GunMedia_Ben

Upcoming Changes to Team Killing Changes for Next Patch

77 posts in this topic

Hey all!

So, the biggest thing we’ve heard from our community with the game are issues pertaining to rampant team-killing that has unfortunately been abused by players on all platforms. While the mechanic’s intent is designed to promote life-or-death experiences into each and every game you play, the reality has turned into more of a Battle Royale scenario to a point our team feels a change needs to be made.

In the next patch; Public Games will no longer allow counselor team killing through weapons use against other counselor players. The shotgun, machete, and other assorted weapons will no longer have any effect on friendly players.

However; there remain a couple dangers. The biggest one is that the car will remain as-is. A car can and will be able to run you over and kill you. We decided on this as the alternative was abused during our beta where users would simply stand in front of the car, effectively blocking it from moving. The next consideration is that counselor-placed bear-traps will still cause damage to other counselors that walk over them, however a resulting death will no longer incur an XP Penalty. To that we say; pay attention to placed traps.

Our team believes that the ability to hurt other counselors is something that this game should have as it adds tension and requires players to make tough calls. However, we do not believe this should be a mechanic that is abused by players to the point where the vast majority of our current communications from fans are complaints of rampant/unwarranted team-killing/griefing/trolling. We will include this mechanic in private matches for now, with the hope of better options in the future.

 

Tl;dr

·       Public Matches - Team Killing is No Longer Possible

·       Public Matches - Cars Can Still Kill

·       Public Matches - Traps Still Can Hurt/Kill - no XP penalty Loss to Trap Placer

·       Private Matches - Team Killing Still Possible

·       Can’t Have Nice Things.

 

-Gun

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THANK YOU SO MUCH!

Other than host migration, TK has been the biggest problem I've personally encountered in the game, and I'm glad to see it go.  The only people who will have a major problem with this are the trolls that were using TK just to aggravate other players.

Again, thank you to Gun for listening to the players.

Thiago Voorhees likes this

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Well once team killing is out trolls will hold onto the items, can't ask Jason for help so your screwed. Plus team killing glitchers from spots are gonna now be stopped. Well can't wait to see how this plays out when people can't get items due to people holding onto them along with glitches bragging about how they can't be killed by their teammates. 

more-popcorn.gif

NthnButAGoodTime and Daneasaur like this

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Yeah, that is definitely an awesome update. It was a Battle Royale last night when I played just one match, will be nice to only have one killer again.

bewareofbears likes this

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How do you plan on addressing players who might stay in one spot too long like fake idling or glitching or hold onto items to prevent others from using them?

Time limits/temporary invulnerability to pick up items after they auto drop might be the best bet.

And he's right.

Can't have nice things.

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It's unfortunate, but I understand why they feel like they need to do this. I try as much as possible to stick to private matches with people I know. So it probably won't affect me all that much.

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This is a great idea, however now if someone wants to troll the other players they will be able to hold on to the keys/propeller/fuse/gas/battery indefinitely with no other player being able to force them in any way to drop it, other than hope Jason finds them.  Trolls are gonna troll, so you know this is the next thing that will happen.

What's the solution to that?  "Fix" one problem and it causes another...

Daneasaur and NthnButAGoodTime like this

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16 minutes ago, Ghostboy20 said:

Well once team killing is out trolls will hold onto the items, can't ask Jason for help so your screwed. Plus team killing glitchers from spots are gonna now be stopped. Well can't wait to see how this plays out when people can't get items due to people holding onto them along with glitches bragging about how they can't be killed by their teammates. 

more-popcorn.gif

I'd love to say that I'll keep a log off anti-team-killing commenters and compare that to a running list of "trolls won't drop the battery" commenters and then compare the two, but I can assure you that I am exactly too lazy to do this.

Kashyyyk likes this

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This is great news. One less thing for the trolls to abuse.

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Just now, NthnButAGoodTime said:

I'd love to say that I'll keep a log off anti-team-killing commenters and compare that to a running list of "trolls won't drop the battery" commenters and then compare the two, but I can assure you that I am exactly too lazy to do this.

Well I don't see anything wrong with team killing tho I'm only a team killer to glitchers or team killers who are trying to kill others. I've had a few team killers who were trying to kill me and I manged to out run them or kill them and have them quit. Now I understand for some they get angry but for me it is what it is. People are out to get you angry, to get you upset and to see you react to them. So yeah now we are gonna see this come to pass where people are holding items and won't drop them. Can't kill them so your stuck trying to find another way to escape, better hope the troll didn't find the fuse lol 

I don't care if they take it away but I think there should be a limit, instead of team killing you should only injure people to a point and that's it. As for items having a time limit I say no to that, I think you should walk up to someone and be able to take the item. That would help but also you would see people chasing each other take items back and forth xD 

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I'm on a level in the 80's, so I've played the game a time or two, and I've literally NEVER had an instance where I saw trolls holding items.  I'm sure it's happened, but if I haven't seen it one single time in hundreds of games, it's not a rampant problem.  On the other hand, I've ran into people TKing for no reason multiple times every day I've played, so it's obviously the much, much, much, MUCH bigger problem.

