Rexfellis

A question about Jason's superhuman abilities.

58 posts in this topic

OK, it has been mentioned many times that Pamela Vorhees and Roy Burns would not be plausible as a killer in this game as they are "normal humans". If you look at parts 2, 3, and 4, Jason was a "normal human" within the context of those movies. Yes, he was mentally challenged. Yes, he took tons of abuse and just kept coming. Yes, he seemed to be an unstoppable force of nature. But if you disregard any film after part 4, Jason was just a really strong, deranged psychopath with severe mommy issues that had been living in the woods for over a decade. I know that Part 9 tried to explain that he was brought back to life by Mommy via the Necronomicon and therefore was always superhuman. But those first 3 movies with our favorite slashing badass did not convey him as a supernatural being. He was just really pissed off! (And possibly on PCP¬†ūüėāūüėā) I mean, he was finally taken out by a 10 year old with a machete and a really jacked up haircut!

With that being said, Parts 2 and 3 Jason in the game have the same abilities as the other Jason, of course with different strengths and weaknesses.  Pamela was able to hang people up with arrows, and chunk them through windows. She was obviously not your typical middle aged woman. Roy took his fair share of abuse before he was finally dispatched, I mean hell, Reggie ran his ass over with a tractor and he just kept coming!

My point, (even though it's taken me forever to get here) is that both Pamela and Roy could theoretically fit into the mythos of this game if the proper strengths and weaknesses were attributed to them. I can completely understand if some do not like the idea and if the Devs decide that it would detract too much from the realism of the game. I just wanted to play Devil's Advocate for a minute and give my take on why they could possibly be included as killers in the future, especially with the smaller maps that have been announced.

Before anyone starts yelling at me about my opinion: I know that if you take the series as a whole, continuity problems aside, Jason died in that lake as a child and his mother resurrected him. Therefore, he was an undead entity throughout the series. As I said above, in the context of the actual films, Jason was not a zombie (or revenant, or ghoul, or whatever moniker you want to put on him) until part 6 when he was brought back to life by Tommy's stupid rage-induced mistake.

Well, if anyone actually takes the time to read this, I hope the conversation can remain civil. This is just a whacky idea thrown out by a lifelong fan of the movie series.

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1 minute ago, lHeartBreakerl said:

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

You have no idea what you've just done.

ūüėāūüėāūüėā

Actually, I was fully aware of the can of worms I was opening up even as I was typing that. But it is actually something I have been thinking about since release...actually since the Beta. I have seen opinions on both sides of the matter, so I thought I would make a post just to give my personal thoughts on the subject. I know that little disclaimer at the end is worthless, but hey, I gave it a shot!¬†ūüĎć

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6 minutes ago, Rexfellis said:

[lots of stuff that I promise I read]

4 minutes ago, lHeartBreakerl said:

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

You have no idea what you've just done.

2 minutes ago, Toddarino said:

Yeah I can't wait for this.

Just now, Charlie Chainsaw said:

Hold on. Let me go make some popcorn......

I think it's fun to read into the possibilities of what Jason is or isn't!

When I have more time, I'll contribute to your theorizing, in the meantime, it looks like the only thing you've really stirred up, so far, is people predicting you've stirred up something. 

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1 minute ago, NthnButAGoodTime said:

I think it's fun to read into the possibilities of what Jason is or isn't!

When I have more time, I'll contribute to your theorizing, in the meantime, it looks like the only thing you've really stirred up, so far, is people predicting you've stirred up something. 

They'll come. I promise :D

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14 minutes ago, Rexfellis said:

Jason was just a really strong, deranged psychopath with severe mommy issues that had been living in the woods for over a decade.

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I stand firmly in the belief if he didn't die before being hanged in part 3, he died then and there. You can clearly hear his neck snap. But that is totally beside the point you are making, which is not without merit.

Even if we say, like I do, part three and four are already dead, that still leaves us with 2. Sackman is definitely played as a live person. But, ignoring how they describe his resurrection, the entire series claims he is dead. He is a monster. He has always been a monster. Yes part 6 upped the monster factor by literally making him FrankenJason, but before that he was a monster, and a supernatural being.

Part 2 is the only one in which the damage he takes has any effect on him. He gets kicked in the nads and that stops him briefly. Plus he cries a bit when he gets hit with a chair, and whimpers too. I just watched the final chase, and part 2 is not in any way super powered. Since that Jason is in here as the unstoppable machine, Roy should be too I guess.

I think at this point, the only issue with Roy is he should be able to walk right through that sweater and beat up Tommy. Cause that is what Roy did. So, should Royson have a different kill mechanic?

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On a serious note, I think it's impossible to say what exactly he is. Given that they just looked for reasons to keep making movies, and warping the lore to fit. If we just took parts 1-4 as stand alone movies, as intended, Jason was just a messed up mongoloid with mommy issues.... Skip to part 9, and apparently Jason has been an evil demon all along.....

