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As you know, Team kill was completely removed from public matches in the recent update, you may thing this is a good thing for you and a bad thing for trolls, but in reality it is a good thing for trolls, now you will not be able to stop them!

My solution is here:

If someone kills a counselor he becomes a traitor for the entire team, he will be marked as a red dot in the map so the other counselors have the option to kill him and take revenge. This will give the player who killed him some extra XP. On the other hand for the teamkiller (traitor) he will lose all his XP just like before. What do you think?

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Nah, it's better just having TK gone entirely.  Makes the game much, much more enjoyable.  

 

The only people who will miss TK will be the trolls who were using it.

 

 

 

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I'm glad its gone to be honest, had too many occasions where people killed me for what felt like no reason, certainly had my head blown off a few times. I get why it may be useful to kill Jason helpers but generally I prefer no team killing.

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13 hours ago, AJLeatherman said:

Nah, it's better just having TK gone entirely.  Makes the game much, much more enjoyable.  

 

The only people who will miss TK will be the trolls who were using it.

 

 

 

Not a TKer but not a fan of the change. Me and friends have killed a lot of Jasons in public games. One of the most difficult thing was demasking Jason without hitting teammates. We were using machetes and I have accidentally "betrayed" my friends many times by missing jason and hitting one of them. Same thing when he grabs a counselor and you want to free the counselor, the counselor could take damage. Even if he did not die, he was injured and could get into limp state.

So removing TKing is a huge buff to counselors fighting Jason. I don't like this, it was already too easy (because Jason is supposed to be overpowered when in fact he was underpowered), now it is going to be easier.

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It helps, but I don't think it's a "huge" buff, since any decent Jason getting ganged up on is going to be hacking away, and inflicting his own weapon damage against whoever's in front of him.  If there's multiple counselors around Jason, and the only way they're getting seriously damaged is from their own friendly fire, than they're facing a novice Jason.  

Hacking & shifting should be enough for any experienced Jason to at least do major damage, if not completely disperse everybody, during a gang attack.

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15 hours ago, AJLeatherman said:

Nah, it's better just having TK gone entirely.  Makes the game much, much more enjoyable.  

 

The only people who will miss TK will be the trolls who were using it.

 

 

 

I just think that is a blanket statement that is untrue. There are plenty of players (myself included), who enjoyed that risk of friendly fire during intense encounters with Jason. You couldn't just blindly shoot in Jason's direction or swing wildly if he had a counselor in a choke hold to rescue them. You had to have a little bit of skill. Now, it's just random button mashing in Jason's immediate vicinity.

Also, there will always be exploiters and griefers in every online game, no matter how much it is patched out and reported. Before friendly fire was deleted, you had a way to retaliate against this sort of behavior, now you don't. Was it being exploited? Of course it was. There will always be bad apples that ruin it for everyone else. Just like there will be assholes now that hide items, run over other counselors in cars, and place traps to try to catch other counselors. This is an unfortunate reality of multiplayer gaming.

You, and many others, hated the fact that counselors could injure/kill other counselors. I, and many others, felt it added realism to a gritty game that was welcomed. I'm not saying that I am right and you are wrong. What I am saying is that you can't just declare that, "The only people who will miss TK will be the trolls who were using it.", because that statement is false.

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6 minutes ago, Rexfellis said:

Also, there will always be exploiters and griefers in every online game, no matter how much it is patched out and reported. Before friendly fire was deleted, you had a way to retaliate against this sort of behavior, now you don't.

You don't NEED to have a way to retaliate against friendly fire/TK now, because it doesn't exist!

Quote

 Just like there will be assholes now that hide items, run over other counselors in cars, and place traps to try to catch other counselors. This is an unfortunate reality of multiplayer gaming.

Every TK defender seems to use this argument, and I never understand the logic - it's like saying we shouldn't have laws against Crime A, because people will still commit Crime B.  TK was a huge, huge trolling issue in the game, on a nearly everyday basis.  Eliminating it will *drastically* cut back on the troll's easiest and most common method of trolling.  This is a good thing.  And they were able to do all of the behavior you describe above with or without TK in the game, so it's another strawman argument.

