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Allow me to preface this topic with the fact that I absolutely love this game. After giving it a quick rent to get a feel for the volume of the player base, it was an immediate buy for me. My gaming sessions since have been largely composed of portraying and evading the iconic hockey-masked killer. Even when I tried out the similar title Dead by Daylight, I couldn’t but feel a preference to load up the former game.

 

That being said, this criticism comes from the intention of further improving what I believe to be a thoroughly engrossing experience.

 

So, to the subject at hand, I realize that this has been a topic of debate for some time now, but I’m going to throw my thoughts into the discussion in the hopes of contributing to a solution.

 

Let me start with a brief anecdote of my experience with the issue:

 

Having started as Tiffany Cox (not quite my main, but variety is the spice of life or, as I’m sure you’ll guess to be the impending case, death), I successfully hid from Jason (Part II) in a cabinet despite a high fear level (He cut the power!). Feeling pretty good about myself, I ventured out into the night and found the sabotaged power box. Upon taking a deep breath for confidence (Tiffany being the mechanical savant that she is), I set to work making the necessary repairs to restore power and---success!

 

Continuing on my way, I came across the phone box and, not far away from that, the fuse! Wow (what was her luck stat again??)! All the while, I had managed to avoid further harassment from Jason.

 

Making my way toward the phone box, however, my learning curve kicked in. I decided to look for traps near the objective. Sure enough, my investigation paid off! Now, I know what you’re thinking: “But Blackwater34, did you have a pocketknife that you could use to disarm the trap?” Sure did! But here’s the kicker: There were three traps all neatly arranged in proximity to the phone box and lovingly covered with fallen leaves to await the ankle of a frantic and unsuspecting counselor.

 

What could I do? I wanted to keep my knife for when Jason inevitably showed up. I had to trip the traps one way or another (I mean, admittedly, I could have abandoned the objective, but…really?) and I DID have a med-spray with 2 charges (Gotta love that perk).

 

Here goes!

 

SNAP...spray…SNAP...spray…JASON MUSIC…Combo “Murdered” into submission.

 

Now, from that story, you could probably identify my criticisms of the systems in play for Jason’s traps:

  • 1.     Having to use a vital inventory item to thwart a resource that, admittedly, isn’t quite as vital to Jason.
  • 2.     Having no recourse in a situation where an objective is positively inundated with traps (when executing certain stages of said objectives requires a decent amount of legwork on the part of the counselors).
  • 3.     Jason becoming alerted even when a trap is disarmed without the introduction of hapless ankles (admittedly this wasn’t in the story but this is what I understand to be the system in play).
  • 4.     Jason knows where these objectives are, so peppering one with traps is as quick as game-start-morph.

So, at risk of being remiss in my criticism of the issue, I propose my solution:

 

 

Let counselors disable Jason’s traps as with any other bear trap. I do not believe this would in any way mitigate the lethal nature of the resource save for the aversion of rendering objective locations absolutely inaccessible.

 

 

They are already camouflaged decently well (in exterior environments) and are easy enough to overlook. If a counselor is cautious enough to check for them at vital locations, he or she should be rewarded for his or her better judgment with the opportunity to crouch (thereby avoiding a dead giveaway interaction icon for anybody just wandering about) and disarm them while, at the same time, remaining vulnerable to Jason in taking the time to do so (just as with the other traps).

 

 

Well, my 2 cents become 20 bucks, but I think you get the idea. I would thoroughly enjoy constructively discussing this topic with anyone who has been likewise been affected by the issue or who is a genuine advocate of the mechanics in place.

 

 

If you read this far, thanks for taking the time! If you’re looking for the tl;dr, scroll a bit more:

 

 

tl;dr : Jason’s traps at times render objectives inaccessible to counselors despite the pocketknife disarm system.  Possible solution: Allow counselors to disarm Jason’s traps in the same way they would any other bear trap.

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Absolutely not, whats the point of his 5 traps if you can just disarm them by hand and render them all useless? Him being able to reset them would be useless also, since they could just be disarmed via hand again. 