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18 minutes ago, Definitelynotjason said:

I stand firmly in the belief if he didn't die before being hanged in part 3, he died then and there. You can clearly hear his neck snap. But that is totally beside the point you are making, which is not without merit.

Even if we say, like I do, part three and four are already dead, that still leaves us with 2. Sackman is definitely played as a live person. But, ignoring how they describe his resurrection, the entire series claims he is dead. He is a monster. He has always been a monster. Yes part 6 upped the monster factor by literally making him FrankenJason, but before that he was a monster, and a supernatural being.

Part 2 is the only one in which the damage he takes has any effect on him. He gets kicked in the nads and that stops him briefly. Plus he cries a bit when he gets hit with a chair, and whimpers too. I just watched the final chase, and part 2 is not in any way super powered. Since that Jason is in here as the unstoppable machine, Roy should be too I guess.

I think at this point, the only issue with Roy is he should be able to walk right through that sweater and beat up Tommy. Cause that is what Roy did. So, should Royson have a different kill mechanic?

I see your point, you do hear a snap when he was hanged. What if that was just the board the rope is hanging from cracking from the weight? He did pull himself up and take the rope off of his neck in the very next scene, and there was no catalyst to bring him back from the dead. But, just for the sake of argument, let's say he died when he was hanged. There is still 90% of that movie where he was a human being. Taking that into account, roughly 1/3 of the Jasons in the game that are based on the movies are humans that can feel pain and can be killed. 

I personally feel that he didn't die until little Tommy hacked him up at the end of 4. That would make 1/2 of the Jasons in the game humans that can feel pain and can be killed. Using that rationale, Mrs. Vorhees and Roy would fit right in. Of course, this is all open to interpretation and if a person believes that part 9 retcons the series so that Pamela resurrected her drowned son, Jason has always been the boogeyman. But I think that part 9 is arguably the worst of the entire series with the Jason-slugs, possession, and ideas "borrowed" from The Evil Dead. Although Duke was a badass!

I can't say definitively that Roy and Pamela should be added to the game. It is an idea that I find interesting and that I would love to see explored more. But if they are never added, it won't take away from the fun I have playing this game.

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I really see no issues to having Pamela or Roy making their way into the game, especially Roy. Like some have mention Roy was Jason until he was not at the end, I really wouldn't see the harm in having at least his design in the game.  Pamela would be the tricky, because you would almost need to change the game design for her, being that she is smaller and more evenly matched with the campers. Pamela would almost be good as a stealth only player who also sabotages, she could be a good bonus character to run along side of Jason. With Roy the only thing I would change, is the way he would be Killed, you couldn't do the whole Pamela sweater thing, but something else would need to be put in its place for it to make sense.    

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1 minute ago, ryanmc564 said:

I really see no issues to having Pamela or Roy making their way into the game, especially Roy. Like some have mention Roy was Jason until he was not at the end, I really wouldn't see the harm in having at least his design in the game.  Pamela would be the tricky, because you would almost need to change the game design for her, being that she is smaller and more evenly matched with the campers. Pamela would almost be good as a stealth only player who also sabotages, she could be a good bonus character to run along side of Jason. With Roy the only thing I would change, is the way he would be Killed, you couldn't do the whole Pamela sweater thing, but something else would need to be put in its place for it to make sense.    

Could use a picture of his son instead of the sweater. 

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1 minute ago, Charlie Chainsaw said:

Could use a picture of his son instead of the sweater. 

There you go, that would work. good idea.

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15 minutes ago, Definitelynotjason said:

I think at this point, the only issue with Roy is he should be able to walk right through that sweater and beat up Tommy. Cause that is what Roy did. So, should Royson have a different kill mechanic?

One could argue that Roy was 'wearing the sweater' for Tommy in the climax. There are strong parallels in how that scene plays compared to the scene in the shack in Part 2

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18 minutes ago, NthnButAGoodTime said:

One could argue that Roy was 'wearing the sweater' for Tommy in the climax. There are strong parallels in how that scene plays compared to the scene in the shack in Part 2

wait, what?  Refresh my memory on when this occurred?  Because as I recall Tommy only encounter Roy at the end of the movie in the barn, but Tommy's hallucinations he was seeing was actually Jason, not Roy.   

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26 minutes ago, ryanmc564 said:

  Pamela would be the tricky, because you would almost need to change the game design for her, being that she is smaller and more evenly matched with the campers.  

She was strong enough to throw Brenda through a window and hang Bill up on a door with arrows. Think about the stories about how mothers have lifted cars off of their children in a burst of adrenaline and then consider how batshit crazy Pamela is. I think she could theoretically handle herself with a bunch of scared counselors. But you are correct, she would have to be a stealthier killer with enhanced sense, the ability to run, and stalk because she would of course have low defense, shift, and morph. And a bunch of throwing knives and traps just to balance her out.

