GunMedia_Ben

Upcoming Changes to Team Killing Changes for Next Patch

83 posts in this topic

Jason was getting spanked by groups of halfway competent counselors before this, and now melee/shotgun spam doesn't even have the limit of 'shit, I'd better not kill the guy I'm trying to save'?

This is going to make the 7/8s of the time one spends as not Jason more fun, at least. And the fear factor of the game is already a joke, so whatever.

 

If we're going to be seeing nerfs, we will also of course be seeing tested eliminations of all glitches/bugs...right? Because you wouldn't possibly have focused on this ridiculousness before 'sneak onto rocks in the water' or 'creep outside the map boundaries' or 'car magically turns upside down and destroys itself for no reason' or 'counselor trapping the phone to fuck with Jason causes phone box to stop working' or 'whack Jason right out of the map & into orbit' were all fixed...right? Bueller?... Bueller?... Bueller?

 

59 minutes ago, AJLeatherman said:

Good riddance - when something is used 99% for trolling purposes, it should be done away with.

Try thinking at least a few moves ahead. Adopting that approach gives trolls the power to dictate not only what game you have, but ultimately whether there's any game at all. 

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43 minutes ago, The.Dark.God said:

I'm not advocating against removing a way to troll, but there has to be a better way than removing a core game mechanic and opening up very obvious, very easy ways to make the situation worse.

A teamkiller might kill 1-2 people on average before other players end them.  An item griefer can keep the sole fuse and sole set of keys the whole match and ruin the game for 6 other players.  It's not a black/white situation and all things should be considered with a design change.

Yeah, that would prevent people from escaping...if he also was holding both gas cans, the battery, propeller, etc., and also managed to not get killed by Jason himself so the items would just drop by his body.  Luckily one player can not accomplish all of those things at once.

If some idiot wants to grab the fuse and hide in the cemetery for 10 minutes, it's annoying, but I'll just find another way to escape.  If he chases me around constantly whacking me with a machete, or blasts me with the shotgun, my game is over. So I'll take an item griefer over a TK every day of the week, and twice on Sundays.  

There is literally no situation where I have, or ever will, say "wow, this game would be a lot more fun if other counselors would randomly start killing each other..."  TK adds ZERO positives, and a crap-ton of negatives.  If people want to Mortal Kombat each other, just set up a private game and TK until your heart's content, and the rest of us can just play the game normally.

 

 

 

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It will be nice to see what the game plays like after this goes into effect. Gotta say, I think you guys nailed it though. With leaving the ability for the car, people wont just stand in front and block you from escaping. Looking forward to this. Maybe add host migration and fix the P.H.D in Murder achievement and its 100. 

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I think this is a good move. I would rather have team-killing in the game for the realism, but scumbags will abuse it. I never killed another player as a counselor and I never planned on doing so. I won't be missing it.

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Glad they took it out of Public matches and kept it in private. I think that was a good compromise. Let team killers play in their own private games.

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21 minutes ago, Dr. Lecter said:

 

Try thinking at least a few moves ahead. Adopting that approach gives trolls the power to dictate not only what game you have, but ultimately whether there's any game at all. 

They could be doing that right now, so it's not like eliminating TK is *creating* this problem.

TK is obviously a big problem - nobody can deny that.  So if you consider item griefing to be a big problem (I myself have never run into it), then good news - Gun eliminated one of the two problems!  That is obviously a good thing.

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I have no problem with this. It's unfortunate, but it solves a bigger problem. Big ups to the devs for also including all the right measures for this patch...still allowing TK in private, and addressing the XP loss for someone stepping in your trap, not that I ever had that happen myself.

Steps in the right direction. Keep it up.

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1 hour ago, AJLeatherman said:

They could be doing that right now, so it's not like eliminating TK is *creating* this problem.

TK is obviously a big problem - nobody can deny that.  So if you consider item griefing to be a big problem (I myself have never run into it), then good news - Gun eliminated one of the two problems!  That is obviously a good thing.