You could have used teamwork to do that one, drop the fuse, maybe pop a trap or two then run the fuck away. Tiffany my has bad repair as is, what are the chances that you wouldn't alert him by messing up on the phone repair?

Objective items show up on the map now, someone with higher repair would have seen it, they might also have a pocketknife of their own to pop the remaining trap(s).

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Sorry to say this but you seem like you might be a relatively new player.  I'm not trying to insult you or anything but getting around Jason's traps is pretty easy and they actually nerfed Jason's traps with the last big patch (not sure if you're aware of that).  I just posted on another thread about how they could make Jason's traps deadly (under general discussions Jason's hasn't been nerfed the counselors are just better if you'd like to read it ) again because the current system is easy to beat with certain perk combos and pocket knifes.  Being able to just disable Jason's traps without healing sprays or pocket knifes would be a huge mistake.  Any experienced player knows what those traps look like and where to look for them, they're not camouflaged that well.  Plus the whole purpose of the traps is to deny the win condition so they're doing what they're supposed to do.  Again, no insult intended but you might need to get some more time in with the game and you'll see getting around Jason's traps is not that difficult.

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54 minutes ago, Alcanx said:

Absolutely not, whats the point of his 5 traps if you can just disarm them by hand and render them all useless? Him being able to reset them would be useless also, since they could just be disarmed via hand again. 

You could have used teamwork to do that one, drop the fuse, maybe pop a trap or two then run the fuck away. Tiffany my has bad repair as is, what are the chances that you wouldn't alert him by messing up on the phone repair?

Objective items show up on the map now, someone with higher repair would have seen it, they might also have a pocketknife of their own to pop the remaining trap(s).

Thank you for taking the time to respond to my topic! For a moment there, I was worried I had written that article to no avail!

You are right on a few fronts, though some of your suggestions are a bit tenuous, allow me to respectfully explain:

-Jason's traps are indeed limited, but if the concern is that all off them will be disarmed in one go, one would have to question the antagonist player's placement of the devices. That is to say, that the chances of a counselor (or 8) being able to consistently spot and disarm every trap (and any and all subsequent replacements) seem unlikely.

-Teamwork, while possible in the game, is certainly not guaranteed--perhaps by design. Every player realistically has the ability to engineer his or her own escape. Therefore, the temptation to allow your teammate to be slasher bait while you sprint for the finish becomes that much stronger. As an additional effect, altruism has a greater value, adding greater depth to the experience.

-Tiffany is indeed no pro with a wrench...or a gas tank. However, I don't believe it is a reason to forgo the notion of using her for the repair objectives. After all, what else is there for her? Distraction? Sweater donning? That again leans pretty heavily on the teamwork aspect. Besides, who wouldn't like the added thrill of getting one over on Jason with the unlikely hero? Who is Eric LaChappa?

-Dropping the objective part is a viable method that I often use (e.g. leaving keys that I find by a car instead of dying and losing them somewhere obscure). However, in this case, I would have only been setting an invitation for my other teammates to be sequentially caught and slaughtered in the nefarious scheme. So, in a way, I did the best I could in the situation by springing them all. But whether or not such a situation should be able to so easily present itself is the question addressed here.

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17 minutes ago, NickZ3 said:

Sorry to say this but you seem like you might be a relatively new player.  I'm not trying to insult you or anything but getting around Jason's traps is pretty easy and they actually nerfed Jason's traps with the last big patch (not sure if you're aware of that).  I just posted on another thread about how they could make Jason's traps deadly (under general discussions Jason's hasn't been nerfed the counselors are just better if you'd like to read it ) again because the current system is easy to beat with certain perk combos and pocket knifes.  Being able to just disable Jason's traps without healing sprays or pocket knifes would be a huge mistake.  Any experienced player knows what those traps look like and where to look for them, they're not camouflaged that well.  Plus the whole purpose of the traps is to deny the win condition so they're doing what they're supposed to do.  Again, no insult intended but you might need to get some more time in with the game and you'll see getting around Jason's traps is not that difficult.

I appreciate your insight and I did see a lengthy discussion on how to propagate situations such as this one rather than mitigate them, which gave me pause, but I figured it was worth representing the other side of the question.

