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"Jason hasn't been nerfed, the Counselors have just gotten better" Do you believe this?

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25 minutes ago, PastyMcBalderton said:

Jason needs to be fixed. Every game counselors have no fear and gang up on him now. This is Friday The 13th, not fucking Looney Toons. Shit has gotten ridiculous.

Agreed, chasing Jason is the new thing it seems and mobs aren't afraid of him at the car.

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I think it's both true.  Jason's been nerfed.  It's been officially that way for awhile.

At the same time, counselor's have just gotten better with their tatics.  There's a higher ceiling with counselor's play.  You have way more tools at your disposal to fight Jason, with everything from perks, to teammates to help you, to a map that tells you where objects are when they've been found.

The grab nerf is okay.  What I think should happen, is Jason should have perks as well as counselor's.

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19 hours ago, thatdudescott said:

So we're basically the children of an alcoholic/addict parent in this scenario.

 "Looks like Dad isn't taking us to the ballgame like he promised...Again."

:unsure:

 

Literally dying LOL!!!!!!!!!!

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On 11/26/2017 at 1:40 PM, JPops said:

 

We do have the same group of people who keep bringing up the same opinions over and over. 

I'm curious...

After the influx of new users (and old lurkers) all coming here recently and sharing their not so positive opinions/experiences,are you STILL sticking with "it's just the same group of people who keep bringing up the same opinions over and over"?

 

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22 minutes ago, thatdudescott said:

I'm curious...

After the influx of new users (and old lurkers) all coming here recently and sharing their not so positive opinions/experiences,are you STILL sticking with "it's just the same group of people who keep bringing up the same opinions over and over"?

 

I didn't not say it was the same group of people I said we have a group of people who bring up the same points multiple times. I still think the grab is alright. I played yesterday, people tired to fight me and they lost only reason why someone escaped on me was because my interactions got locked up and I could not get the prompt to tip the boat or do anything until I got hit again. Sure I get that can be frustrating. It's a bug, when confronted with a bug people will understandibly be upset. My point then and it is now is the grab is fine. Could it be looked at? Sure, but it's not as dire as some are making it out to be. I never said there were not bugs. Melee is wonky I've said that a million times and getting locked up happens too. I can get that. I don't really use melee a very large percentage of my kills are grab based but I also kill with the weapon but it is inconsistent. I decided to answer since you asked but I exited the conversation because those who disagree are not going to agree. So everyone said their piece and we parted ways on the discussion no need to bring it up again. 

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26 minutes ago, JPops said:

I didn't not say it was the same group of people

I literally quoted you saying the same group of people. 

I'm not trying to drag you back into anything,or start an argument about grab nerfs. I just thought that given how things have been around here lately,it was funny to go back and read that it's only the same group of people with these opinions.

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Screenshot_11---Copy.thumb.jpg.3cd6a7b95356726d59d8fbf0f1bf399f.jpg

There goes Nerfed Jason, a shadow of his former self, walking into the sunset with the swing of the hip while the circle jerk gang gives chase. :D

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2 hours ago, thatdudescott said:

I literally quoted you saying the same group of people. 

I'm not trying to drag you back into anything,or start an argument about grab nerfs. I just thought that given how things have been around here lately,it was funny to go back and read that it's only the same group of people with these opinions.

It's any sane person who wants Jason to be top dog and be a menacing threat. Outside of bugs and team killing, the game was pretty great at first. You could escape with teamwork and a bit of sacrifice. For SOME reason this is a terrible thing in an asymmetrical survival horror game based on the 80s most dangerous undead killer. Thus the safe space that is Crystal Lake was created, so that Jason even in his undead zombie form, can be teased and mocked and murdered again by counselors. That's what anyone who gave a shit about F13 wanted out the game, right? 

Is it any surprise that the state of the game royally pisses me off? Especially after defending them during the horrible glitch filled server exploding start of it all. 

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7 minutes ago, StallonSilver said:

Screenshot_11---Copy.thumb.jpg.3cd6a7b95356726d59d8fbf0f1bf399f.jpg

There goes Nerfed Jason, a shadow of his former self, walking into the sunset with the swing of the hip while the circle jerk gang gives chase. :D

Damn,he's not even going to try and get his mother's sweater back. 