Except now it's the only way to affect the game instead of spending time hunting a target that may very well kill them first.

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I think this is a step in the right direction. Of course people that were teamkilling before may/will start to hide or keep important items as an alternative form of trolling, but my guess is that it won't feel as satisfying or entertaining for them as much as when they were killing other counselors. Some teamkillers like hunting others players, some like to kill out of the blue when their victim is expecting it the least and so on. Messing around with key items will probably bored them sooner or later and maybe some of them will move on.

As the saying goes, time will tell.

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13 minutes ago, makred78 said:

I think this is a step in the right direction. Of course people that were teamkilling before may/will start to hide or keep important items as an alternative form of trolling, but my guess is that it won't feel as satisfying or entertaining for them as much as when they were killing other counselors. Some teamkillers like hunting others players, some like to kill out of the blue when their victim is expecting it the least and so on. Messing around with key items will probably bored them sooner or later and maybe some of them will move on.

As the saying goes, time will tell.

It will be plenty satisfying for them to tell you they have the part you need and then remind you that nothing you can do can stop them from watching you die with no means to escape. You assume only team killers are going to make use of no team killing. Plenty of other griefers will make use of it. Likely the same candyasses complaining about being team killed. Now the retribution that they likely sucked at defending against is not there to stop them from being the obnoxious candyass they are.

You are in fantasyland if you think griefers lack resolve.

But don't worry, if the experiment fails it will only take months for them to fix it. Luckily for me, I have DOTA 2 and Shadows of War on the horizon. I've been playing far less frequently do to the kill dc's and Jason leavers. This will make playing counselor an exercise in tedium and only makes the desire to bother that much easier to ignore.

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Be sure to stay off the roads, the paths, and anywhere that a car can travel. Hopefully this won't turn into Grand Theft Auto: Crystal Lake.

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1 minute ago, Caliph said:

It will be plenty satisfying for them to tell you they have the part you need and then remind you that nothing you can do can stop them from watching you die with no means to escape. You assume only team killers are going to make use of no team killing. Plenty of other griefers will make use of it.

I know other griefers will make use of it, they already had the possibility to lock key items in some specific rooms or hide them in the middle of nowhere on the map, etc. Even if they're telling people that they have those items and there's nothing we can do to get them back, it's not that much of a difference. There's nothing really new there.

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22 minutes ago, makred78 said:

I know other griefers will make use of it, they already had the possibility to lock key items in some specific rooms or hide them in the middle of nowhere on the map, etc. Even if they're telling people that they have those items and there's nothing we can do to get them back, it's not that much of a difference. There's nothing really new there.

I have a hard time believing people are going to accept the griefer standing next to the fuse box telling them they have the fuse or next to the car with the battery, laughing, and everyone having the inability to do anything about it. Grief is going to become much more verbal in some scenarios, more visual in others. I'm sure each game that happens they'll remind themselves the TK they could have avoided or potentially turned the tables against was worse. Yeah, no.

Just wait til the party's that have their team blocked from the four seater start raging. They are the ones most likely to be griefed.

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5 hours ago, GunMedia_Ben said:

Hey all!

So, the biggest thing we’ve heard from our community with the game are issues pertaining to rampant team-killing that has unfortunately been abused by players on all platforms. While the mechanic’s intent is designed to promote life-or-death experiences into each and every game you play, the reality has turned into more of a Battle Royale scenario to a point our team feels a change needs to be made.

In the next patch; Public Games will no longer allow counselor team killing through weapons use against other counselor players. The shotgun, machete, and other assorted weapons will no longer have any effect on friendly players.

However; there remain a couple dangers. The biggest one is that the car will remain as-is. A car can and will be able to run you over and kill you. We decided on this as the alternative was abused during our beta where users would simply stand in front of the car, effectively blocking it from moving. The next consideration is that counselor-placed bear-traps will still cause damage to other counselors that walk over them, however a resulting death will no longer incur an XP Penalty. To that we say; pay attention to placed traps.