Every previous topic on TK boiled down to the "advocates" (who likely enjoyed team killing for trolling purposes) bringing up these rare, "but what about when THIS thing happens?!?!" arguments, and ignoring that other 99.999999% of the time when it is just trolls using TK to troll/greif.

Good riddance - when something is used 99% for trolling purposes, it should be done away with.

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2 minutes ago, Ghostboy20 said:

Well I don't see anything wrong with team killing tho I'm only a team killer to glitchers or team killers who are trying to kill others. I've had a few team killers who were trying to kill me and I manged to out run them or kill them and have them quit. Now I understand for some they get angry but for me it is what it is. People are out to get you angry, to get you upset and to see you react to them. So yeah now we are gonna see this come to pass where people are holding items and won't drop them. Can't kill them so your stuck trying to find another way to escape, better hope the troll didn't find the fuse lol 

I don't care if they take it away but I think there should be a limit, instead of team killing you should only injure people to a point and that's it. As for items having a time limit I say no to that, I think you should walk up to someone and be able to take the item. That would help but also you would see people chasing each other take items back and forth xD 

Maybe they can make it so that you can hit them with a weapon and it won't cause them any damage, but it will force them to drop the item?  Unfortunately that wouldn't work with inventory items like the fuse and keys though. :(

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Just now, Vaderspupil said:

Maybe they can make it so that you can hit them with a weapon and it won't cause them any damage, but it will force them to drop the item?  Unfortunately that wouldn't work with inventory items like the fuse and keys though. :(

No matter what Gun does that would screw people over. If they added that trolls would then just hit you for the battery and run or the gas. Trolls will troll no matter what 

NthnButAGoodTime likes this

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Just now, AJLeatherman said:

I'm on a level in the 80's, so I've played the game a time or two, and I've literally NEVER had an instance where I saw trolls holding items.  I'm sure it's happened, but if I haven't seen it one single time in hundreds of games, it's not a rampant problem.  On the other hand, I've ran into people TKing for no reason multiple times every day I've played, so it's obviously the much, much, much, MUCH bigger problem.

Every previous topic on TK boiled down to the "advocates" (who likely enjoyed team killing for trolling purposes) bringing up these rare, "but what about when THIS thing happens?!?!" arguments, and ignoring that other 99.999999% of the time when it is just trolls using TK to troll/greif.

Good riddance - when something is used 99% for trolling purposes, it should be done away with.

But the trolls will immediately move on to that scenario that 99% of people aren't currently dealing with.  Because right now, hoarding an item isn't really a "thing" because people can kill someone who is holding the item.  When the troll's fun in being able to kill/injure is removed, they will be looking for new ways to mess with the game.

That's the shift that's happened already, people went from exploiting glitches to team killing.  Next will be team parts griefing or body blocking.

As will all things in game design, the overall consequences of each design change need to be considered before causing a cascade of worse results.

In this case, I'd suggest a possible solution would be making it impossible for a player to be crippled/killed by another player, but being hit causes the player to drop carried items.  Though, that opens up its own set of issues with people griefing you the whole way to objectives.  So... needs to be discussed and pros/cons weighed and a solution crafted.

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3 minutes ago, The.Dark.God said:

But the trolls will immediately move on to that scenario that 99% of people aren't currently dealing with.  Because right now, hoarding an item isn't really a "thing" because people can kill someone who is holding the item.  When the troll's fun in being able to kill/injure is removed, they will be looking for new ways to mess with the game.

That's the shift that's happened already, people went from exploiting glitches to team killing.  Next will be team parts griefing or body blocking.

As will all things in game design, the overall consequences of each design change need to be considered before causing a cascade of worse results.

In this case, I'd suggest a possible solution would be making it impossible for a player to be crippled/killed by another player, but being hit causes the player to drop carried items.  Though, that opens up its own set of issues with people griefing you the whole way to objectives.  So... needs to be discussed and pros/cons weighed and a solution crafted.

You don't keep one trolling method in the game just because trolls might use another.  If other trolling "trends" emerge, the devs can deal with those too, but TK currently exists, is rampant, and serves no significant positive towards gameplay, so removing it is a great move.

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I'd say the biggest issue isn't team killing, it's no host migration. Killing one person with a shot gun or hacking another to death with a machete is nothing in comparison to clicking 2 buttons and ending 7 people all at once. And they don't even get points....

HowAreYa likes this

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20 minutes ago, AJLeatherman said:

You don't keep one trolling method in the game just because trolls might use another.  If other trolling "trends" emerge, the devs can deal with those too, but TK currently exists, is rampant, and serves no significant positive towards gameplay, so removing it is a great move.

I'm not advocating against removing a way to troll, but there has to be a better way than removing a core game mechanic and opening up very obvious, very easy ways to make the situation worse.

A teamkiller might kill 1-2 people on average before other players end them.  An item griefer can keep the sole fuse and sole set of keys the whole match and ruin the game for 6 other players.  It's not a black/white situation and all things should be considered with a design change.

NthnButAGoodTime and Daneasaur like this

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It's a real shame it's come to this, but given the complaints, it seems the best of the two options for the time being. Can't have nice things, indeed.

I hope it remains a fixture in Private for the foreseeable future.

Alkavian likes this

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