You know it's rough out there when Jason tosses you the keys to the camp and asks you to lock up when you're done.

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3 hours ago, JPops said:

I didn't not say it was the same group of people I said we have a group of people who bring up the same points multiple times. I still think the grab is alright. I played yesterday, people tired to fight me and they lost only reason why someone escaped on me was because my interactions got locked up and I could not get the prompt to tip the boat or do anything until I got hit again. Sure I get that can be frustrating. It's a bug, when confronted with a bug people will understandibly be upset. My point then and it is now is the grab is fine. Could it be looked at? Sure, but it's not as dire as some are making it out to be. I never said there were not bugs. Melee is wonky I've said that a million times and getting locked up happens too. I can get that. I don't really use melee a very large percentage of my kills are grab based but I also kill with the weapon but it is inconsistent. I decided to answer since you asked but I exited the conversation because those who disagree are not going to agree. So everyone said their piece and we parted ways on the discussion no need to bring it up again. 

Again - Grab most definitely isn't fine. Might seem so in Quickmatch where you have a lot of leeway as Jason because the counselors are slow at getting anything done (if they do anything at all). But it's far from "fine" in matches where you have to play as mistake-free as possible, like in a Private Lobby full of veteran players. When you have to make a shift grab COUNT because the counselors actually know how to play - it's far from fine.

Getting 8/8 in Quickmatch isn't an indicator that things are fine. It's an indicator that the average counselor is fucking terrible and useless on their own. I'm actually amazed at how easy it is to currently isolate and kill every counselor, meanwhile they manage to get gas OR battery done on 1 car, at best. They don't even bother with the phone 90% of the time.

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2 hours ago, AldermachXI said:

Again - Grab most definitely isn't fine. Might seem so in Quickmatch where you have a lot of leeway as Jason because the counselors are slow at getting anything done (if they do anything at all). But it's far from "fine" in matches where you have to play as mistake-free as possible, like in a Private Lobby full of veteran players. When you have to make a shift grab COUNT because the counselors actually know how to play - it's far from fine.

Getting 8/8 in Quickmatch isn't an indicator that things are fine. It's an indicator that the average counselor is fucking terrible and useless on their own. I'm actually amazed at how easy it is to currently isolate and kill every counselor, meanwhile they manage to get gas OR battery done on 1 car, at best. They don't even bother with the phone 90% of the time.

If someone says the grab is fine right now, they are either delusional or just white knighting for Gun. It’s FAR from fine. Jason should NEVER whiff a grab. EVER. And that’s all that happens now. 

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2 minutes ago, Charlie Chainsaw said:

If someone says the grab is fine right now, they are either delusional or just white knighting for Gun. It’s FAR from fine. Jason should NEVER whiff a grab. EVER. And that’s all that happens now. 

Yeah its completely unreasonable that I can't grab a counselor across the map. Like wtf Gun, the game isn't playing itself yet.

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Just now, Jawbone said:

Yeah its completely unreasonable that I can't grab a counselor across the map. Like wtf Gun, the game isn't playing itself yet.

Clearly that’s not what I’m talking about. Or what the issue is right now. 

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5 minutes ago, Charlie Chainsaw said:

Clearly that’s not what I’m talking about. Or what the issue is right now. 

Is the issue a bunch of people complaining about missing grabs and linking "video evidence" then recanting their original statements. We had that issue resolved already.

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6 minutes ago, Jawbone said:

Is the issue a bunch of people complaining about missing grabs and linking "video evidence" then recanting their original statements. We had that issue resolved already.

When you get a chance, post some of your recent matches as Jason in their entirety. Thanks. :)

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4 minutes ago, bewareofbears said:

When you get a chance, post some of your recent matches as Jason in their entirety. Thanks. :)

Should I record only 300-400 ping games like everyone else or only sub 100?

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3 hours ago, AldermachXI said:

Again - Grab most definitely isn't fine. Might seem so in Quickmatch where you have a lot of leeway as Jason because the counselors are slow at getting anything done (if they do anything at all). But it's far from "fine" in matches where you have to play as mistake-free as possible, like in a Private Lobby full of veteran players. When you have to make a shift grab COUNT because the counselors actually know how to play - it's far from fine.