 

From the veteran's perspective, how does one reliably circumvent Jason's traps?

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58 minutes ago, Blackwater34 said:

I appreciate your insight and I did see a lengthy discussion on how to propagate situations such as this one rather than mitigate them, which gave me pause, but I figured it was worth representing the other side of the question.

 

From the veteran's perspective, how does one reliably circumvent Jason's traps?

The easiest way to get around his traps is to just tank them.  What I mean by "tank" is just step in it and then use a healing spray to recover your health.  If you have the thicked skin perk, hypochondriac perk and medic perk run those three together and traps will not be an issue.  You'll still have to avoid Jason when he shows up to see who's messing with his traps but the traps themselves shouldn't get you.  Thicked skin will eat some of the damage and medic and hypochondriac will let you start with a health spray that has two uses on it, plus if you find more health sprays they'll have two uses.  Even if there is more then one trap you should be good but, step in one heal up and if Jason doesn't show step in the next one, cause if he shows up and you step in the other one he'll probably get you. Also pocket knives don't alert Jason if you use them to disable his traps he can see on his map the trap is disabled but he has to check he is not alerted.  

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4 hours ago, Blackwater34 said:

-Jason's traps are indeed limited, but if the concern is that all off them will be disarmed in one go, one would have to question the antagonist player's placement of the devices. That is to say, that the chances of a counselor (or 8) being able to consistently spot and disarm every trap (and any and all subsequent replacements) seem unlikely.

-Teamwork, while possible in the game, is certainly not guaranteed--perhaps by design. Every player realistically has the ability to engineer his or her own escape. Therefore, the temptation to allow your teammate to be slasher bait while you sprint for the finish becomes that much stronger. As an additional effect, altruism has a greater value, adding greater depth to the experience.

-Tiffany is indeed no pro with a wrench...or a gas tank. However, I don't believe it is a reason to forgo the notion of using her for the repair objectives. After all, what else is there for her? Distraction? Sweater donning? That again leans pretty heavily on the teamwork aspect. Besides, who wouldn't like the added thrill of getting one over on Jason with the unlikely hero? Who is Eric LaChappa?

-Dropping the objective part is a viable method that I often use (e.g. leaving keys that I find by a car instead of dying and losing them somewhere obscure). However, in this case, I would have only been setting an invitation for my other teammates to be sequentially caught and slaughtered in the nefarious scheme. So, in a way, I did the best I could in the situation by springing them all. But whether or not such a situation should be able to so easily present itself is the question addressed here.

I've been playing since launch and trust me when I say that if anything, his traps need BUFFING. They're useless right now due to their limitations. Trapping objectives is the only thing they're good for, if you were suprised that Jason trapped an objective then you really haven't played enough. 

Trapping objectives is the norm, in fact, it's mandatory. People can get the car up or the cops called in the first 3 minutes if left unguarded. 

- all 3/5/7 traps WILL be on an objective, with the exception of newer Jasons who don't yet know how to play. Traps are only useful on objectives. Sure, I can trap a doorway or a window but what would that accomplish? First someone has to actually use that one door/window without seeing the trap. If it gets triggered whilst I'm defending an objective then it's already useless, as they would be gone by the time I morph there. It would also be rendered useless if they have a spray, sure I know where they are now, but that's nothing sense can't do for me. 

Additionally, a trap set away from an objective that gets triggered would cause me to use my morph, putting me in a bad spot. What if I morphed then the car got started? Trapping things other than objectives is not only wasteful, but potentially detrimental. 

- Teamwork was SUPPOSED to be a primary aspect of the game, note how objectives have multiple parts and multiple 'seats' for multiple people. If you're not using teamwork, you're not getting out. Radio's exists for a reason, maps exsist for a reason, seeing each other on the map exists for a reason. 

- Tiffany has bad repair, she is more likely to fuck a skill check, if you fuck a skill check you alert Jason to your location. Don't repair as Tiffany. She has high speed for a reason, serve as a distraction and RUN. 

- That's the point. You have a pocketknife and the fuse? Drop the fuse and use the knife, then get out of there if you don't want to get caught. Alternatively, you could spring it with a med spray and lure him onto you, then away from the objective. Like I said before; lure, distract, RUN. 

