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Stealth is bad, ideas and simple mechanics to fix it.

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1 hour ago, Tommy86 said:

If you're doing some testing, mind doing these I suggested on Sense a while back when we discussed it?

Does Sense gradually increase its range to detect Counselors regardless of Fear?
1. Have a counselor stand just outside of Sense range at the beginning of the match, in a well-lit area where they can maintain low Fear level 
2. Activate Sense periodically to see whether the Counselor is detected as time goes on
3. Additional - Perform the above steps with Counselor inside and outside a cabin to see whether it makes a difference to detection

If Sense does gradually increase, is the rate of increase tied to Rage meter?
2 Counselors are needed for this.
1. Have counselor #1 stand just outside of Sense range at the beginning of the match, in a well-lit area where they can maintain low Fear level
2. Have counselor #2 attack you to increase your Rage meter, and activate Sense immediately after
3. Perform step 2 repeatedly to see whether you can detect counselor #1 immediately after a Rage increase. Observe how many repetitions / amount of Rage needed to detect. 

+Sense effects on range
Have a counselor stand at the same distance as the previous tests, just outside of base Sense detection, and observe whether +Sense can detect the counselor. If it has any meaningful benefit to range, it should be able to.

Will do! 

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3 hours ago, TiffanyIsBae said:

Your irrelevant opinion doesn't matter either. He's right. You're wrong. 

Now someone is getting it. And that too is an opinion.

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Stealth is bad because it is not needed.  

The correct way to play is to dance in front of Jason while he swipes the air around you, unable to grab anyone. 

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15 minutes ago, Alien_Number_Six said:

Now someone is getting it. And that too is an opinion.

I think your comprehension needs a little work. Either you're intentionally misinterpreting what people are saying, or you genuinely don't understand. 

I would also suggest you actually read the posts you reply to. How else do you form your opinion about what is said? By guessing? Honestly man, talking to you is like talking to a brick wall.

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10 minutes ago, Tommy86 said:

I think your comprehension needs a little work. Either you're intentionally misinterpreting what people are saying, or you genuinely don't understand. 

I would also suggest you actually read the posts you reply to. How else do you form your opinion about what is said? By guessing? Honestly man, talking to you is like talking to a brick wall.

That's the idea.

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5 minutes ago, Alien_Number_Six said:

That's the idea.

Have fun talking to yourself then.

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Everyone gets so hung up on avoiding Sense as the be-all and end-all of staying under Jason's radar, which is just ridiculous. In the early game, reading noise pings is vital as you need to read them to know which hotspots to Morph to, as Sense only has a small net at that point.

You use Stealth to make sure you never make a noise ping. This is helpful in the early to mid game, as when Jason's bouncing around objectives, a good one will contrast the direction of noise pings with objectives on the map, and Morph to those that correlate, as that shows counselors are attacking that area. He can't Sense you if he never Morphs to your area.

I've put hundreds upon hundreds of hours into the game as AJ, with an Epic Lightfoot (so I don't generate pings, even when sprinting), and have lost count of how many times I've managed to repair an objective unmolested in the first few minutes because Jason was off exploring elsewhere, and not even curious about the zone I'm in. I almost never even see Jason in a match when playing as AJ until I have something fully repaired, and he reacts to the car starting or the cop walkie.

When people say Stealth is bad, I just see that as a classic example of the Dunning-Kruger Effect. Stealth isn't bad. Some people just have no idea how to play the game outside their narrow set of 'orthodox' strategies, and seek to destroy what they can't understand.

5 hours ago, NthnButAGoodTime said:

@Aaron uses an inflammatory and childish approach to communication on here. I was responding to him. You disagree with me on stealth, that's fine. 

I'm happy to elaborate, but I'll be brief. The advice was not generic, It was specific. If you want to be a successful stealth character, you play the game differently. It's not run and gun, it's slip into the night. A good stealth round is a short round. The points I gave were specific to that approach. 

You disagree? Challenge yourself. Main stealth characters for a measurable period of time. Come back and let me know if you adapt to the new game you've entered. Either you do, or you have a miserable time dying every round. If the latter is true then what I said about @Aaron applies: your playstyle is limited (it isn't an insult). If you adapt you'll be modeling the strategy I laid out or something similar. Either way, have fun out there.

This is the problem with these types though. They lack the imagination to utilise something new, but lack the humility to admit their lack of success with it is down to them. Ignorance and arrogance, as you previously said. In their minds it isn't their skills that are lacking, because they're fucking MLG-Pro goddamnit! It's the mechanic that's to blame!

You see these types in every single multiplayer game that's ever existed.

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1 hour ago, ZooMalfunction said:

Everyone gets so hung up on avoiding Sense as the be-all and end-all of staying under Jason's radar, which is just ridiculous. In the early game, reading noise pings is vital as you need to read them to know which hotspots to Morph to, as Sense only has a small net at that point.

I disagree. Deciding on which objective to Morph to depends on the priority of the objective. Only a clueless Jason would think that just because there's no pings, it means there isn't work being done.