Getting 8/8 in Quickmatch isn't an indicator that things are fine. It's an indicator that the average counselor is fucking terrible and useless on their own. I'm actually amazed at how easy it is to currently isolate and kill every counselor, meanwhile they manage to get gas OR battery done on 1 car, at best. They don't even bother with the phone 90% of the time.

Yep agree 100%. Just played nothing but Quickmatch all day today because my regular group takes a break on Sundays. Every time I got Jason I cleaned house and got 8/8. I've been Jason 5 times today. I got 8/8 because a lot of QM players are newbies who just bought the game. A lot of them made stupid mistakes, didn't know what they doing and certainly didn't juke me which allowed me to get some pretty decent shift grabs.

Playing against my regular group? I'm lucky to get 4 or 5 wins. Usually it's 2 or 3 at most. Very very rarely do I clean house with my group.

I'm not advocating bringing the force grab back but the god damn cone needs adjusting...or something. It seems the grabbing is worse and most difficult when someone is slightly to your left. But I've also missed grabs when the counselor is literally right in front of me.

I'm tired of having this argument with people who keep saying it is fine. It is NOT fine. It is broken. Plain and simple. When you can't grab a counselor who is right in front of you practically touching Jason the grab is broken.

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57 minutes ago, Charlie Chainsaw said:

If someone says the grab is fine right now, they are either delusional or just white knighting for Gun. It’s FAR from fine. Jason should NEVER whiff a grab. EVER. And that’s all that happens now. 

wtf..

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1 hour ago, Aaron said:

wtf..

I believe he's saying if Jason is clearly within grab range the grab should not whiff, yet it most certainly does and quite often. 

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The problem is that the strategies of counselors before the last patch had caught up to Jason.  A room full of experienced players was about a 50/50 split as far as Jason getting 8/8 kills or any number of people escaping.  Counselors had figured out tanking Jason traps using the thick skinned perk combined with the medic and hypochondriac perks is the easiest way to escape.  Take down Jason's defenses early and let the high repair charecters go to work.  This is the strategy my friends and I used on each other and like I said about 5 out of 10 matches we would be able to get about 1-3 counselors out.  Jason's traps were no longer dangerous they were basically speed bumps.  However, experienced Jason players would still get sufficient kills because of how over powered Jason was.  Counselors were also crowding around Jason chain stunning him with everything they could to allow the car to be started or the cops to be called.  The playing field had become balanced and then this last patch just pushed it in favor of the counselors by a long shot.  

Now that I have had a solid month of playing with this patch I can say without a doubt the biggest problem is the grab nerf.  I know some people are going to say the grab is fine and the "Vader grab" was unfair and needed to be nerfed, I know, but you're wrong.  Most of the matches I play in random lobbies now end one of two ways the time of the match runs out or Jason quits, usually after the cops have been called and a car gets started in the first five minutes.  Matches timing out before this patch were rare the reasons it's happening so much is because Jason can't get his kills in a timely matter.  Jason needs to kill a counselor every 2 minutes and 50 seconds to get 8 (I'm counting Tommy since he's called in pretty much every match) kills and that would put the 8th kill at the 20min mark when the match ends.  I record a lot of my game footage and before this patch my avenger Jason round was between 9-13 minutes. Now 15 plus and if I'm up against one or two experienced counselors a time out is a legit threat.  Jason's old grab was what kept him on schedule for a lack of better terms, I have played several matches where counselors just run right past Jason straight through his grab, those counselors should be dead.  Instead however they go on to survive for an extra 3-5 minutes sometimes longer and those minutes add up especially when there are 7 more kills to chalk up.  Being able to effectively shift grab was how you got experienced counselors before this patch, when they added the no Jason music when shifting it was one of the best adds they made because now there was no warning for the vets to start zig zagging.  Effective shift grabbing has turned more into lucky shift grabbing, too many times while playing as a counselor Jason shifted right to me and was not able to grab me.  So much so that Jason's red arrow on my mini map completely covered my arrow.  So basically Jason was on top of me but couldn't grab me and I just ran away and would go on living usually the rest of the match.  The grab nerf has bought the counselors time, a lot of it and not to just time Jason out but to organize, strategize and basically mess Jason's world up.  You combine this with the trap nerf and all the other things too aid the counselors and you get the game in the state it's in now.