Make Jason's traps any more useless than they already are and you might as well remove them all together. 

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Really bad suggestion. 

If any, it should be a harder ti disable a trap just stepping in it. Maybe a skill check to get loose.

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7 hours ago, Blackwater34 said:

From the veteran's perspective, how does one reliably circumvent Jason's traps?

First look if the trap is placed to sloppy. Maybe you could bypass it.

Else I use my pocket knife(s) if I have enough.

If not, I may step into it. Even if I do not have the things to repair the objective. The next player may have and the traps are history.

As last resort I leave the fuse/gas/etc at the objective. It signals that maybe someone else could fix it.

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5 hours ago, Alcanx said:

I've been playing since launch and trust me when I say that if anything, his traps need BUFFING. They're useless right now due to their limitations. Trapping objectives is the only thing they're good for, if you were suprised that Jason trapped an objective then you really haven't played enough. 

Trapping objectives is the norm, in fact, it's mandatory. People can get the car up or the cops called in the first 3 minutes if left unguarded. 

- all 3/5/7 traps WILL be on an objective, with the exception of newer Jasons who don't yet know how to play. Traps are only useful on objectives. Sure, I can trap a doorway or a window but what would that accomplish? First someone has to actually use that one door/window without seeing the trap. If it gets triggered whilst I'm defending an objective then it's already useless, as they would be gone by the time I morph there. It would also be rendered useless if they have a spray, sure I know where they are now, but that's nothing sense can't do for me. 

Additionally, a trap set away from an objective that gets triggered would cause me to use my morph, putting me in a bad spot. What if I morphed then the car got started? Trapping things other than objectives is not only wasteful, but potentially detrimental. 

- Teamwork was SUPPOSED to be a primary aspect of the game, note how objectives have multiple parts and multiple 'seats' for multiple people. If you're not using teamwork, you're not getting out. Radio's exists for a reason, maps exsist for a reason, seeing each other on the map exists for a reason. 

- Tiffany has bad repair, she is more likely to fuck a skill check, if you fuck a skill check you alert Jason to your location. Don't repair as Tiffany. She has high speed for a reason, serve as a distraction and RUN. 

- That's the point. You have a pocketknife and the fuse? Drop the fuse and use the knife, then get out of there if you don't want to get caught. Alternatively, you could spring it with a med spray and lure him onto you, then away from the objective. Like I said before; lure, distract, RUN. 

Make Jason's traps any more useless than they already are and you might as well remove them all together. 

I apologize if it was unclear in my original post. I fully acknowledge the viability of Jason using traps on objectives (in addition to trapping windows and doors, I've had just as much success with the latter method when cornering a counselor in a cabin). What I am challenging is the Jason's ability to absolutely innundate the spot with multiple traps (that can't be passed with fancy footwork) with no recourse on the part of the counselors save for pooling precious resources on the tenuous basis of cooperation in the face of the persisting threat of Jason's presence or, in my particular case, sacrificing the rest of the match to thwart such an easily engineered tactic.

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1 hour ago, Fooobar said:

Really bad suggestion. 

If any, it should be a harder ti disable a trap just stepping in it. Maybe a skill check to get loose.

I would be in full agreement with a skill check system for disarming Jason's traps.

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7 hours ago, NickZ3 said:

The easiest way to get around his traps is to just tank them.  What I mean by "tank" is just step in it and then use a healing spray to recover your health.  If you have the thicked skin perk, hypochondriac perk and medic perk run those three together and traps will not be an issue.  You'll still have to avoid Jason when he shows up to see who's messing with his traps but the traps themselves shouldn't get you.  Thicked skin will eat some of the damage and medic and hypochondriac will let you start with a health spray that has two uses on it, plus if you find more health sprays they'll have two uses.  Even if there is more then one trap you should be good but, step in one heal up and if Jason doesn't show step in the next one, cause if he shows up and you step in the other one he'll probably get you. Also pocket knives don't alert Jason if you use them to disable his traps he can see on his map the trap is disabled but he has to check he is not alerted.  

