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One of the few frustrations I have with this game is the randomness of the perk system. I have 425 hours in the game at the moment (and that was taking off most of August and September) yet there are still perks for which I don't have good (orange or red) versions. I'd love to see a buyable perk system. Perhaps something like 1000 CP for White, then 5k/10k/25k/50k for Blue/Yellow/Orange/Red. Just having the ability to work toward something would be nice. Keep the slot machine option at the same time and the player would have to decide to save up to buy the perk they want or to risk it and spin the wheel. Maybe even make it so that the best versions of the perks can only come through the random chance, so you could get an epic with associated penalty stat but the version with no penalty stat could only be obtained randomly.

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9 minutes ago, El Jefe said:

One of the few frustrations I have with this game is the randomness of the perk system. I have 425 hours in the game at the moment (and that was taking off most of August and September) yet there are still perks for which I don't have good (orange or red) versions. I'd love to see a buyable perk system. Perhaps something like 1000 CP for White, then 5k/10k/25k/50k for Blue/Yellow/Orange/Red. Just having the ability to work toward something would be nice. Keep the slot machine option at the same time and the player would have to decide to save up to buy the perk they want or to risk it and spin the wheel. Maybe even make it so that the best versions of the perks can only come through the random chance, so you could get an epic with associated penalty stat but the version with no penalty stat could only be obtained randomly.

And there you have it

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I don't really agree with this idea.

For starters, the perks of this game are pretty minor at this point. I won't say they weren't incredibly strong in the past, but they have taken substantial nerfs to the point where they don't have a major influence on the game. Or, at the very least, Jason has the tools to crush any counselor with impunity if they think their perks are going to save them somehow.

Rolling whites is annoying, but the game does reward several rare/uncommon on a frequent basis, and epics are supposed to be extremely difficult to get your hands on. Rarity is supposed to be what makes the rolls fun; they don't happen often, after all. Furthermore you can only get perks using CP, and thankfully Gun Media/IllFonic both do not believe in P2W.

I like perks the way they are. For the meta crunchers there are plenty of good picks like Thick Skinned for instance. Several perks give items no matter how crappy the quality of the perk is (e.g. Prepardness). Some are great for teamwork purposes or for being a loner. As for people who want to run themes for fun/immersion, they have all sorts of perks to help them achieve this goal.

At the end of the day, it'll come down primarily to your skill as a counselor to survive the night, not what perks you use. If you can just buy your power using CP, then it kills the purpose of the rolls. I would especially be against this idea if you can buy epic perks with it. At the same exact time, how do you price the tiers of perks? How do you set them in a way that doesn't make it so counselors can just buy the best perks from the get-go, even if they're not epic tier?

It creates a whole new can of worms; I don't think it's worth the trouble.

Edited by Trident77
Spelling errors, and I changed a few things to better explain my position.
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12 hours ago, #jasonlives said:

@Peter1970

Not if there's nothing to buy and you have 100k cp

50,000 cp would require playing more than 500 matches, all for just ONE epic perk. No way.

There perk system as it currently stands is mostly a waste of cp. I am level 101 and hate that I still mostly get poor or common perks. I already have either rare or epic perks of the same ones I roll poor perks for. So a total waste of hard earned cp.

It wouldn't be so bad if they took 100 cp for a poor perk up too 500 cp for an epic perk. But they take 500 cp for all perks and only give you back 100 cp for selling back a poor perk, which is what I mostly roll. Epic perks are extremely rare. They also ruined the grease monkey perk. I had 42% start time increase and that was reduce to 17%. 42% grease monkey was very useful now I have deselected it for something else, which is less useful.

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15 hours ago, Peter1970 said:

50,000 cp would require playing more than 500 matches, all for just ONE epic perk. No way.

There perk system as it currently stands is mostly a waste of cp. I am level 101 and hate that I still mostly get poor or common perks. I already have either rare or epic perks of the same ones I roll poor perks for. So a total waste of hard earned cp.

