance a door you get hit instead, that never happened to me before this patch

In any case I believe it should not happen. Just because it does happen and there are pros and cons to the situation doesn't mean it's a valid situation.

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Just now, Jawbone said:

You guys just need to grow thicker skin. If the banter that goes on offends you just save yourself the trouble and stay off the internet entirely.

Banter is one thing, flat-out repetitive stupidity is another.

I can't grow a thicker skin to help that. I would need a lobotomy instead.  

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