Every other troll method you describe there's ways to get around - trolls can't grab all the keys, gas, batteries, propellers, fuses, etc., hope in the car, and run me over.  If somebody hoards the keys, I'll fix the boat.  If they hide the fuse, I'll get out in the car, etc.  But if the game starts and another player immediately jumps in the same cabin I'm in and hacks me with the machete, I'm totally screwed and there's nothing I can do about it.

TK allowed for easy and rampant trolling, and brought very few positives.  

It's gone, and that's a good thing.

 

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41 minutes ago, AJLeatherman said:

You don't NEED to have a way to retaliate against friendly fire/TK now, because it doesn't exist!

Ok, we have different opinions, and I conceded that in my post. My point in retaliation was against griefing and exploiting, which will still exist in many forms on this, and every other, multiplayer game. It has been happening since the days of sitting on a couch with your buddies playing video games. Some, usually low-skilled, players will try to find any way to exploit things in a game to "win" easier. There is now no way to combat that type of childish behavior.

 

41 minutes ago, AJLeatherman said:

Every TK defender seems to use this argument, and I never understand the logic - it's like saying we shouldn't have laws against Crime A, because people will still commit Crime B.  TK was a huge, huge trolling issue in the game, on a nearly everyday basis.  Eliminating it will *drastically* cut back on the troll's easiest and most common method of trolling.  This is a good thing.  And they were able to do all of the behavior you describe above with or without TK in the game, so it's another strawman argument.

This is not true, I think there should be laws against it. The ability to kick the perpetrator, XP/CP/Perk/Level penalties, etc..That is what laws do...punish or "rehabilitate" the people that commit those crimes. Because, in real life, you can't just delete the ability to commit crime. (You are the one that brought real life into this). I realize people had the ability to do all of these things before the patch, but they will now be more prevalent, because trolls are going to find new ways to make other peoples' gaming experience miserable. A lot of people that are happy about friendly fire going away fail to realize that the trolls paid for this game too. And the way they have fun is to screw it up for everyone else. in my experience, they are not the "lazy kids" people seem to make them out to be. They test games constantly to find new exploits and glitches to use. Go watch some of the assholes on YouTube who have built entire channels around this kind of behavior if you don't believe me.

41 minutes ago, AJLeatherman said:

Every other troll method you describe there's ways to get around - trolls can't grab all the keys, gas, batteries, propellers, fuses, etc., hope in the car, and run me over.  If somebody hoards the keys, I'll fix the boat.  If they hide the fuse, I'll get out in the car, etc.  But if the game starts and another player immediately jumps in the same cabin I'm in and hacks me with the machete, I'm totally screwed and there's nothing I can do about it.

I am not saying there aren't ways around the trolling methods that will be utilized now. There were ways around counselors killing you as well. Shotgun blasts can be dodged, I've done it many times as a counselor and as Jason. If someone comes at you with a machete you can run or fight back. One melee slash isn't going to kill you. I just treated those assholes like a weaker version of Jason. Of course, there was always the unexpected shot in the back, and that was terrible, I agree. That is why I mentioned the punishments for this kind of behavior above.

The point of my original post: You said:

16 hours ago, AJLeatherman said:

The only people who will miss TK will be the trolls who were using it.

My point was that this is a blanket statement that is not true. Some of us who enjoy working as a team and playing the game correctly liked the aspect that there was some risk involved in attacking Jason when he had a fellow counselor in his grasp. Now, there is none. It takes away from some of the gritty realism of the game. Also, with the many ways to grief other players now (as well as the many that these assholes will find, make videos for, and exploit), there is no retaliation against it.

Trolls aren't the only players who wish that it was at least still an option in public games, because private games take longer to put together, and some of us are busy. You made a broad statement that encompassed everyone who plays fairly, and I said that the statement was false, and it is. This is not me against you, this is merely a difference of opinion. 

 

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On 29/08/2017 at 5:41 PM, AJLeatherman said:

You don't NEED to have a way to retaliate against friendly fire/TK now, because it doesn't exist!

Every TK defender seems to use this argument, and I never understand the logic - it's like saying we shouldn't have laws against Crime A, because people will still commit Crime B.  TK was a huge, huge trolling issue in the game, on a nearly everyday basis.  Eliminating it will *drastically* cut back on the troll's easiest and most common method of trolling.  This is a good thing.  And they were able to do all of the behavior you describe above with or without TK in the game, so it's another strawman argument.