Those perk combinations probably would contribute to allowing one to tank the traps in the situation I had mentioned, but--think about it. From the perspective of a veteran you are using all of your perk slots and precious resources to counter what is ultimately a supplementary tool at Jason's disposal; A tool that can be effectively deployed with game-start-morph ease, unless the counselors build their characters completely around tanking it. It just seems unbalanced, especially when players leverage this to the degree described in my anecdote.

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4 hours ago, Blackwater34 said:

Those perk combinations probably would contribute to allowing one to tank the traps in the situation I had mentioned, but--think about it. From the perspective of a veteran you are using all of your perk slots and precious resources to counter what is ultimately a supplementary tool at Jason's disposal; A tool that can be effectively deployed with game-start-morph ease, unless the counselors build their characters completely around tanking it. It just seems unbalanced, especially when players leverage this to the degree described in my anecdote.

I don't use the perk combo I suggested to you, I suggested it to you because it's the most effective way to deal with Jason's traps without using a pocket knife in my opinion.  So my charecter is not built with tanking Jason's traps in mind but I still find health sprays and tank Jason's traps and I do it pretty effectively.  If you'd like again to read my post on the thread I mentioned in my first reply to you and you will see how I feel about that perk combo (I can't stand it).  Yes Jason's traps can be effectively deployed with game start morph, this is what any veteran Jason player will do because it is the best way to make good use of their traps.  Using the scenario in your original post I'm going to say that two of the three traps that were on the phone box were bad traps and there was really only one that had to be dealt with to get to the phone box.  Because after this last patch made Jason's traps even weaker it's become extremely difficult to set more then one effective trap on any win condition.  I've read all your post and replays in this thread and again I mean no insult but you're clearly a newer player.  The traps are unbalanced but unbalanced in favor of the counselors because of the ease in which you can deal with them pocket knife or no pocket knife.  

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45 minutes ago, NickZ3 said:

I don't use the perk combo I suggested to you, I suggested it to you because it's the most effective way to deal with Jason's traps without using a pocket knife in my opinion.  So my charecter is not built with tanking Jason's traps in mind but I still find health sprays and tank Jason's traps and I do it pretty effectively.  If you'd like again to read my post on the thread I mentioned in my first reply to you and you will see how I feel about that perk combo (I can't stand it).  Yes Jason's traps can be effectively deployed with game start morph, this is what any veteran Jason player will do because it is the best way to make good use of their traps.  Using the scenario in your original post I'm going to say that two of the three traps that were on the phone box were bad traps and there was really only one that had to be dealt with to get to the phone box.  Because after this last patch made Jason's traps even weaker it's become extremely difficult to set more then one effective trap on any win condition.  I've read all your post and replays in this thread and again I mean no insult but you're clearly a newer player.  The traps are unbalanced but unbalanced in favor of the counselors because of the ease in which you can deal with them pocket knife or no pocket knife.  

Is the logic of my reasoning as to why this particular scenario should be brought into question not sound?

So far, the only explanations offered as to why the systems in play should remain as such have been based on the hypothetical and tenuous condition of teamwork, the complete devotion of character building to tanking traps, and the fact that traps can be disabled easily enough by stepping on them. Maybe that's why I'm considered a new player. Perhaps there's some meta that I'm missing wherein becoming injured and alerting Jason isn't supposed to be a bad thing?

I'm kidding obviously and I have come to understand that there is a sentiment that Jason isn't as powerful as he should be. I'm inclined to disagree with this just as I am inclined to disagree with the sentiment that traps are inseparable from Jason's win condition. I have personally witnessed players wipe all counselors as Jason just from utilizing every other ability at his disposal. However, Jason isn't meant to be able to wipe all counselors every match any more than they are meant to all survive. It's often a partial percentage who escape while others don't (just like in the movies!) with 100 percent scenarios existing as the exception rather than the rule with the outcomes of course augmented by player skill (and luck).

Inundating a vital component of an escape avenue with traps heavily upsets that balance and doesn't offer a realistic means of recourse for the counselors involved.

To reiterate my proposed solution with the addition of the concept proposed by Foobar: Allow counselors to disable Jason's traps utilizing a skill check system with the caveats that they can be reset and the counselor performing the action is vulnerable while doing so.