It wouldn't be so bad if they took 100 cp for a poor perk up too 500 cp for an epic perk. But they take 500 cp for all perks and only give you back 100 cp for selling back a poor perk, which is what I mostly roll. Epic perks are extremely rare. They also ruined the grease monkey perk. I had 42% start time increase and that was reduce to 17%. 42% grease monkey was very useful now I have deselected it for something else, which is less useful.

50k CP is 100 rolls, more with refunds, yes? You can very easily do 100 rolls and not get a single new perk you want. I have no serious hopes of ever getting Lightfoot to the level where it would make AJ sprint silently. I'd gladly spend tens of thousands of CP for it instead of throwing it away on rolls that I know will give me nothing.

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I d rather be able to customize the percentage of the perks i already have,of course I mean according to the rarity,not being able to turn a poor perk to epic.

For example,my first perk was Epic thick skinned which was +44% and -(something)%, after the nerf now it is on +18% and -2%.I have this since the first day the game was released,I am not going to sell it,obviously,and I really doubt that I will roll another epic thick skinned better than this one.What are the chances?

I 'd like to be able to max it out,for example,turn it to +19% and -1% with the cost of an x amount of cp,and with the y amount of cp,which of course would be more cp,I would be able to turn it to +20% and -0%,thus maxing it out.

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5 minutes ago, Shadow_Master said:

I d rather be able to customize the percentage of the perks i already have,of course i mean according to the rarity,not being able to make a poor to epic.For example,my first perk was Epic thick skinned which after the nerf is 18% and 2%.I have this since the day the game was released,i am not going to sell obviously,and i really doubt that i will roll another better epic thick skinned.I d like to be able to turn it to max the plus and bring down to zero the minus,with the cost of an x amount of cp.

I like your idea better.

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On 10/16/2017 at 0:52 AM, Trident77 said:

I don't really agree with this idea.

For starters, the perks of this game are pretty minor at this point. I won't say they weren't incredibly strong in the past, but they have taken substantial nerfs to the point where they don't have a major influence on the game. Or, at the very least, Jason has the tools to crush any counselor with impunity if they think their perks are going to save them somehow.

Rolling whites is annoying, but the game does reward several rare/uncommon on a frequent basis, and epics are supposed to be extremely difficult to get your hands on. Rarity is supposed to be what makes the rolls fun; they don't happen often, after all. Furthermore you can only get perks using CP, and thankfully Gun Media/IllFonic both do not believe in P2W.

I like perks the way they are. For the meta crunchers there are plenty of good picks like Thick Skinned for instance. Several perks give items no matter how crappy the quality of the perk is (e.g. Prepardness). Some are great for teamwork purposes or for being a loner. As for people who want to run themes for fun/immersion, they have all sorts of perks to help them achieve this goal.

At the end of the day, it'll come down primarily to your skill as a counselor to survive the night, not what perks you use. If you can just buy your power using CP, then it kills the purpose of the rolls. I would especially be against this idea if you can buy epic perks with it. At the same exact time, how do you price the tiers of perks? How do you set them in a way that doesn't make it so counselors can just buy the best perks from the get-go, even if they're not epic tier?

It creates a whole new can of worms; I don't think it's worth the trouble.

I find it interesting that you dismiss perks as meaningless yet suggest that being able to buy them would somehow unbalance the game. Regardless, I'm just suggesting that we have a way to work toward a perk we want instead of everything being random. It's a strange "reward" system because the more you play, the worse it gets. I have a dozen or more epic perks and the rest are orange except two or three that I haven't been lucky enough to get better versions. Because of that, I'm less likely to get something I want or will even be able to use than a player with much less time in the game. Worse, if I want something specific, I'm basically screwed. I'm currently running my "spoiler Tiffany" build, designed to set off traps on purpose and I'd love to have the "get out of traps faster" perk (I forget the name). I dropped 20-30k worth of CP and it didn't come up once, not even a white version. Sure, I got two more red swimming perks and a dozen useless listen-to-the-radio-get-stamina perks. I think out of that 20-30k, I got one perk upgrade I ended up keeping. Frankly, the system as-is is crap. Maybe my idea isn't the best, but I'd like something better than this.

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On 10/15/2017 at 6:54 PM, Peter1970 said:

You want us to need 50,000 CP for a epic perk? That's a really foolish idea.