For instance, I will Morph to the phone box and 4-seater first, regardless of whether I see pings or not. Even after I have set traps, I will Morph periodically to those locations, because I know that certain counselors can go undetected, and I am likely to find them either there or in vicinity. Boat / 2-seater are lower priority and don't require as much checking, unless the other objectives are reasonably secured. Boat in particular is just a death trap for counselors much of the time.

1 hour ago, ZooMalfunction said:

I've put hundreds upon hundreds of hours into the game as AJ, with an Epic Lightfoot (so I don't generate pings, even when sprinting), and have lost count of how many times I've managed to repair an objective unmolested in the first few minutes because Jason was off exploring elsewhere, and not even curious about the zone I'm in. I almost never even see Jason in a match when playing as AJ until I have something fully repaired, and he reacts to the car starting or the cop walkie.

Was the objective the 2-seater / boat in those first few minutes? Because if you managed to complete phone / 4-seater in that period of time, then Jason was probably busy tunnelling someone and so you could've done that with 0 Stealth. The most plausible reasons you might rarely see Jason when playing as AJ are these -

1. You're in random areas majority of the match simply trying to get to objectives (weak mobility)

2. The rest of the team is keeping Jason busy in a different area

3. Jason has made poor choices on which objectives to prioritise 

1 hour ago, ZooMalfunction said:

Some people just have no idea how to play the game outside their narrow set of 'orthodox' strategies, and seek to destroy what they can't understand.

Who is trying to destroy what? Stealth means that much to you? My opinion is that it has limited use. Not completely useless, but far less useful than some people think. Majority of the time, Stealth is not responsible for success with objectives against Jason. You can do just the same thing with 1 Stealth providing you coordinate with your team, and work on an objective while other counselors keep him busy elsewhere. You can obnoxiously tank his traps and he can do nothing about it without leaving the current objective. If he is in cooldown, he can do nothing period.

Repair characters' main use is repairing in Jason's face, under pressure when counselors are contesting an objective. At that point they can do the job no one else can, because no one else has the speed to pull it off. Outside of that, even 2 Repair is good enough if Jason is not there.

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Just now, Alien_Number_Six said:

As long as your not talking to me.

I believe "ignore" is a good solution for that. Then you won't have to read what you don't read anyway. 

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On 12/6/2017 at 10:35 PM, ZooMalfunction said:

Everyone gets so hung up on avoiding Sense as the be-all and end-all of staying under Jason's radar, which is just ridiculous. In the early game, reading noise pings is vital as you need to read them to know which hotspots to Morph to, as Sense only has a small net at that point.

You use Stealth to make sure you never make a noise ping. This is helpful in the early to mid game, as when Jason's bouncing around objectives, a good one will contrast the direction of noise pings with objectives on the map, and Morph to those that correlate, as that shows counselors are attacking that area. He can't Sense you if he never Morphs to your area.

I've put hundreds upon hundreds of hours into the game as AJ, with an Epic Lightfoot (so I don't generate pings, even when sprinting), and have lost count of how many times I've managed to repair an objective unmolested in the first few minutes because Jason was off exploring elsewhere, and not even curious about the zone I'm in. I almost never even see Jason in a match when playing as AJ until I have something fully repaired, and he reacts to the car starting or the cop walkie.

When people say Stealth is bad, I just see that as a classic example of the Dunning-Kruger Effect. Stealth isn't bad. Some people just have no idea how to play the game outside their narrow set of 'orthodox' strategies, and seek to destroy what they can't understand.

This is the problem with these types though. They lack the imagination to utilise something new, but lack the humility to admit their lack of success with it is down to them. Ignorance and arrogance, as you previously said. In their minds it isn't their skills that are lacking, because they're fucking MLG-Pro goddamnit! It's the mechanic that's to blame!

You see these types in every single multiplayer game that's ever existed.

Just saw this, but... The stealth stat is hardly beneficial, I spam sense. Sense avoidence perks? Yeah no. Sure you can jog to a new cabin, but the stat becomes useless to experienced players. I don't rely on white blimps, majority of the time I morph, sense, and kill someone. So on. Ever wonder why Chad and Vanessa are the best counselors? Luck and speed. Composure and stealth are too weak in comparison. 

You say you can fix objectives with Lightfoot? Cool, I can do the same as any other counselor without messing up, just as "unmolested" as you do with AJ. The stat needs a buff. There is no "just jog and jump to another cabin" when spamming sense ruins the whole point of being a ninja. I love AJ, buts unless she escapes early, she will die. Stealth doesn't do anything but waste stat points late game. That's why many players want the stat to be beneficial during rage. Stealth is bad.

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I think an easy fix to give A.J., Deborah, and Eric a boon in utility as repairers is to make Repair more difficult for Vanessa, Jenny, and Chad, so that they're more guaranteed to screw up a skill check at least once. Increase the minimum amount of skill checks they can roll from a 5 to an 8.

As for the Stealth stat itself, give high Stealth counselors (6/10 and above) innate 'Sense Avoidance' at low fear level, and also allow Counselors with a 6/10 to jog silently at low fear level, and Counselors with a 9/10 to sprint silently at low fear levels. Once Jason hits Rage status, these listed benefits stop working.