Every other troll method you describe there's ways to get around - trolls can't grab all the keys, gas, batteries, propellers, fuses, etc., hope in the car, and run me over.  If somebody hoards the keys, I'll fix the boat.  If they hide the fuse, I'll get out in the car, etc.  But if the game starts and another player immediately jumps in the same cabin I'm in and hacks me with the machete, I'm totally screwed and there's nothing I can do about it.

TK allowed for easy and rampant trolling, and brought very few positives.  

It's gone, and that's a good thing.

 

I hate TKers and I want TK back because now bullying Jason is too easy, you can free other counselors from the grab without them taking damage, and use the shotgun. Before the patch, I was already thinking the Jason needed a buff. Removing TK is a counselor buff, so yeah, I'm against TK and this has nothing to do with realism/punishing cheaters/whatever.

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On 8/28/2017 at 6:30 PM, Trollskau said:

If someone kills a counselor he becomes a traitor for the entire team, he will be marked as a red dot in the map so the other counselors have the option to kill him and take revenge.

@GunMedia_Ben What about like a tk kill count in the lobby? that way if someone tks a lot everyone in the lobby will know and you could just leave if it's an issue. I feel like that's the best option right now.

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30 minutes ago, Truth said:

@GunMedia_Ben What about like a tk kill count in the lobby? that way if someone tks a lot everyone in the lobby will know and you could just leave if it's an issue. I feel like that's the best option right now.

The best solution IMO (that would need massive work and could not be implemented quickly) is to match TKers between them.
There are other games that match quitters between them, so they have a taste of what they do. It's based on the % of disconnections. Once their % goes under a threshold, they are able to play with everyone once again.

Now, let's say every player that has more than 0.5 teamkill / game is considered a TKer. A TKer will only be matched with other TKers. Everyone is happy. We are happy because we will play the game the way it was intended. The TKers are happy because they get to play the F13 mod for PUBG. If a TKer wants to get back to regular games, he stops killing for a few games.

We should not expect this as an immediate solution, because the devs have a lot to do to achieve it, but if this was a long term goal, it would be great.

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@AirMoons

Definitely a good idea, but like you said it would be harder to implement. In the long run, yes that's how it should be. But until then, to keep everyone happy, I feel a kill count shown in the lobby would be the easiest/quickest way to do it.

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or better yet, a combination of the lobby kill count and the red dot idea that @Trollskau mentioned.

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I'm glad TKing is gone but like some people said, I sorely miss the danger aspect to it. 

I was hoping they would have just implement a system where the team killer gets ejected from the game for every kill they make. If Jason grabs someone and you accidentally hit your partner to, it shouldn't count though. I don't think that would be hard to figure out.

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@AirMoons

How the hell was Jason under-powered??? As far as I have read and seen, it seems like only people who absolutely did not know how to play Jason keep bringing up how "under powered" he was...

He IS under powered NOW because the patch has messed with and downgraded him a lot... but before it, not so much.

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On ‎8‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 4:30 PM, Trollskau said:

As you know, Team kill was completely removed from public matches in the recent update, you may thing this is a good thing for you and a bad thing for trolls, but in reality it is a good thing for trolls, now you will not be able to stop them!

My solution is here:

If someone kills a counselor he becomes a traitor for the entire team, he will be marked as a red dot in the map so the other counselors have the option to kill him and take revenge. This will give the player who killed him some extra XP. On the other hand for the teamkiller (traitor) he will lose all his XP just like before. What do you think?

Very similar to my idea. Tho I suggested if you team kill you just lose the ability to pick up new weapons.

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On ‎8‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 5:02 PM, AJLeatherman said:

Nah, it's better just having TK gone entirely.  Makes the game much, much more enjoyable.  

 

The only people who will miss TK will be the trolls who were using it.

Note true...want proof that TK gone is a mistake? Invite me to a match. I will block you in a room with no windows, I will take your gas and run around with it and never put it in the car. I will help Jason and you can't hurt me....See my point? TK had a purpose. Everyone I've talked with hates they removed it. There were better solutions out there.

 

 

 

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11 hours ago, Archgamer said:

I'm glad TKing is gone but like some people said, I sorely miss the danger aspect to it. 

I was hoping they would have just implement a system where the team killer gets ejected from the game for every kill they make. If Jason grabs someone and you accidentally hit your partner to, it shouldn't count though. I don't think that would be hard to figure out.