 

On 10/15/2017 at 11:08 PM, #jasonlives said:

@Peter1970

Not if there's nothing to buy and you have 100k cp

50k was just a suggestion based on how much CP I've earned and what I've seen other high-end player stockpiling (like #jasonlives notes). Some people end up with a lot of CP because after a point it's not worth the time or effort to spend it. If both systems are used (a random and a buy) then the buy system needs to have a higher cost to keep the random system viable. Maybe a different amount would be better, but the point is more about being able to work towards something at all not how much it costs specifically.

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10 hours ago, Shadow_Master said:

I d rather be able to customize the percentage of the perks i already have,of course I mean according to the rarity,not being able to turn a poor perk to epic.

For example,my first perk was Epic thick skinned which was +44% and -(something)%, after the nerf now it is on +18% and -2%.I have this since the first day the game was released,I am not going to sell it,obviously,and I really doubt that I will roll another epic thick skinned better than this one.What are the chances?

I 'd like to be able to max it out,for example,turn it to +19% and -1% with the cost of an x amount of cp,and with the y amount of cp,which of course would be more cp,I would be able to turn it to +20% and -0%,thus maxing it out.

 

10 hours ago, Truth said:

I like your idea better.

I like it, too. If something like this were implemented, I still think you should be able to invest CP to bump rarity up as well, just at a slower/more expensive rate. 

Maybe it's just because I think random rewards are crap in general because somebody is going to end up on the bad side of luck.

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13 hours ago, El Jefe said:

I find it interesting that you dismiss perks as meaningless yet suggest that being able to buy them would somehow unbalance the game. Regardless, I'm just suggesting that we have a way to work toward a perk we want instead of everything being random. It's a strange "reward" system because the more you play, the worse it gets. I have a dozen or more epic perks and the rest are orange except two or three that I haven't been lucky enough to get better versions. Because of that, I'm less likely to get something I want or will even be able to use than a player with much less time in the game. Worse, if I want something specific, I'm basically screwed. I'm currently running my "spoiler Tiffany" build, designed to set off traps on purpose and I'd love to have the "get out of traps faster" perk (I forget the name). I dropped 20-30k worth of CP and it didn't come up once, not even a white version. Sure, I got two more red swimming perks and a dozen useless listen-to-the-radio-get-stamina perks. I think out of that 20-30k, I got one perk upgrade I ended up keeping. Frankly, the system as-is is crap. Maybe my idea isn't the best, but I'd like something better than this.

I didn't say they were meaningless, I said they were minor. As in they they give you a nice small boost, but they're not going to do much in the long term scheme of things when Jason finds you. Also, it's only your perception that you're getting worse perks because of the amount of better ones you have. I have yet to hear Gun Media/IllFonic declare the system's RNG regarding rolls are somehow influenced by certain factors.

Also, there's one critical flaw about the original system you proposed. You want the ability to purchase perks at guaranteed tiers, and that included the epic tier. But if you still don't get the actual perk you wanted (in this case the one where you escape traps faster), then you're at square one again. You'll keep rolling epic tiers that might end up being crappy ones.

As I mentioned before, how do you price the tiers fairly? If Gun Media/IllFonic announced you could buy any tier you wanted, people would have a very different idea of how that should be implemented. If they're too cheap, newer players get better starts from the get-go when they game is supposed to be punishingly difficult (unless you have a bad/inexperienced Jason ofc). If they're too expensive, say 50k CP expensive, you could end up rolling an epic Heavy Sleeper perk, which would basically be a waste of countless hours spent playing the game. There will be no happy medium in this category.

Finally, the basis of this game is its overall difficulty. The counselors have basically nothing on them unless you use a perk (that you have to earn the hard way: rolls). They're up against a supernatural terror who can crush people regardless of their perks. If you added what is essentially a P2W system minus using real life money, it undermines the spirit of what this game is trying to accomplish. I personally want a Prepardness perk, but I also understand that, like everyone else, I'm gonna have to grind for it. How fair is it to everyone else who has stuck with the game for a long time that they had to earn their perks while a group of new players are suddenly walking around with full epic thick skinned/medic/whatever setups not too long after they purchased the game?