Would that be acceptable? Why or why not?

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6 hours ago, Blackwater34 said:

Those perk combinations probably would contribute to allowing one to tank the traps in the situation I had mentioned, but--think about it. From the perspective of a veteran you are using all of your perk slots and precious resources to counter what is ultimately a supplementary tool at Jason's disposal; A tool that can be effectively deployed with game-start-morph ease, unless the counselors build their characters completely around tanking it. It just seems unbalanced, especially when players leverage this to the degree described in my anecdote.

Your argument is presented eloquently, but unfortunately, I disagree with your assessment. Traps are fairly easy to spot, and really not that hard to get around. Especially after the nerf that made them un-stackable was implemented. When I first started playing this game, encountering Jason was a truly terrifying experience. If you tanked a trap, you hauled ass...immediately! I don't care how many med sprays you had. You knew the big guy would be alerted, and probably instantly morph to destroy you. Now, you can just hang out with a bat and play "bash the hockey-masked pinata".  Jason should not be afraid of encountering counselors. I hate to admit it, but that has become the case, especially with experienced players. We should all be terrified of him, that is the point of asymmetrical horror-survival games. The many are scared of the one. It seems this game has lost that edge. I can solo Deborah and survive now, against good Jason players. Deb is meant to be a team-player. That is actually the reason I have mained mostly her, I like the teamwork aspect of the game. 

TL:DR I disagree, all of Jason's tools, attributes, weapons, etc...should be buffed. Let's make this horror icon horrifying again.

EDIT: I just read your response, and thought I would respond to that as well. 

Quote

Would that be acceptable? Why or why not?

In earlier iterations of the game, maybe. As it is now, absolutely not. Pocket knives and med sprays are far too plentiful now. It's almost laughable how easy it is to get away from Jason. I personally love doing grab kills, especially environmental ones. But now, it is almost impossible to do that. That takes away so much from the game. So, in my opinion, anything that would make the counselors use up those vital pocketknives is needed for the game as it is now.

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6 minutes ago, Rexfellis said:

Your argument is presented eloquently, but unfortunately, I disagree with your assessment. Traps are fairly easy to spot, and really not that hard to get around. Especially after the nerf that made them un-stackable was implemented. When I first started playing this game, encountering Jason was a truly terrifying experience. If you tanked a trap, you hauled ass...immediately! I don't care how many med sprays you had. You knew the big guy would be alerted, and probably instantly morph to destroy you. Now, you can just hang out with a bat and play "bash the hockey-masked pinata".  Jason should not be afraid of encountering counselors. I hate to admit it, but that has become the case, especially with experienced players. We should all be terrified of him, that is the point of asymmetrical horror-survival games. The many are scared of the one. It seems this game has lost that edge. I can solo Deborah and survive now, against good Jason players. Deb is meant to be a team-player. That is actually the reason I have mained mostly her, I like the teamwork aspect of the game. 

TL:DR I disagree, all of Jason's tools, attributes, weapons, etc...should be buffed. Let's make this horror icon horrifying again.

Thank you for taking the time to read and contribute to the discussion. Make no mistake, being a huge fan of the films (please check out my Intro thread to see why), I want Jason to be powerful. To that end, I can definitely sympathize with the sentiment to make him scarier, especially in the face of the "Jason trolling" that takes place. But allowing him to nuke objectives with traps just isn't the answer to that. Let's put it this way, if the devs did tweak his traps, I would not mind seeing them buff a few other aspects of his character (within reason of course). Perhaps that's some thing else we can discuss. If a concession were made to traps, where would we want to see a reasonable buff in the interest of compromise?

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12 minutes ago, Blackwater34 said:

. If a concession were made to traps, where would we want to see a reasonable buff in the interest of compromise?

Ok, if we make disarming a trap a QTE, I propose that we do the same with using the pocket knife while being grabbed by Jason. It should not be automatic. In reality, if a huge homicidal maniac grabbed you after you had you been partying, would you even remember that little pig-sticker in your pocket? I believe you need to show some skill to stun the big guy like that.