Our team believes that the ability to hurt other counselors is something that this game should have as it adds tension and requires players to make tough calls. However, we do not believe this should be a mechanic that is abused by players to the point where the vast majority of our current communications from fans are complaints of rampant/unwarranted team-killing/griefing/trolling. We will include this mechanic in private matches for now, with the hope of better options in the future.

 

Tl;dr

·       Public Matches - Team Killing is No Longer Possible

·       Public Matches - Cars Can Still Kill

·       Public Matches - Traps Still Can Hurt/Kill - no XP penalty Loss to Trap Placer

·       Private Matches - Team Killing Still Possible

·       Can’t Have Nice Things.

 

-Gun

Very welcome news. :) 

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I ran into a guy who blocked me in a room that had no window. He stood in the doorway  and refused to budge. I asked him to stop blocking the door in english,Spanish, and broken Mandarin.  I eventually started swinging at him with a bat. 

I'm against TKing in most situations, but what about one like described? Are you guys going to disable councilor  collision detection with each other so next time I encounter this I can pass through said asshole, or will I just have to stand there til Jason comes??

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31 minutes ago, Ethan said:

I ran into a guy who blocked me in a room that had no window. He stood in the doorway  and refused to budge. I asked him to stop blocking the door in english,Spanish, and broken Mandarin.  I eventually started swinging at him with a bat. 

I'm against TKing in most situations, but what about one like described? Are you guys going to disable councilor  collision detection with each other so next time I encounter this I can pass through said asshole, or will I just have to stand there til Jason comes??

That scenario will only be recognized as a problem 2+ months after TK is removed, and will eventually be patched out in 2019.

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Honestly, it would have been easier just to leave team killing and add back to the game the friendly fire option that you removed previously from lobbies.

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8 minutes ago, x OLd ScRatCh x said:

Honestly, it would have been easier just to leave team killing and add back to the game the friendly fire option that you removed previously from lobbies.

I have been saying that all day. A toggle for friendly fire would be the perfect fix. Some of us just do not have the time to fill a private game just to have that option. I think a choice in both public and private would be the best route to take. Of course, I didn't build a game that has sold almost 2 million copies, so I really don't have any say in it. I'm just really not looking forward to the next rash of people bitching about the new tactics the trolls have implemented. Because I know for a fact that this is not going to stop trolling. It's just going to change the nature of the beast.

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It's always such a weird thing to craft something you love, release it to the public, and see how they bend, twist, destroy it, hehehe...

 

I mean, the things people do with what you create can run both ends of the spectrum, from amazing to terrible. So, it goes both ways. It just always saddens me how public gaming gets so abused and how so many fantastic, realistic, player-choice/freedom ideas and game mechanics just struggle to work, due to jerks.

Then again, that speaks directly to society as well... ahhh, people... 

 

ANYWAY... good job, Gun Media. It sucks that decisions like this need to be made, but I think this handles it rather well.

With just a tiny bit of playing, I've met various groups of people who have invited me into private games, so all is not lost. Plus, while I like the freedom of team killing (and that the possibility existed), it really only serves its genre purpose via accidents, and not intentional killings. So, its place in this game was remote. I wouldn't really miss it, myself. However, I am glad it is remaining in private matches.

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I honestly didn't even know this was a problem. I don't think I've ever encountered a rampant team killer.

Still, this will at least buff the shotgun, since you can now use it while Jason is picking someone up. It is going to make it annoying when someone goes to steal your spot on the boat you put the propeller in (the only time I've ever intentionally teamkilled was when someone did exactly that. Bastard wanted a spot even though I put in the propeller, and helped find the gas for the other passenger.)

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Hmmm. I've only ever been team killed once since launch. I also got "team injured to a limp", but Jason saw what the guy did and killed him anyway; ignoring me. I had time to get get a health spray and escape at the police. Thanks for that instant karma J-man. I've never seen anybody run off and hide key items. What the hell planet are you all playing the game on anyway? :lol:

I would have preferred a toggle option in the match lobby for the host, but this will due if it helps the game for those suffering.