TL;DR It opens up a whole new can of worms if you could roll guaranteed tiers. People have rolled with the current system for this long; I don't see why Gun Media/IllFonic should bother changing this system up when they have more things to worry about ATM.

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10 hours ago, Trident77 said:

 Also, it's only your perception that you're getting worse perks because of the amount of better ones you have.

You misinterpreted me. I didn't mean that my rolls are actually worse, I meant that the system is worse the more you play for the exact reason you mention. I have more high level perks, so I'm less likely to get anything useful. Therefore, the random system is worse for me the more time I invest in the game.

I can see how my original post might've been vague on what I was suggesting we be able to buy, but I did actually mean the ability to buy specific perks. The cost was just a rough idea of the cost for the tier of rarity, not for buying a tier and then getting a random roll at that tier. Someone else suggested just being able to upgrade what you already rolled. (I just happened to agree that it would be better than the existing system.)

Just have to grind for it? I trust you're not suggesting I'm adverse to playing the game. I've put my time in and will continue to do so because I love the actual game-play. I'd just rather grind toward a specific goal than to grind and hope that maybe someday I'll get something I want. If it's random, then there's no guarantee that if I invest the next year in this game and/or 1 million CP that I'll get a particular perk I want. I could get another 2000 swimming perks. To be honest, I think the random idea was bad from the get go and should've originally been a system where you started with a few perks and then unlocked the rest as you leveled up just like you unlock counselors and Jasons. The CP should've been spent on upgrading your perks over time. But that's not what we got, so I felt I'd make a suggestion... you know, in the suggestion forum.

As for how much it would cost, I think Gun Media/IllFonic might have the kind of data they could use to determine what a good price would be. Sure, people will bitch. This is the internet. Someone will always bitch.

Calling it Pay to Win is ridiculous when, as you state, no real life money is involved. No, it would be Play to Win, which I think is a much better system than the Pray to Win that we have now. Spirit of the game? The spirit of the game is in the play, not the perks. The perks are just there to vary up counselor play so it doesn't get too same/same. Unless you think a slot machine that becomes more and more pointless the more you play is the spirit of the game? Once again you say that perks are meaningless with "They're up against a supernatural terror who can crush people regardless of their perks" and then turn around and suggest that being able to buy specific perks would somehow change this?

I heartily disagree that just because "people have rolled with the system for this long" means we shouldn't look at it for improvements. Ditto the idea that "Gun has better things to do with their time" as a reason to dismiss the idea. I don't believe my post asked for something like this to receive priority over anything else. I'm just suggesting that if/when they look at the perk system in the future, they consider the idea of buyable perks.

TL;DR  I disagree with just about everything you've said, so I think it unlikely we'll find a middle-ground here.

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I was a little afraid OP meant buy with money.

I would be fine with buying with CP. 50k for one seems to much though.

I also thinks the perk gui is a little time consuming. It would be nice to be able to roll a new perk even when your inventory is full. If you find a nice new perk you could select witch one to replace och just sell it right away. As it is now it takes forever to roll perks for say 20000 CP.

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Buying with money would be terrible, I agree.

Again, the 50k was really just me throwing a number out there. I'd suggest Gun/Ill look over their numbers of how much the average player earns in CP over a certain period of time and decide how long they want someone to spend to get an epic perk. I think it should be enough to make it something you have to work for but not so much that people don't think its worth it. (Of course, someone will always think it's too much or too little, but you can't really solve that.)

Yeah, even without arguing against randomness, the rolling mechanic interface is borked. Again, if you play for a while you'll ends up with only a couple of free slots which means you have to spin the wheel a couple of times and then sell before you do it again. Over and over. On top of that, each spin takes a silly amount of time. I could be wrong, but it seems to take longer if you spin from the main menu than if you do it from within a lobby.

It's really a separate topic, but I like the idea of the spin being independent of how many slots you have open. Sure, keeping the resulting perk would require a slot. That way, you could just spin and spin much more quickly, with it auto-refunding the appropriate amount of CP if you don't keep a perk.