Most of all, I believe the ability to stun Jason should be lowered dramatically in all cases. I do not remember one instance in the movies where Jason was passed around like a joint by 3 people who collectively didn't weigh as much as him.

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15 minutes ago, Rexfellis said:

Ok, if we make disarming a trap a QTE, I propose that we do the same with using the pocket knife while being grabbed by Jason. It should not be automatic. In reality, if a huge homicidal maniac grabbed you after you had you been partying, would you even remember that little pig-sticker in your pocket? I believe you need to show some skill to stun the big guy like that.

Most of all, I believe the ability to stun Jason should be lowered dramatically in all cases. I do not remember one instance in the movies where Jason was passed around like a joint by 3 people who collectively didn't weigh as much as him.

This is a buff/compromise I could get behind. That would certainly increase the tension for counselor. I have to admit there are times when I'm not too concerned about Jason chasing me when I have a pocketknife in my inventory. Should it be a set skill check or would it scale with one of the counselors other stats like composure? Because I do have to also admit it is a little immersion breaking to see all of the characters be able to escape Jason's grip so consistently. Maybe Tommy Jarvis should still have an instant breakout though?

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11 minutes ago, Blackwater34 said:

This is a buff/compromise I could get behind. That would certainly increase the tension for counselor. I have to admit there are times when I'm not too concerned about Jason chasing me when I have a pocketknife in my inventory. Should it be a set skill check or would it scale with one of the counselors other stats like composure? Because I do have to also admit it is a little immersion breaking to see all of the characters be able to escape Jason's grip so consistently. Maybe Tommy Jarvis should still have an instant breakout though?

I believe composure and luck would play more of a role in that particular skill check than, say, repair. It would be a trade-off in immersion due to the QTE skill check, but I believe the added tension would be a valid trade-off. Honestly, I don't think Tommy should get a "free pass" either, but with his composure and luck both being at 10, he would definitely have an easier time with it than anyone else.

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9 hours ago, Blackwater34 said:

I apologize if it was unclear in my original post. I fully acknowledge the viability of Jason using traps on objectives (in addition to trapping windows and doors, I've had just as much success with the latter method when cornering a counselor in a cabin). What I am challenging is the Jason's ability to absolutely innundate the spot with multiple traps (that can't be passed with fancy footwork) with no recourse on the part of the counselors save for pooling precious resources on the tenuous basis of cooperation in the face of the persisting threat of Jason's presence or, in my particular case, sacrificing the rest of the match to thwart such an easily engineered tactic.

The thing is, Jason can place his traps wherever he wants. Traps have recently been nerfed in the sense that he can barely place two at an objective and have them both work. If you came across 3, then there's a good chance one of then would have been useless and didn't need disarming. 

If you see 3 traps at one objective, your best option is to go after something else. He only has 2 traps left assuming he's not part 2, so the car or boat would be your best option in that situation.

Remember that Jason is played by a person, and every person has their own strategies. You wont always come across a triple trapper, but if you do just go after a different objective. Make your own strategies to combat theirs. 

Forcing people to conform to one simple strategy (e.g. One trap per objective) is a really bad idea. 

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38 minutes ago, Alcanx said:

The thing is, Jason can place his traps wherever he wants. Traps have recently been nerfed in the sense that he can barely place two at an objective and have them both work. If you came across 3, then there's a good chance one of then would have been useless and didn't need disarming. 

If you see 3 traps at one objective, your best option is to go after something else. He only has 2 traps left assuming he's not part 2, so the car or boat would be your best option in that situation.

Remember that Jason is played by a person, and every person has their own strategies. You wont always come across a triple trapper, but if you do just go after a different objective. Make your own strategies to combat theirs. 

Forcing people to conform to one simple strategy (e.g. One trap per objective) is a really bad idea. 

The problem isn't the fact that there are multiple traps at an objective.  It's the inability to effectively deal with them without a gratuitous amount of resources. We have a proposed compromise developed earlier today here in this thread, I'd be interested to get your opinion on it. In essence, traps can be disarmed using a skill check, but a likewise skill check would be required to use a pocketknife to escape Jason.