If the new Stealth changes are too overpowered, how about reducing the volume of the sound high Stealth counselors make when opening doors, windows, drawers, etc, so that Jason cannot hear them as well with louder Counselors such as Vanessa and Buggzy?

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Stealth is good for hiding from or ambushing Jason in cabins. Yes, he knows your in there, but your lack of pings makes him not sure exactly where. Meaning he has to come find you. The bigger the cabin/house, the better the benefit (darkness can help out too unless your counselor stupidly screams). Once lower stealth players move they give themselves away. Not high stealth. With your silent jog or epic light foot you can try and sneak out hoping Jason doesn't notice too quickly (with a sense scan) or continue to move around if you're looking to waste Jason's time. If there's a lot of hiding spots this can be really good too. If Jason decides to search them all, it will take up a good amount of his time.

As for ambushing, since Jason does't see your pings, you can move to areas to strike as soon as he waltzes by it. Corners, doorways, you get the idea. After a few surprise attacks, Jason may become a little leery in his pursuit and start to combat stance block walk through ambush points. 

Stealth is definitely a different playstyle. 

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Don't know if I've said this before, but one reason stealth is useless is that on PC about half of the current 800 steady users have ESP hacks that allow them to see the position of everyone and everything on the map, therefore stealth is entirely worthless.

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15 hours ago, VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow said:

Don't know if I've said this before, but one reason stealth is useless is that on PC about half of the current 800 steady users have ESP hacks that allow them to see the position of everyone and everything on the map, therefore stealth is entirely worthless.

I play on console, so I didn’t know that. Shame. The stat nevertheless sucks, spam sense and everyone getting a buff in rage, making the stat even worse.

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I have always played stealth characters and I like them a lot.  I made it to level 150 about a month ago and I have always played stealth characters.  However, my only real problem with playing a stealth game is the fact I always seem to get loud characters like Chad, Adam, or Vanessa following me around, running, and making my stealth completely useless.  Then Jason comes, they use their speed to get away, and my stealth character becomes the target.  This is why I use epic perks like marathon runner and the other one that helps with stamina recharge rate.  I always try to stay alone on the map and complete objectives on the parts of the map far away from large groups of other players.  

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27 minutes ago, Matt23leo said:

I have always played stealth characters and I like them a lot.  I made it to level 150 about a month ago and I have always played stealth characters.  However, my only real problem with playing a stealth game is the fact I always seem to get loud characters like Chad, Adam, or Vanessa following me around, running, and making my stealth completely useless.  Then Jason comes, they use their speed to get away, and my stealth character becomes the target.  

Once Jason shows up, you could always try using a hiding spot if you're already in a cabin/house. If the person that was following you runs from Jason, chances are he will pursue them. If this is what happens, just wait it out until the coast is clear and then continue about your stealthy business.

Newer players like to tag along and might not understand they are being detrimental to your stealth game. As for myself, I don't know what counselor I'm approaching until I see them. From there I'll see what they're up to. If they're going for repairs, I'll lend my support. If not, I'll probably just move on. 

I really don't want to get too much into the Jason teamer followers, because yeah they suck. 

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17 hours ago, The Tommy said:

Once Jason shows up, you could always try using a hiding spot if you're already in a cabin/house. If the person that was following you runs from Jason, chances are he will pursue them. If this is what happens, just wait it out until the coast is clear and then continue about your stealthy business.

Newer players like to tag along and might not understand they are being detrimental to your stealth game. As for myself, I don't know what counselor I'm approaching until I see them. From there I'll see what they're up to. If they're going for repairs, I'll lend my support. If not, I'll probably just move on. 

I really don't want to get too much into the Jason teamer followers, because yeah they suck. 

Someone needs to be with another non-stealthy character for it too be useful. Even then, a good Jason makes stealth useless. If you look at every blimp, even one will ruin your position. 

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On 3/6/2018 at 7:06 AM, Matt23leo said:

However, my only real problem with playing a stealth game is the fact I always seem to get loud characters like Chad, Adam, or Vanessa following me around, running, and making my stealth completely useless.  Then Jason comes, they use their speed to get away, and my stealth character becomes the target.

Preach!

Stupid Buggzy with his cement shoes...

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Possible Stealth Stats: Improvements 

1: Sounds created by you opening/closing windows and doors are quieter. (Or louder if your stealth is bad)

2: Going in or out a hiding spot is quieter. (Or louder if your stealth is bad)

3: A delay in Jason’s sense ability to mark you. (Having high stealth hides you from sense when exposed to sense for a few seconds.)

 

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18 minutes ago, Left2Right said:

Possible Stealth Stats: Improvements 

1: Sounds created by you opening/closing windows and doors are quieter. (Or louder if your stealth is bad)

2: Going in or out a hiding spot is quieter. (Or louder if your stealth is bad)

3: A delay in Jason’s sense ability to mark you. (Having high stealth hides you from sense when exposed to sense for a few seconds.)

 

I love it. 

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