I know people are going to say "I still get my kills" and "I don't get timed out as Jason" that's fine I can still clear rooms in a timely manner as well but the reality is it's mostly against newbies and people who are just messing around.  Against good players who know what they're doing it's going to be a bad day for Jason.  

I'm going to offer up some solutions to which I'm sure some will agree and some will hate but I don't like to point out what I see as a flaw without offering a solution.  First Jason needs to be reset to how he played at launch he was damn near perfect at launch "Vader grab" and all.  I've played this game almost everyday since launch and I can honestly say the "Vader grab" wasn't as much of a problem as people made it out to be.  It was something that was out there and people just used it as an excuse for how they died, you were in the boat it got tipped and Jason drowned you, it was the "Vader grab", you were running down the road the car came by and ran you over, it was the "Vader grab", you tried to go toe to toe with Jason and he crushed your face, it was the "Vader grab".  Most of the time Jason snatched up a counselor was fair and you got what was coming to you.  

Second the hypochondriac and medic perk need to be removed from the game and what ever the perk that lets you start with a pocket knife all three need to go, give everyone 3000 free cp and delete those perks.  Starting with these items is too significant a boost for counselors.  I played a match on the Crystal Lake map where a friend of mine who runs hypochondriac and medic charged both healing sprays you find in the bathroom for me and then found another in a near by cabin.  So within the first couple of mins of the match starting the two of us had 8 healing sprays between us.  If you play this game and don't see how that's a problem then you haven't played enough or there's no convincing you those perks are a problem.  I shouldn't have to explain why starting with a pocket knife is too much.

Third the item count on all maps needs to go down including weapons.  Tommy's pocket knife needs to be taken away as does his healing spay there should only be four pocket knives on every map and five healing sprays that's it.  There should be two shotguns, one on the map and the one Tommy brings that's it.  The same goes for the rest of the weapons on the map, every cabin has 2-6 (maybe more) weapons in them right now depending on if it's a small or large cabin, that needs to stop there has to be a number placed on how many wrenches, baseball bats and so on appear on each map.  It needs to be low enough to the point where when you find a weapon you take it and hold on to that thing like it was your first born.  There should be cabins that are empty and have nothing in them, no weapons, no car parts, nothing.  This would help with a number of things people wouldn't be so eager to attack Jason knowing how scarce weapons could potentially be and it would make killing Jason more difficult as again don't know how many weapons are still out there.

Fourth Jason's traps need to become a skill check game or wheel game which every you prefer.  With composure being the stat that determines the ease in which you can escape or disarm the trap.  The trap should deal 50% damage when you step in it and every time you miss a skill check 20% more damage, you mess up three times you die in the trap.  If Jason shows up and hits you or throws a throwing knife at you it should knock you out of the trap because if it didn't that would just be some bull.  However, Jason should be able to just grab you out of the trap as well.  While a counselor is stuck in one of these traps whatever win con the trap is protecting should be disabled and cannot be interacted with until the counselor is free or dead.  If you go to disarm the trap same thing skill check but I'd be more strict about this you mess up twice your pocket knife breaks and it's gone, wasted.  There would need to be new sound effect added to alert Jason you are messing with his traps if you miss a skill check, but if you can do it without messing up you're good too go and Jason in none the wiser.  Also the icons on Jason's map need to be white which is the color the phone and power boxes appear as where the cars and the boat are red.  Since Jason's traps appear red on the map it can be difficult to tell what traps are set off when the traps are placed on the cars.  The phone is easy because it's a different color but you really have to look when they're on the cars so just make all the icons white.  Also add a radio tower icon to Jason's map to show where the Tommy house is so if he wants to take Tommy out of the game he can, I'm kinda surprised that's not already a thing.  