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4 hours ago, Blackwater34 said:

Is the logic of my reasoning as to why this particular scenario should be brought into question not sound?

So far, the only explanations offered as to why the systems in play should remain as such have been based on the hypothetical and tenuous condition of teamwork, the complete devotion of character building to tanking traps, and the fact that traps can be disabled easily enough by stepping on them. Maybe that's why I'm considered a new player. Perhaps there's some meta that I'm missing wherein becoming injured and alerting Jason isn't supposed to be a bad thing?

I'm kidding obviously and I have come to understand that there is a sentiment that Jason isn't as powerful as he should be. I'm inclined to disagree with this just as I am inclined to disagree with the sentiment that traps are inseparable from Jason's win condition. I have personally witnessed players wipe all counselors as Jason just from utilizing every other ability at his disposal. However, Jason isn't meant to be able to wipe all counselors every match any more than they are meant to all survive. It's often a partial percentage who escape while others don't (just like in the movies!) with 100 percent scenarios existing as the exception rather than the rule with the outcomes of course augmented by player skill (and luck).

Inundating a vital component of an escape avenue with traps heavily upsets that balance and doesn't offer a realistic means of recourse for the counselors involved.

To reiterate my proposed solution with the addition of the concept proposed by Foobar: Allow counselors to disable Jason's traps utilizing a skill check system with the caveats that they can be reset and the counselor performing the action is vulnerable while doing so.

Would that be acceptable? Why or why not?

I'm going to start by saying again nothing I say in these post is meant to insult you, just so we're clear.  The reason your logic is not sound is that the devs of the game have already addressed the "issue" of Jason stacking multiple traps on one win con with the last patch.  I call it an "issue" because it really wasn't an issue, it was a change most people seem to agree was for the worse.    Since now it's almost impossible to set more then one effective trap on a win con, in your original post like I said in all likely hood two of the three traps were bad.  In your scenario you did the right thing by tanking two of them, you just didn't do the eluding Jason when he shows up part right.  That's fine it happens but to suggest the traps need to be looked at again because of it not being fair to counselors is wrong.  I've already had the argument of why Jason being able to use multiple traps on one win con is completely fair and well within reason.  So I don't really feel like doing it again as the last guy couldn't properly rebut any of my arguments and just resorted to cheap insults to feel like he won.  I don't think you would do that cause you seem more reasonable however, beating a Jason who multi traps was easy with team work, communication and perk combos is the short answer for why I don't think multi trapping is a bad thing.  If Jason's decides to unload all of his traps on one win con, there are two win cons that are left completely unprotected so I don't see any balance being upset either.  You have two easy ways to escape a bunch of traps at one spot doesn't take that away from you.  

As far as Jason being able to clear a room using his other abilities and not traps, yes it can happen I've seen it several times as well.  Again however that doesn't mean the current trap system is not fair to counselors.  Another statement the devs made about this game before its full release if I remember correctly was an experienced Jason player should kill five to all counselors in every match.  Should it be difficult to the point of being frustrating to survive Jason?  No.  Should it be a challenge?  Yes.  With the current trap system and the ease in which counselors can get around them it's not at all difficult to survive Jason.  

As far as your proposed idea of how disabling traps should work, you're on the right path you're just not there yet.  Here's why, there is no real sacrifice or risk for the counselor who's disabling the trap.  Ok so he/she is vulnerable while doing it, ok but you're vulnerable while fixing the car, boat or phone box.  There are signals that alert you to Jason's presence and you could just stop and run away.  This is already an element of the game and to apply it to the traps would make them more in favor of the counselors then they already are.  As Jason I wouldn't want to reset a trap on the phone if it was disabled without my knowledge and the cops were called.  What would be the point of resetting it?  Same for the car battery if the battery is installed what's the point of resetting the trap?  

Now before you reply to this I'm going to strongly recommend you go to general discussions and find the thread titled "Jason hasn't been nerfed, the counselors have just gotten better, do you believe this?" go to the 16th page of that thread, find my post and read it.  I have a whole paragraph dedicated to how I think the traps should work.  Just so you know what I view as acceptable as far as traps are concerned.  

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