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11 minutes ago, Alkavian said:

Hmmm. I've only ever been team killed once since launch. I also got "team injured to a limp", but Jason saw what the guy did and killed him anyway; ignoring me. I had time to get get a health spray and escape at the police. Thanks for that instant karma J-man. I've never seen anybody run off and hide key items. What the hell planet are you all playing the game on anyway? :lol:

I would have preferred a toggle option in the match lobby for the host, but this will due if it helps the game for those suffering.

It happens quite often on ps4. Hell about an hour ago, I got hacked to death. Started, grabbed gas can. Guy popped out of cabin across road from me  and started swinging. I tried to make it to a hiding spot but he killed me In 3 swings. He was not provoked and it was a fresh lobby. 

He was perked to do more damage, which means he tks for fun.i didn't even get upset this time. I just joined a fresh match. I have had a few times where they swing and I just run to gun spawns and hope it's there.  Had a chad chase me swinging a wrench all the way from north boat spawn to packanack. I ran in grabbed gun and finished him. I've probably died to tks about 3 times, but killed about 10 in retaliation. 

Probably for the best it's being disabled, I'm just concerned with people blocking doors and vehicles. They already can hide items, so that's not something new.

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I only just done my first team kill yesterday. A Bugzy ran upto me with a bat and started swinging, hit me once so I ran to the next cabin and hid in a closet. He followed and tried to hit me through the closet so it was obvious what their intentions were. Jasons music starts, he gets killed. Someone calls the police.  I escape. Next match I changed to Bugzy myself and its at Higgins Haven. I spawn near the main house and sprint for the barn and find the shotgun. 1st person I see, not him. See someone is in the main house so go in and they're upstairs, its him. Blast to the head from point blank range just after searching a drawer. -1000 but it felt fucking great.

 

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13 hours ago, GunMedia_Ben said:

Hey all!

So, the biggest thing we’ve heard from our community with the game are issues pertaining to rampant team-killing that has unfortunately been abused by players on all platforms. While the mechanic’s intent is designed to promote life-or-death experiences into each and every game you play, the reality has turned into more of a Battle Royale scenario to a point our team feels a change needs to be made.

In the next patch; Public Games will no longer allow counselor team killing through weapons use against other counselor players. The shotgun, machete, and other assorted weapons will no longer have any effect on friendly players.

However; there remain a couple dangers. The biggest one is that the car will remain as-is. A car can and will be able to run you over and kill you. We decided on this as the alternative was abused during our beta where users would simply stand in front of the car, effectively blocking it from moving. The next consideration is that counselor-placed bear-traps will still cause damage to other counselors that walk over them, however a resulting death will no longer incur an XP Penalty. To that we say; pay attention to placed traps.

Our team believes that the ability to hurt other counselors is something that this game should have as it adds tension and requires players to make tough calls. However, we do not believe this should be a mechanic that is abused by players to the point where the vast majority of our current communications from fans are complaints of rampant/unwarranted team-killing/griefing/trolling. We will include this mechanic in private matches for now, with the hope of better options in the future.

 

Tl;dr

·       Public Matches - Team Killing is No Longer Possible

·       Public Matches - Cars Can Still Kill

·       Public Matches - Traps Still Can Hurt/Kill - no XP penalty Loss to Trap Placer

·       Private Matches - Team Killing Still Possible

·       Can’t Have Nice Things.

 

-Gun

This is wonderful. I have a dumb question. Any chance that you will fix the problem with migrating the host so when they leave the rest of us don't get kicked from the game? Lets see I have be able to get in to the game 1st and stay in before I can worry about some dumb kid trying to kill me. It seems the horse is before the cart. Out of every 10 games on PS4 I drop out about 3 games since the host left or was Jason and got pissed off and booted 7 of us. This also causes us ALL to loose all of our CP. Guess its not as important as we think it is. 

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