And lastly counselors who are crippled should not be able to jump through windows or set bear traps.  Basically take the suicide option away, there have already been a couple of changes to combat trolls in this game this falls in line with those.  The people who troll Jason and know they're about to die find a window in a back corner of a cabin and just start spamming the window.  Once you're crippled you can't do anything but walk around until you find a healing spray or someone finds you and heals you.  You should still be able to open doors that aren't locked, make repairs, pick up weapons and so on but no bear traps (unless it was already set) and no windows.  This just helps with trolls and people who run thicked skin and try and time Jason out by spamming windows (cheap tactic).

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9 hours ago, Jawbone said:

Yeah its completely unreasonable that I can't grab a counselor across the map. Like wtf Gun, the game isn't playing itself yet.

No, but it is completely unreasonable that he can't grab someone rubbing against his crotch. Like wtf Gun, the game doesn't need actual skill anymore. 

9 hours ago, bewareofbears said:

When you get a chance, post some of your recent matches as Jason in their entirety. Thanks. :)

He can't, he's the type of person that spends 99% of their games doing jack shit and 'trolling' Jason, then quits the second he gets set as the big boi himself. 

(Sorry about the double post, I'm on mobile) 

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I mostly blame myself instead of technical or mechanical malfunctions in general since i fucking hate our current generation of whiny and bitchy brats and manchildren. But in this specific case of our beloved game, yes there are some clear faults within the game code AKA bugs and glitches, but skill still plays a huge role despite the game's unpolished state. I find myself doing from good to amazingly when playing as Jason and i can't blame any of my shitty matches on others except that one where i got stuck in the map when trying to interact with a window.

But a game of this genre should make the supposedly superior ''villain'' a bit more intimidating and effective in the art of murder than he's right now, i'm a latecomer, but i've heard it numerous times that Jason used to be tougher and more effective killer in the past before getting nerfed 'cause some bitches whined and cried about never winning.

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5 hours ago, Jawbone said:

Should I record only 300-400 ping games like everyone else or only sub 100?

Whatever works for you.

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Prepatch:

Honeslty, I didn't even care about the so called "vader-grab". Sometimes when I was grabed as counselor I just thought like "what?! Damn.. Well, can't wait till I'm Jason, then you're dead!" Still we managed to escape pretty frequently. It was hard and took some work, but still. Killing Jason? That was hard! Mostly we failed, but when we succeeded? It was great!

Normally we also had to wait very many rounds before we got a chance to play as Jason. When we did, it was a blast! Killing counselors, tormenting them, scaring the shit out of them with a perfect shiftgrab. Man, that was fun! I felt rewarded for the hours of waiting in lobbies and sucking it out as a counselor for tewnty rounds in a row...

Postpatch:

Jason is still fun, don't get me wrong, but it's not as rewarding. Now we have melee problems, a perfect grabshift is purely luck, grab is inconsistent, too many pocketknives and hairsprays, stamina regenarates too quickly... and the traps are also a bit inconsistent

I don't mean that I need to kill everyone everytime, just that after the waiting, being Jason should not be a chore. Yeah, still when playing against a lobby of newbies and only 1 ot 2 seasoned players, I still get everyone most of the time. But with these problems, playing against good players, it's a chore. A frustrating chore. To get a 6/8 demands atleast a little luck, not to mention 8/8...

I also think about the newer players. It's not fun when you have no chance of killing anyone. Yeah, they definitely should get a little better, but it's rather difficult to practice. But making them feel like shit run over twice will not dedicate to a healthy playerbase.

My ideas for making Jason more fun again (some are not mine, but they are good so I'll list them here):

- Widen Jason's grabcone. To the front, sides, above and below

- Widen Jason's Melee. Same thing as grab

- Cut down Pocket Knives (max three + Tommy)

- Remove extra Stamina and extra Hairspray -perks (so you dont have to touch stamina regen) or cutdown stamina regen and the number of hairsprays on map

- Extra XP for using pocketknife on trap

- Return trap-placement as before patch

Other ideas that should also be considered:

- Jason should be able to instakill anyone teabagging him

- Jason should have an instant kill sequence if he gets to a counselor who is still inside his trap.

 

Like I said, this game is all about Jason, and having fun as Jason! You may agree or dissagree, and these are only my opinions and I stand behind them 100%

 

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