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I love this idea. I'm level 47 and just yesterday got Marathon for the first time. I still haven't seen homebody. I would gladly save up to purchase perks I want, rather than gamble 500cp only to get the same crappy perk over and over and over again.

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I hate nearly all suggestions you are bringing up. When you have everything you want you will get the feeling that you have accomplished something and after having everything you will stop playing the game. 

Look at the system from Injustice 2 for instance. You pay a low amount of 500 cp and  have a high chance to get commons, uncommons and rares and if you pay 5.000 cp you will get a higher chance to get rares and epics but there is still a chance that you get uncommons and commons.

So starters won't be able to get the good stuff from the beginning, but if they keep their  they will wait and play without any perks for a maximum of 10 rounds. 

Personally i like the system as it is and i'am a starter. It can be frustrating but rolling an epic is so awesome. I play since one and  half week and got "My Dads a Cop" and an epic perk for spray. I'am happy.

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I just be happy to not randomly get the same crap over and over. I randomly got the swimming one in white, three times in a row. What a freaking waste..

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Just now, Punisher_2099 said:

I just be happy to not randomly get the same crap over and over. I randomly got the swimming one in white, three times in a row. What a freaking waste..

What about stacking them? You have 3 times the same bad one, you stack them and it gets a little better. You don't need to sell them piece by piece and it gets more useful. But it must be tge same perk.

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Just now, cwlunatic said:

What about stacking them? You have 3 times the same bad one, you stack them and it gets a little better. You don't need to sell them piece by piece and it gets more useful. But it must be tge same perk.

OOOOH an option to combine perks as another gamble type option, take a bunch of whites or whatever, gamble for a better color (use a little CP as well) and you get a chance to make it a color higher then the white.. small chance it could be epic.. very small.. but possible.

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5 minutes ago, Punisher_2099 said:

OOOOH an option to combine perks as another gamble type option, take a bunch of whites or whatever, gamble for a better color (use a little CP as well) and you get a chance to make it a color higher then the white.. small chance it could be epic.. very small.. but possible.

It's a possibility. But i think that you have to invest the same perks. Not the same colour. It would be too easy to create a good one (like a rare or epic) out of three shitty perks (like "stand by a radio to recover stamina faster"). 

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2 minutes ago, cwlunatic said:

It's a possibility. But i think that you have to invest the same perks. Not the same colour. It would be too easy to create a good one (like a rare or epic) out of three shitty perks (like "stand by a radio to recover stamina faster"). 

sorry.. meant to include that, has to be the same perk.

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On 10/16/2017 at 1:52 AM, Trident77 said:

I don't really agree with this idea.

For starters, the perks of this game are pretty minor at this point. I won't say they weren't incredibly strong in the past, but they have taken substantial nerfs to the point where they don't have a major influence on the game. Or, at the very least, Jason has the tools to crush any counselor with impunity if they think their perks are going to save them somehow.

Rolling whites is annoying, but the game does reward several rare/uncommon on a frequent basis, and epics are supposed to be extremely difficult to get your hands on. Rarity is supposed to be what makes the rolls fun; they don't happen often, after all. Furthermore you can only get perks using CP, and thankfully Gun Media/IllFonic both do not believe in P2W.

I like perks the way they are. For the meta crunchers there are plenty of good picks like Thick Skinned for instance. Several perks give items no matter how crappy the quality of the perk is (e.g. Prepardness). Some are great for teamwork purposes or for being a loner. As for people who want to run themes for fun/immersion, they have all sorts of perks to help them achieve this goal.

At the end of the day, it'll come down primarily to your skill as a counselor to survive the night, not what perks you use. If you can just buy your power using CP, then it kills the purpose of the rolls. I would especially be against this idea if you can buy epic perks with it. At the same exact time, how do you price the tiers of perks? How do you set them in a way that doesn't make it so counselors can just buy the best perks from the get-go, even if they're not epic tier?

It creates a whole new can of worms; I don't think it's worth the trouble.

I agree, I have the perfect amount of perks I need now. Yea I may enjoy having a Epic Grinder perk to start the car, but I am okay with My dads a cop...everyone's different.

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