Rainbow Six handles this very nicely. You can always team kill. You are allowed 1 team kill. If you kill a second person, you are booted from the game.

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Instead of everyone lobbying for bringing TK back and solutions for how to handle it properly why not think of ways to handle trolls without killing them? Like a push mechanic that makes them drop items, or hell have a fist fight. No matter if you have TK or not someone snitching to Jason will ALWAYS be able to do that if they are in a Private Chat... so you killing them does absolutely nothing to fix the issue other than give you a slight feeling of justice. You need to focus on how to stop trolls without killing.

A push mechanic that makes you drop items fixes every problem you mentioned except snitching...which as I stated will never be fixed because they can private chat or skype or text or message each other in any way. 

@GunMedia I know you want the danger of hurting/killing teammates and I'm for it with a good implemented system but don't bring it back because people are stating these issues that have either no solution or other possible solutions.

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56 minutes ago, PsychBam said:

Instead of everyone lobbying for bringing TK back and solutions for how to handle it properly why not think of ways to handle trolls without killing them? Like a push mechanic that makes them drop items, or hell have a fist fight. No matter if you have TK or not someone snitching to Jason will ALWAYS be able to do that if they are in a Private Chat... so you killing them does absolutely nothing to fix the issue other than give you a slight feeling of justice. You need to focus on how to stop trolls without killing.

A push mechanic that makes you drop items fixes every problem you mentioned except snitching...which as I stated will never be fixed because they can private chat or skype or text or message each other in any way. 

@GunMedia I know you want the danger of hurting/killing teammates and I'm for it with a good implemented system but don't bring it back because people are stating these issues that have either no solution or other possible solutions.

wtf, with that idea trolls will push you all the time for make your items drop, imagine how  annoying would it be

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Not only Im against TK, Im against of every mechanics that rewards counselors killing each other. If you want to survive, every second is valuable to waste time hunting other counselors. Any second that is not used in favour of the team or completing objectives makes it easier for Jason to wipe everyone out.

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1 hour ago, Barbara Ann said:

Not only Im against TK, Im against of every mechanics that rewards counselors killing each other. If you want to survive, every second is valuable to waste time hunting other counselors. Any second that is not used in favour of the team or completing objectives makes it easier for Jason to wipe everyone out.

my suggestion was not about hunting other counselors, it was about make people who defend himself from a traitor to not get punished by losing his xp, also DEMOTIVATE the trolls that want to TK and at the same time making it fun and realistic.

You wouldn't lose your time, you would keep playing normal and if you see in your radar a red dot, you better be careful with him, don't trust him.

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I can understand the reasoning behind removing TK. However, I have shot someone before for purposefully leading Jason to me (as they were obviously in a party and the person was walking with Jason to me.) It actually makes things a little easier on trolls.. as they can lead Jason to you without consequence and now follow you around maps just smacking the hell out of your character.

The difficulty with putting a red indicator on a traitor is people may confuse that with Jason's red indicator. Also, how would you solve the issue of someone being marked as a traitor if someone gets attacked but kills the traitor and then they become marked as traitor?

I think a vote to kick or just leaving it without TK is the easiest solution to trolls. Also a reporting system on PS4 or XB1 would be amazing.

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On 9/2/2017 at 2:28 PM, LizaDeMorte said:

The difficulty with putting a red indicator on a traitor is people may confuse that with Jason's red indicator. Also, how would you solve the issue of someone being marked as a traitor if someone gets attacked but kills the traitor and then they become marked as traitor?

If you see, the red dot of jason is different from other counselors, the jason's dot has a triangle and counselors are competely circles, but for avoid confusions the circle of the traitor can be another color for example purple, or whatever. For your second question, I think its a simple system I have seen in other games, the person who started the attack will get a warning and the victim has the right to kill him without punishment, that way people will be more careful to not hit someone, if it was an accident the victim simply can forgive his life and keep playing normal, maybe the color of the traitor in this stage would be yellow during 1 minutes, if he continues until kill the victim he will be officially marked as traitor.

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On 9/1/2017 at 11:44 AM, Trollskau said:

wtf, with that idea trolls will push you all the time for make your items drop, imagine how  annoying would it be

I'd rather be pushed than killed, just saying. 

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