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4 minutes ago, Rexfellis said:

She was strong enough to throw Brenda through a window and hang Bill up on a door with arrows. Think about the stories about how mothers have lifted cars off of their children in a burst of adrenaline and then consider how batshit crazy Pamela is. I think she could theoretically handle herself with a bunch of scared counselors. But you are correct, she would have to be a stealthier killer with enhanced sense and stalk. 

That's a good point.  Really, granted it was never mention or stated, but since that whole movie you only saw the killer through their eyes, you could almost say that Jason did the bulk of the killing and Pamela was there along side him.  Or maybe that's just crazy talk. 

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56 minutes ago, Definitelynotjason said:

I think at this point, the only issue with Roy is he should be able to walk right through that sweater and beat up Tommy. Cause that is what Roy did. So, should Royson have a different kill mechanic?

Yes his should be different. The sweater and shack shouldn't spawn at all when he is played. A lot of us came up with replacing the shack spawn with his ambulance in part V.

@Definitelynotjason One could argue that Jason simply regenerated from the snapped neck, or it didn't actually break his spine. He had some form of hunchback syndrome in part 3 so the way his neck would break could be different. Previously he regenerated from a machete chop through the shoulder and didn't die from that, so why not? I just attribute Part 4's death to sustaining too much damage. Prior to that he hadn't been chopped nearly so badly.

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On 8/10/2017 at 11:47 AM, ryanmc564 said:

That's a good point.  Really, granted it was never mention or stated, but since that whole movie you only saw the killer through their eyes, you could almost say that Jason did the bulk of the killing and Pamela was there along side him.  Or maybe that's just crazy talk. 

Not crazy talk, that too is a valid point. I have wondered about that. If Jason was born in 1946, he would have been in his 30s in 1979. It is perfectly feasible for him to have done most of the¬†killing in the first movie. This is exactly what I wanted when I made the topic, different ideas and theories about the timeline and the murders. Of course, I would love to see Pamela and Roy in the game because I am a completist. With that being said, I'm pretty sure I could live without the slug-monsters from part 9.¬†ūüėāūüėā

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1 hour ago, Definitelynotjason said:

I stand firmly in the belief if he didn't die before being hanged in part 3, he died then and there. You can clearly hear his neck snap.

 

44 minutes ago, Rexfellis said:

I see your point, you do hear a snap when he was hanged.

She just gave him a nice readjustment ;)

If Part 3 ended with the hanging,I would be more inclined to side with that being his true "death." 

But after he pulls himself off that rope,his neck is still stocky and he's able to keep his head up so I still go with his true death was IV.

And yes,I understand how silly this debate is because the only thing that can truly kill him and also bring him back is the box office take,BUT STILL :P

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5 minutes ago, Rexfellis said:

, I'm pretty sure I could live without the slug-monsters from part 9.¬†ūüėāūüėā

LOL, and lets never speak of the god awful part 9 slug monster again.

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38 minutes ago, NthnButAGoodTime said:

One could argue that Roy was 'wearing the sweater' for Tommy in the climax. There are strong parallels in how that scene plays compared to the scene in the shack in Part 2

Absolutely. Up until Tommy sees Royson at the end we have a mad running kung fu Tommy. As soon as he sees Roy he is stunned and can't move.

Maybe Jason could call in Roy when the counselors call in Tommy! Totally kidding about that.

Tommy is Jason's kryptonite, but Roy is Tommy's. Changing the kill conditions is the sticking point still.

With or without having to create a Pam or Reggie. what does everyone think the new kill conditions could be. I think the ones that impact the game the least would be preferred, though not required. Does it need a whole new map?

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8 minutes ago, VoorheesAJollyGoodFellow said:

Yes his should be different. The sweater and shack shouldn't spawn at all when he is played. A lot of us came up with replacing the shack spawn with his ambulance in part V.

The ambulance is a great idea. He did ambush Pam and Reggie at his ambulance, and Duke's dead body was in there. Maybe his wallet could be found in the ambulance with the picture of Joey in it. I know it is not exactly how it happened in the movie, but if the barn is the only place you can kill Roy/Jason you can bet your ass that I won't be going anywhere near that damn barn if I'm playing as Roy.

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5 minutes ago, thatdudescott said:

 

She just gave him a nice readjustment ;)

If Part 3 ended with the hanging,I would be more inclined to side with that being his true "death." 

But after he pulls himself off that rope,his neck is still stocky and he's able to keep his head up so I still go with his true death was IV.

And yes,I understand how silly this debate is because the only thing that can truly kill him and also bring him back is the box office take,BUT STILL :P

Ok, but, how many medical professionals declared him dead after the axe shot after the hanging? He got past the first responders, the paramedics and the coroner (though Axel was not really paying attention), as a dead body. The first sign of life was the breathing in the cold storage. The grope hand was just gravity.

Yep, absolutely silly conversation, but I like it nonetheless.

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